Author Topic: 95 Build - Deck Height Question  (Read 569 times)

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Online papaduke

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95 Build - Deck Height Question
« on: January 29, 2018, 08:51:43 PM »
Started getting things fit up and measured tonight. Iíve got SE flat tops. Andrews 37 gear drives, starting with 07 heads and getting them worked and decked a bit. I measured my front deck height to 0.009Ē and my rear to 0.005Ē.

Im looking to be in the 10:1 range. And going to go around 79 ccís on the combustion chamber if I can with a 0.030 head gasket.

Is this difference in height normal? Iíll be taking my cylinders to the shop this week to get them trimmed a touch so they zero.

Just wanted to make sure this is pretty normal and that Iím on the right track.

Offline mike jesse

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2018, 09:07:47 PM »
Normal IMHO.

Skim cut them and don't look back.

My RK was .011/.009 in. in the hole stock.

Offline Ohio HD

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2018, 02:21:13 AM »
Just verify first that your measurements are repeatable. Do you have the rings on the pistons? That can make a big difference as the piston will rock a little in the bore without the rings on. Also measure over the top of the wrist pin area.

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Online papaduke

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2018, 06:11:44 AM »
Just verify first that your measurements are repeatable. Do you have the rings on the pistons? That can make a big difference as the piston will rock a little in the bore without the rings on. Also measure over the top of the wrist pin area.

(Attachment Link)

No. I didnít have the rings in, but I did measure over the wrist pin. I also performed the measurement 3 times. Turning the motor over 1-2x between each measurement.

Offline Timinator

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2018, 06:40:36 AM »
I've seen them off .017 and .019 on stock engines. Trim the bottoms. We don't build anything without zero decking it. TIMINATOR
MODESTY IS A CRUTCH FOR THE INCOMPETENT!!!

Offline kd

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2018, 06:43:44 AM »
Just verify first that your measurements are repeatable. Do you have the rings on the pistons? That can make a big difference as the piston will rock a little in the bore without the rings on. Also measure over the top of the wrist pin area.

(Attachment Link)

No. I didnít have the rings in, but I did measure over the wrist pin. I also performed the measurement 3 times. Turning the motor over 1-2x between each measurement.


Do it with the rings installed. You will get a measurement that is more comparable to the actual final assembly and will feel better knowing that.
KD

Offline jsachs1

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2018, 03:37:46 PM »
Just verify first that your measurements are repeatable. Do you have the rings on the pistons? That can make a big difference as the piston will rock a little in the bore without the rings on. Also measure over the top of the wrist pin area.

(Attachment Link)

No. I didnít have the rings in, but I did measure over the wrist pin. I also performed the measurement 3 times. Turning the motor over 1-2x between each measurement.


Do it with the rings installed. You will get a measurement that is more comparable to the actual final assembly and will feel better knowing that.
Use 1/4" masking tape to simulate the rings. Much easier, and just as accurate.
John

Offline Ohio HD

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2018, 04:45:21 PM »
Use 1/4" masking tape to simulate the rings. Much easier, and just as accurate.
John

You've got lots of tricks John, glad you don't mind sharing them.   :up:

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Offline kd

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2018, 05:11:41 PM »
I wanted to try that last time but the rings were on the pistons. I remembered that you mentioned it before.   :up:  I suppose you could tape the bottom diameter of the skirt also and cut down rocking in the bore.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 05:22:23 PM by kd »
KD

Offline FSG

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2018, 09:48:54 PM »
Use 1/4" masking tape to simulate the rings. Much easier, and just as accurate.
John

 :up:  the use of masking tape has been mentioned many times in the past

Offline Scott P

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2018, 04:25:58 AM »
Expansion mandrel, between centers works well.
With drain/locator dowels removed, both sides can then be machined in the same set-up, to insure bore C/L, is dead-balls perpendicular to both surfaces.
Many aren't.
Otto Knowbetter sez, "Not all lemons, are yellow......"

Online papaduke

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2018, 07:18:12 AM »
Just verify first that your measurements are repeatable. Do you have the rings on the pistons? That can make a big difference as the piston will rock a little in the bore without the rings on. Also measure over the top of the wrist pin area.

(Attachment Link)

No. I didnít have the rings in, but I did measure over the wrist pin. I also performed the measurement 3 times. Turning the motor over 1-2x between each measurement.


Do it with the rings installed. You will get a measurement that is more comparable to the actual final assembly and will feel better knowing that.

I checked it with the rings yesterday. Needless to say I was surprised how much the measurements changed. They were 0.002Ē below on both front and rear. Thank you for the tips!!!

Offline Ohio HD

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2018, 07:22:55 AM »
Just verify first that your measurements are repeatable. Do you have the rings on the pistons? That can make a big difference as the piston will rock a little in the bore without the rings on. Also measure over the top of the wrist pin area.

(Attachment Link)

No. I didnít have the rings in, but I did measure over the wrist pin. I also performed the measurement 3 times. Turning the motor over 1-2x between each measurement.


