Author Topic: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs  (Read 1665 times)

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Offline ethan

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1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« on: July 05, 2016, 02:39:25 PM »
Hi.

I'll start off with letting you all know I'm an idiot.

I'm building a bike with a brand new set of edelbrock quicksilver carbs. They were made for evo's. I'm putting it on an ironhead. which means I need to make a custom intake manifold. I doubt anyone has seen/done this, but prove me wrong.

Here's a pic. Anyone has any ideas/opinions fire away. Thanks


Offline Dogbone45ACP

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2016, 03:29:40 PM »
Do you have the Evo manifold ? If so adapt it to a aluminum S&S manifold for the iron head.

Offline ethan

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #2 on: July 05, 2016, 04:56:27 PM »
Well thats a good idea. I don't have one, but someone on the interwebs might. And that would be whole hell of a lot easier than my plan of cutting and welding aluminum tubing of some sort to some machined up plate.


Offline garyajaz

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #3 on: July 05, 2016, 05:48:33 PM »
looks good.
been done lots.
sudco make manifold used miks
branch made one.
several others.
I had a S&S dual throat.
it runs better with a single L.
twin carbs sure do look good.

you DO have a electric start right?

*just enlarged it.
no electric foot.
sorry
« Last Edit: July 05, 2016, 05:52:53 PM by garyajaz »

Offline ethan

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2016, 06:16:54 AM »
Good news thanks, but yea... It's a kicker. Before I tore it down it kicked on in 1-2 kicks. So I guess tuning might be a son of a bitch but once it's tuned it should be good? Hmm

Offline garyajaz

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2016, 06:36:58 AM »
no...lol...
they LOOK good.
and sudco used 36 (I think ) mm carbs.
those you have look much bigger.
what is venture size?
do you have huge cubic inch engine?
I think you just gonna drown that poor ol iron.

Offline y2kflhr

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2016, 09:39:54 AM »
keep us posted with pics! my first HD was a 72 xlch, I loved that bike till the tranny exploded and took out the cases!

Offline Burnout

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2016, 10:07:10 AM »
Not on my bike. You will need a crew with you everywhere you go to push start it!

Very few will give those carbs a thumbs up.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2016, 10:09:54 AM by Burnout »
They don't call me Ironhead Rick just because I'm "hard headed"

Offline turboprop

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #8 on: July 06, 2016, 03:28:03 PM »
Its going to run like shit. There is a reason the various dual carb, long runner systems are available for cheap on eBay and why they are never seen on any successful race bikes in any long runner form.

I went down this path in the 90's. Looked cool, people thought it was fast. Truth is that shovel made more power and was much easier to ride with a single CV carb.

Now, whenever I see one of those setups the first thought that comes to mind is either newby or poser.
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Offline JW113

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2016, 05:22:14 PM »
Along those lines, a "sort of" pal has a shovelhead with a turbo-charger hung off the side of it. If you google Syd DeSoto and Magic Pan, you can see the turbo. Syd transferred it to a shovelhead, which my "sort of" pal has now. And yes, it looks wicked cool, hard core, something that if it pulled up along side of you at a stop light, you'd maybe give second thought to messing with. And yes, sadly, it runs like  :turd:. And yes, good luck getting it started. Line a bunch of pals up to have a macho contest to see who can kick start it, and after they're all proven to be limpdicks, grab on and push.

No thanks!

By the way, I have a Weber/Zenith two throat manifold for Ironhead along with two Zenith twin side draft carbs, in case anybody is looking...

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline ethan

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2016, 11:57:23 AM »
OK, yea....

too much carb for too little engine. maybe if i get a big twin and get bored i'll "potty mouth" with those. S&S Super E and no worries sounds like more fun to me.

Anyways thanks for the input.

Online Racepres

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2016, 06:19:32 AM »
OK, yea....

too much carb for too little engine. maybe if i get a big twin and get bored i'll "potty mouth! " with those. S&S Super E and no worries sounds like more fun to me.

Anyways thanks for the input.

What could possibly be wrong with the Original Bendix??? even a Ka-sneeze?? S&S on Ironhead...No Thanks...

Offline turboprop

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #12 on: July 09, 2016, 07:52:32 AM »
OK, yea....

too much carb for too little engine. maybe if i get a big twin and get bored i'll "potty mouth! " with those. S&S Super E and no worries sounds like more fun to me.

Anyways thanks for the input.


