What are the chances??

[roadbender]

I am thinking about buying a new 2019 ultra limited..I am still concerned with sumping issues even though i read the fix is in..If the experts will chime in..Are the sumping issues for sure fixed on the 2019's??

Peace and Prayers

[VDeuce]

If you read the "other" site, most will tell you it's solved.

The experts might disagree with that; it's why some are working on real fixes. The seal on the pump appears to help, just not certain it will be a complete fix. Time will tell. It also remains to be seen how it will help when displacement increases (larger bores, etc..).

The early '19s did not come with the new seal. Don't know exactly when they started in production, so there is a risk of getting an early '19 without the seal.

As for me, I have an '18 built to 120". It sumped once prior to my installation of the Feuling race series pump and cam plate. I have not been able to get it to sump since with about 8K on the clock since.

My advice is to listen to people with actual experience as opposed to the fanboys on the other site. Some appear to have a vested interest in saying everything is ok. I would be suspect of that.

[roadbender]

Good advice.     Thank you much...   I am a little confused on what a fanboy is but i am old...

Peace and Prayers

[PoorUB]

Good advice.     Thank you much...   I am a little confused on what a fanboy is but i am old...

Peace and Prayers

In this case a "fanboy" is someone that absolutely loves the M8 and ignores any faults it may have. In their mind it is simply the best engine HD ever built.

[hogsty]

How does one know if they have the new seal or not without tearing into the motor?

[HD/Wrench]

There is no way to know if you have the seal on the pump or not.

And being that Yes 19s are out most do not have enough miles on the to know .

The sumping is really a hit or miss deal , in some cases it will do it intermittently as well.  We built a 120 on a 18 it ran for 7500 ish miles and then sumped ??

Customer called me and explained what it was doing sluggish to rev getting hot lack of power .. I get it back here at the shop put it on the drum it is running just fine . I let it get hot do a few more pulls nothing .. I get it a bit hotter and just run the bike along at 65 mph and then it does it ??    And boy did it sump Let it idle and it recovered .. I figures since it was on the drum do a few more pulls  Nope doing just fine I bring the speed up to 85 and it just falls flat on its face . Started puking oil out the air cleaner   ..  HA HA I think back to the early TC issue  there  .

At the time the S&S pump was not out so a fueling pump and plate where installed  Now it does have more oil in the crank case then I would like . With that said it no longer suffers from the normal issues . 

Time will tell what HD does to " FIX" the issue not band aid it . as i have added the seal to a bike that was sumping and it did not solve that issue . Customer did not want to buy a new pump and plate .    We did end up adding a new pump and plate .  Some customers are harder to deal with than others 

[1workinman]

There is no way to know if you have the seal on the pump or not.

And being that Yes 19s are out most do not have enough miles on the to know .

The sumping is really a hit or miss deal , in some cases it will do it intermittently as well.  We built a 120 on a 18 it ran for 7500 ish miles and then sumped ??

Customer called me and explained what it was doing sluggish to rev getting hot lack of power .. I get it back here at the shop put it on the drum it is running just fine . I let it get hot do a few more pulls nothing .. I get it a bit hotter and just run the bike along at 65 mph and then it does it ??    And boy did it sump Let it idle and it recovered .. I figures since it was on the drum do a few more pulls  Nope doing just fine I bring the speed up to 85 and it just falls flat on its face . Started puking oil out the air cleaner   ..  HA HA I think back to the early TC issue  there  .

At the time the S&S pump was not out so a fueling pump and plate where installed  Now it does have more oil in the crank case then I would like . With that said it no longer suffers from the normal issues . 

Time will tell what HD does to " FIX" the issue not band aid it . as i have added the seal to a bike that was sumping and it did not solve that issue . Customer did not want to buy a new pump and plate .    We did end up adding a new pump and plate .  Some customers are harder to deal with than others 

I was at the Harley dealer yesterday and I though well its slick bike but I have to wait till the sumping deal is fixed and I want the motor to make hp and not lay over.  as far as customer lol probably so

[VDeuce]

There is no way to know if you have the seal on the pump or not.

And being that Yes 19s are out most do not have enough miles on the to know .

The sumping is really a hit or miss deal , in some cases it will do it intermittently as well.  We built a 120 on a 18 it ran for 7500 ish miles and then sumped ??

Customer called me and explained what it was doing sluggish to rev getting hot lack of power .. I get it back here at the shop put it on the drum it is running just fine . I let it get hot do a few more pulls nothing .. I get it a bit hotter and just run the bike along at 65 mph and then it does it ??    And boy did it sump Let it idle and it recovered .. I figures since it was on the drum do a few more pulls  Nope doing just fine I bring the speed up to 85 and it just falls flat on its face . Started puking oil out the air cleaner   ..  HA HA I think back to the early TC issue  there  .

At the time the S&S pump was not out so a fueling pump and plate where installed  Now it does have more oil in the crank case then I would like . With that said it no longer suffers from the normal issues . 

Time will tell what HD does to " FIX" the issue not band aid it . as i have added the seal to a bike that was sumping and it did not solve that issue . Customer did not want to buy a new pump and plate .    We did end up adding a new pump and plate .  Some customers are harder to deal with than others 

This post should be framed! great writeup Steve, and not unlike my experience with my own 18 M8 120 that sumped once prior to installing the Feuling race series. Not since.

[Reddog74usa]

It's a lot of money to spend hoping your bike will be the lucky one that doesn't sump. For me personally , I would like to buy one last new bike but will not until they figure out what's going on. Don't take chances with your hard earned money. MAKE THEM FIX THEM before you buy one, by not buying one until they do.

[roadbender]

My thoughts exactly..

Peace and Prayers

[PoorUB]

I bought a 2016 Limited afte rt all the talk and spy photos about the M8. I am so glad I trusted my judgement.  Granted, just a few percent have issues,  but with my luck I would  own one of them.

It also kills me that with a company as large and  as experienced as Harley this condition even exists. They have been building engines for just 115 years! Sumping, pus the transmission lube transfer,  ridiculous!