Do it with the rings installed. You will get a measurement that is more comparable to the actual final assembly and will feel better knowing that.

I checked it with the rings yesterday. Needless to say I was surprised how much the measurements changed. They were 0.002Ē below on both front and rear. Thank you for the tips!!!

I've always used the rings on the piston to check. But I will try the method that John Saches spoke of, using 1/4" wide masking tape around the rings lands of the piston. When your making cuts to cylinder height to get zero deck, I can see this as a quick and easy way to stabilize the piston in the bore.
For the best deal on bike parts, call Calif Phil
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Offline Templer

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2018, 07:44:54 AM »
You may also want to check the intake port to TB after all this. The 85cc (HTT certed) to op of 79cc and a 30 will realign those ports FACT!!!as your having the heads done DONT FORGET IMHO
07heads/124 in my Dyna.  I JUST JUMPED THRU THE RINGS WITH HER

Offline kd

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2018, 07:55:18 AM »
Just verify first that your measurements are repeatable. Do you have the rings on the pistons? That can make a big difference as the piston will rock a little in the bore without the rings on. Also measure over the top of the wrist pin area.

(Attachment Link)

No. I didnít have the rings in, but I did measure over the wrist pin. I also performed the measurement 3 times. Turning the motor over 1-2x between each measurement.


Do it with the rings installed. You will get a measurement that is more comparable to the actual final assembly and will feel better knowing that.

I checked it with the rings yesterday. Needless to say I was surprised how much the measurements changed. They were 0.002Ē below on both front and rear. Thank you for the tips!!!

I've always used the rings on the piston to check. But I will try the method that John Saches spoke of, using 1/4" wide masking tape around the rings lands of the piston. When your making cuts to cylinder height to get zero deck, I can see this as a quick and easy way to stabilize the piston in the bore.


I will be looking for an opportunity to try that method too, I will probably do it that way and then with a band of tape added to the skirt to further curb rocking of the piston to get a comparison. I would expect the second band of tape would benefit accuracy for the anal retentive folks like myself.  :smiled:
KD

Offline Ohio HD

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #15 on: February 04, 2018, 07:59:00 AM »
I've always used the rings on the piston to check. But I will try the method that John Saches spoke of, using 1/4" wide masking tape around the rings lands of the piston. When your making cuts to cylinder height to get zero deck, I can see this as a quick and easy way to stabilize the piston in the bore.


I will be looking for an opportunity to try that method too, I will probably do it that way and then with a band of tape added to the skirt to further curb rocking of the piston to get a comparison. I would expect the second band of tape would benefit accuracy for the anal retentive folks like myself.  :smiled:

The light just went on...   :idea:   John probably did mean wrapping the piston body, not the land area. Would take a lot less tape......    :embarrassed:

 
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Offline jsachs1

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #16 on: February 04, 2018, 02:52:11 PM »
I've always used the rings on the piston to check. But I will try the method that John Saches spoke of, using 1/4" wide masking tape around the rings lands of the piston. When your making cuts to cylinder height to get zero deck, I can see this as a quick and easy way to stabilize the piston in the bore.


I will be looking for an opportunity to try that method too, I will probably do it that way and then with a band of tape added to the skirt to further curb rocking of the piston to get a comparison. I would expect the second band of tape would benefit accuracy for the anal retentive folks like myself.  :smiled:

The light just went on...   :idea:   John probably did mean wrapping the piston body, not the land area. Would take a lot less tape......    :embarrassed:

 
No. I meant what I posted.
Several raps of tape around the ring area, be sure the ends of the tape start and finish without overlapping. You'll have all the stability you need to get an accurate measurement over the top of each side of the wristpin.
If you are running crazy clearance or worn pistons, you may want to wrap the body.  :emoGroan:
John

Offline Ohio HD

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Re: 95 Build - Deck Height Question
« Reply #17 on: February 04, 2018, 02:55:13 PM »
I've always used the rings on the piston to check. But I will try the method that John Saches spoke of, using 1/4" wide masking tape around the rings lands of the piston. When your making cuts to cylinder height to get zero deck, I can see this as a quick and easy way to stabilize the piston in the bore.


I will be looking for an opportunity to try that method too, I will probably do it that way and then with a band of tape added to the skirt to further curb rocking of the piston to get a comparison. I would expect the second band of tape would benefit accuracy for the anal retentive folks like myself.  :smiled:

The light just went on...   :idea:   John probably did mean wrapping the piston body, not the land area. Would take a lot less tape......    :embarrassed:

 
No. I meant what I posted.
Several raps of tape, be sure the ends of the tape start and finish without overlapping. You'll have all the stability you need to get an accurate measurement over the top of each side of the wristpin.
If you are running crazy clearance or worn pistons, you may want to wrap the body.  :emoGroan:
John

Well that makes me feel better, I did perceive what you said correctly.    :teeth:


I was thinking along the lines of 0.0025" clearance, but that would take thin tape. And OEM would have been impossible.
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