If you are not already in possession of a Super E, take a look at running a CV carb from any harley (Evo BT, XL and TC). There are lots of ways to adapt them to an iron head manifold. These carbs are becoming more and more popular with the Shovel and ironhead crowd. They can be had for about $100.
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Offline tmwmoose

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #13 on: July 09, 2016, 08:12:43 AM »
Its the wow factor I get it so when you find your manifold glue a golf ball in one of the runners and only you and your hair dresser will know :nix:

Offline garyajaz

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #14 on: July 19, 2016, 09:30:46 AM »
wow factor...yep. twin carbs are that.
not too off from your golf ball idea
I saw a evo or shovel years ago with two dual webers.
one out each side.
huh? single ones barely worked.
when asked guy said he paid some where near $1000 for the manifold alone.
then he blocked the left side carb off altogether.
what he had then was a set of dummy webers hanging off side of bike waiting for parking lot fall to wipe out another grand.
oh well. looked cool.
ran like crap.

then there is this guy


Offline tmwmoose

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #15 on: July 19, 2016, 11:57:02 AM »
wow factor...yep. twin carbs are that.
not too off from your golf ball idea
I saw a evo or shovel years ago with two dual webers.
one out each side.
huh? single ones barely worked.
when asked guy said he paid some where near $1000 for the manifold alone.
then he blocked the left side carb off altogether.
what he had then was a set of dummy webers hanging off side of bike waiting for parking lot fall to wipe out another grand.
oh well. looked cool.
ran like crap.

then there is this guy






Cool does it use a out board throttle to open those?

Online Pete_Vit

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #16 on: July 19, 2016, 12:27:33 PM »
 :smiled: - reminds me of a local Indy here years ago had an 883 he used as a bar hopper, I think he had like 5 or 6 Thunder-Jet's kits drilled into his CV carb  :wtf:

Offline Carl 1969

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2016, 12:19:37 AM »
My dad ran dual Mikuni smoothbores on his 86" Shovel, but they were only 29mm. Cool looking as hell, but unless yer running a big inch stroker, I'm betting those carbs are gonna be wasted on that engine.
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Offline drifter

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2016, 02:04:25 PM »
Hmmm, I've got four of those 29 mm smooth bore Mics setting in the barn, left over from my Kawasaki 1000, I wonder what they might fit?   :SM:

Offline garyajaz

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #19 on: September 26, 2016, 09:37:18 AM »
they will fit a kawa 1000   lol
leave that multi headache off a Harley.

got you iron fired yet?

Offline drifter

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #20 on: September 26, 2016, 03:00:57 PM »
Hey Gary,
Made another trip to see Brian, in my research I discovered things like top motor mounts that I picked up and moved several times not knowing what they were.  They were on the shelf, with those aluminum plates mounted between the heads and rocker covers (to keep the shrapnel down in case of explosion(?) or more room for high lift valve springs(?)   :scratch: ) they were not mounted.  Scored the Moco Service Manual that we couldn't find before and other goodies.  Drained the sludge (oil?) from the tank and some oily stuff from the Primary & gear case, nasty.  Still need to clean the gas tank and carb, new gas line, flush oil tank, figure out what battery to get for it, check adjustment on primary chain and lifters, new air filter, then I can turn the key and see what happens.  With the service manual I can get all that stuff done without screwing it up.  Looked at the spare cams, lobe numbers like 1QR, 2QR, 3Q, 4Q, the box they are in has a paper scotch taped to it about "XR Cams for off road only".  The spare cams are used, maybe XR cams inside the engine?  Going to call the Harley shop to get some missing small parts today and will ask them what dimensions the XR pistons part number represent, maybe they know.   
Made some progress on the Pan last night, Drag Spec rear master rebuild kit is wrong, so cleaned and fussed with original parts, assembled, filled and bled, still holding this morning with no leaks.  Now I can install the trans and finish putting the engine together, getting there, but I am the same age as you, just feel it more and am much slower. 

Offline Jako1

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #21 on: September 26, 2016, 04:08:32 PM »
Retard timing just a bit so it don't beak your leg?
Nuff Said," Were Burnin Daylight, Lets Ride", {Sober 29 years}And Proud

Offline westcomb

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #22 on: September 27, 2016, 08:02:13 AM »
Find a Shovelhead intake it bolts right on a ironhead .......... There are some old dual carb ones to be had that could be made to fit the dual Edelbrocks pretty easy .........

I do know of a guy that run Dual Edlbrocks on a very wild shovelhead build ............ He is very smart and said it ran like shit! (with the edelbrocks!) ......... he could not get it tuned! .... He swapped to a Super D after that! ....... 96" motor made 124 Rear Wheel HP on that same motor with the D ........ That is the most I have seen proof of at the Rear wheel with a shovel under 100 CI  :beer:

I think that's way too much for a ironhead! .......... If your set on duals maybe try the dual round slide carbs from Cycle Exchange??? .......... google it!

Offline JW113

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #23 on: September 27, 2016, 08:23:20 AM »
Not that I know one way or the other, because I don't. However, why would two carbs on a manifold that squeezes them into one hole work any better than one carb? More twists and turns in the air path than a single carb too. If they were set up so each carb feeds one cylinder I could see how that might be good. But 2 into 1 into 2? Seems more form over function, but what do I know?

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline drifter

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #24 on: September 27, 2016, 09:06:26 AM »
In my recent research, if I remember correctly (there has been a lot of it), Harley put one carb on each cylinder on the XR-1000.  Compression, bore and stroke stayed the same but the advertised HP changed from 56 to 70.  You might want to explore what the Moco did to achieve that result.

Offline turboprop

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #25 on: September 27, 2016, 09:22:27 AM »
In the early '90s I was lured into running a dual carb dual runner setup on a hot rod 96" evo. It didn't work. Bike ran ok, but could never really tell (butt dyno) if there was an improvement. After a few years of running  and fighting with it, I was one of the first guys in town to use a local shop's new dyno. The numbers were horrible, the curves sucked. On the spot we pulled the dual carbs and put on a Super G, picked up a bunch of peak HP and the curves shifted around a lot. Much better. Those dual carbs looked cool, and sure fooled a lot of sheaple (including me). Luckily I was able to sell it before word got out about how bad they sucked.
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Offline JW113

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #26 on: September 27, 2016, 12:58:47 PM »
In my recent research, if I remember correctly (there has been a lot of it), Harley put one carb on each cylinder on the XR-1000.  Compression, bore and stroke stayed the same but the advertised HP changed from 56 to 70.  You might want to explore what the Moco did to achieve that result.

Yes the XR had two carbs on the right and exhaust ports on the left. One interesting set up that I've seen a couple times is to use two rear heads, with the one on the front mounted backwards. This puts one carb and one exhaust on each side. Looks kinda odd, but evidently works well. Also seen two front heads used with carbs and exhaust on the right side, but looks like a plumbing challenge to me.

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline Hossamania

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #27 on: September 27, 2016, 01:52:53 PM »
Yup, big old dual carbs sticking out look cool as hell, but a tuning challenge, to be sure.
Happiness does not buy money.

Offline turboprop

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #28 on: September 27, 2016, 02:15:21 PM »
In my recent research, if I remember correctly (there has been a lot of it), Harley put one carb on each cylinder on the XR-1000.  Compression, bore and stroke stayed the same but the advertised HP changed from 56 to 70.  You might want to explore what the Moco did to achieve that result.

Has been attempted by many. Extremely difficult. Special cams have to be made so R&D becomes expensive and slow. If dual front heads really offered an advantage they would be seen more at places like Bonneville and El Mirage.

The dual carb thing worked on the XR-750 race bikes because they operated in a very narrow RPM band. Their narrow bandwidth allowed the intake  and exhaust lengths to be individually tuned. Works well on the oval track in a narrow rpm band, horrible on the street.

FWIW, I had an XR-1000 many years ago when I was a kid. That bike would scream (relative for the day) , but was a turd at anything less than throttle. That was with stock cams and exhaust. My buddies on regular iron heads would typically beat me racing around town light to light. When the Evo sportsters came out it was time to replace the XR. Again, it looked cool, but in reality it wasn't that much faster.
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Offline JW113

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #29 on: September 27, 2016, 09:13:36 PM »
If you use two rear heads, with the one on the front flipped around to put the carb/exhaust on the left, you don't have to do anything with the cams. The intake/exhaust valves are then in the same place as a front head. Other than having to fabricate the exhaust and intake manifold, which most any fab shop can do, I don't see that it's difficult at all. You do need to machine the new front head to put a bolt boss for the rocker box on the spark plug side.

Can't speak to why you don't see more ironheads set up like that, but two cylinders sharing a single carb is a well known deficiency in the Harley Davidson V twin configuration. I am trying to think real hard how many other motorcycle manufacturers (with the exception of Indian (RIP) and Triumph) that have cylinders that share carbs. Almost every one made since, what, 1960 has had one carb per cylinder. The Japanese V twins, Ducatis, & Moto Guzzis all seem to run great with dual carbs, right?
:nix:

All that said, I've no plans to do this to any of my ironheads or HDs in general. Just speaking to the subject line of dual carbs on a Harley. Yes, it can be done...

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline turboprop

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #30 on: September 28, 2016, 05:24:07 AM »
If you use two rear heads, with the one on the front flipped around to put the carb/exhaust on the left, you don't have to do anything with the cams. The intake/exhaust valves are then in the same place as a front head. Other than having to fabricate the exhaust and intake manifold, which most any fab shop can do, I don't see that it's difficult at all. You do need to machine the new front head to put a bolt boss for the rocker box on the spark plug side.

Can't speak to why you don't see more ironheads set up like that, but two cylinders sharing a single carb is a well known deficiency in the Harley Davidson V twin configuration. I am trying to think real hard how many other motorcycle manufacturers (with the exception of Indian (RIP) and Triumph) that have cylinders that share carbs. Almost every one made since, what, 1960 has had one carb per cylinder. The Japanese V twins, Ducatis, & Moto Guzzis all seem to run great with dual carbs, right?
:nix:

All that said, I've no plans to do this to any of my ironheads or HDs in general. Just speaking to the subject line of dual carbs on a Harley. Yes, it can be done...

-JW

How does the work for the pushrods?
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Offline JW113

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #31 on: September 28, 2016, 08:33:19 AM »
The bolt holes for the rocker boxes are symmetrical at the valves. They can be installed in either direction, i.e. can be flipped on the head to stick out the other side. You have to machine a boss to bolt the pushrod side of the rocker box to the head, and clearance the fins for the pushrod tubes. There used to be a guy out in Albert Lea MN named Ironhead Tom, was a fabulous head porter for ironheads, did some work for mine. Was also a  well known drag racer in the upper midwest. He is the one that told me about the flipped rear head set up, was on his drag bike I believe. Sadly, he passed away a few years ago.

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline turboprop

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #32 on: September 28, 2016, 09:00:42 AM »
So you are saying to flip the head around on the barrel, and then machine the head and/or rocker box so that the rocker box can be inverted on the head?

Interesting.
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Offline JW113

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #33 on: September 28, 2016, 08:23:51 PM »
Use a rear head on the front cylinder. Flip it around so carb and exhaust spigots point out the left side of bike, it will bolt right on. Install rocker box to head in normal direction, even though backwards on head, it will bolt right on too. Except there is no boss for that seventh bolt on the right side between the push rods. Will need to machine head for that, and a little bit of clearance in the fins to clear push rod tubes. Oil line hooks up like usual. I think you also have to do some machining to the head for the oil drain back holes. No mods to the rocker boxes, no special cams needed. You now have plenty of room to mount two carbs, one for each cylinder, one on each side of the bike.

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline Jako1

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #34 on: September 29, 2016, 05:05:08 AM »
The 2 carbs they thought would smooth out the air and fuel{S&S}
Tears later the XR750 and 1000 did that with 2 separate Delorto carbs{ might be off on the make}
Any way this was a different seat up
you can run 2 ft heads so the intakes support single carbs
Racing tuning trick by Jerry Branch and team
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Offline JW113

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #35 on: September 29, 2016, 07:56:54 AM »
Yes you can run two front heads, but that creates a couple problems. One, where the rear exhaust and front intake crisscross takes some funky pluming, it's pretty tight. Two, timing the cams for the rear cylinder with the valves reversed. All can be done, just takes some clever fabrication and engineering.

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline Jako1

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #36 on: September 30, 2016, 03:17:35 PM »
XR1000, dual carbs street able 90 hp
Did not sell well
Dropped from the line
The XR750 is still alive today  :chop:
Nuff Said," Were Burnin Daylight, Lets Ride", {Sober 29 years}And Proud

Offline JW113

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #37 on: September 30, 2016, 06:51:36 PM »
I think the problem with the XR1000 was "one sportster for the price of two"...

Cool bike, never the less.

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline turboprop

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #38 on: September 30, 2016, 10:44:52 PM »
I had an XR1000 and it wasn't all that. Evo sportsters with just a little bit of mods would smoke that XR.
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Offline Scott P

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #39 on: October 03, 2016, 04:28:01 AM »
Almost bought a NIB XR1000 once, but Ed is right, an Evo XL will run VERY well with minor work.
Scott
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Offline hbkeith

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #40 on: October 03, 2016, 04:56:11 PM »
XR1000, dual carbs street able 90 hp
Did not sell well
Dropped from the line
The XR750 is still alive today  :chop:
  The Factory stopped making XR750 complete bike in 1980 , now all you can get is a skeleton engine

Offline hbkeith

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Re: 1972 XLCH and dual edelbrock quicksilver carbs
« Reply #41 on: October 03, 2016, 05:14:58 PM »
In my recent research, if I remember correctly (there has been a lot of it), Harley put one carb on each cylinder on the XR-1000.  Compression, bore and stroke stayed the same but the advertised HP changed from 56 to 70.  You might want to explore what the Moco did to achieve that result.

Yes the XR had two carbs on the right and exhaust ports on the left. One interesting set up that I've seen a couple times is to use two rear heads, with the one on the front mounted backwards. This puts one carb and one exhaust on each side. Looks kinda odd, but evidently works well. Also seen two front heads used with carbs and exhaust on the right side, but looks like a plumbing challenge to me.

-JW
   Jared Mees has one of his ( Kenny Tolberts) XR750,s set up kinda like this , they call it Frankenstein , he has raced CNC1  on it