Author Topic: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary  (Read 71948 times)

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Offline stro1965

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #750 on: December 04, 2017, 06:14:22 PM »
Add me to the list of folks seeing oil migrate from the transmission to the primary. Just 400 miles after the 1K service on my '17 I decided to have a look. The dipstick was dry and the primary was overflowing. I'm estimating that about 8 ounces migrated over in just 400 miles. Now, that said, I don't ride this bike like most folks do. This Road King was purchased almost exclusively as a cone competition bike, and I'm on that clutch all the time. Definitely gets ridden like a cop bike. That might explain the excess migration in my case. Dropped off at the dealership today. They claimed to have never heard of this issue and had not seen the TSB.

 

Offline Ohio HD

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #751 on: December 04, 2017, 06:25:35 PM »
Looks like it presses over the end of the mainshaft. Not much for it to grip to.   
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Offline 1FSTRK

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #752 on: December 04, 2017, 06:48:28 PM »
They have come up with a small seal that goes on the clutch pushrod, there is a pic over on HDF. Looks like it's pressed on to the nut on the mainshaft bearing, owner says it was installed 11/30, too cold to test it out yet. :idunno:

If they can keep it in place it will sure slow down the tranfer. It will not fix the engineering flaw that traps the oil  above the main shaft but it is a cheap bandaid so HD will use it to get the public off their case and they will quietly make a proper change on a different model year. No defect, no recall.
 
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Offline PoorUB

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #753 on: December 04, 2017, 07:22:21 PM »
Here it is,
I am an adult?? When did that happen, and how do I make it stop?!

Offline FSG

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #754 on: December 04, 2017, 08:04:20 PM »
 :scratch:   well at least they're doing something, but ......... 

they'd be better to use a better flangenut with a mating face seal fitted to the inner side cover, but then they would need to vent the slave cavity back to the trannie


Offline FSG

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #755 on: December 04, 2017, 08:10:24 PM »
Looks like it presses over the end of the mainshaft. Not much for it to grip to.

it'll probably press  into the mainshaft as well

Offline 1FSTRK

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #756 on: December 04, 2017, 08:13:50 PM »
 There is the problem with any type of seal/baffle compared to removing the trapped oil, it could turn the slave cylinder into a diaphram pump, and  they can't totally seal the end of the shaft because it is still the only primary vent. 
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Offline PoorUB

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #757 on: December 04, 2017, 09:16:28 PM »
I was trying to understand what they are trying to do here, seal the push rod? Seal the end of the shaft to the slave cylinder? Either way, how does the primary vent? Are they sealing the shaft to the slave and the rod, but allowing air to pass on the back side, (tranny side), of the seal? What happens if the area behind the slave eventually fills with oil?

I wonder what would happen if they drilled a 1/8" hole in the main shaft, under the output gear. They could seal the end of the mainshaft, and the mainshaft spinning would spin any oil out the hole, and the primary would still vent through the hole. :idunno:
I am an adult?? When did that happen, and how do I make it stop?!

Offline 1FSTRK

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #758 on: December 05, 2017, 04:18:27 AM »
That would work in the future but costly as a retro on the bike that are out there.

The trouble is that they created this problem so undoing the design mistake would be a better fix, maybe they could call 1984 and find out what made this system work for over 30 years until they "fixed it"
"Never hang on to a mistake just because you spent time or money making it."

Offline Durwood

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #759 on: December 05, 2017, 04:21:42 AM »
« Last Edit: December 05, 2017, 04:28:09 AM by Durwood »

Offline rbabos

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #760 on: December 05, 2017, 10:48:19 AM »
They have come up with a small seal that goes on the clutch pushrod, there is a pic over on HDF. Looks like it's pressed on to the nut on the mainshaft bearing, owner says it was installed 11/30, too cold to test it out yet. :idunno:
If it in fact seals the pushrod,  the primary will not vent then. A separate vent is needed.
Ron

Offline Bigtwin

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #761 on: December 06, 2017, 12:29:45 PM »

I have this piece in my bike since earlier. Return trip of 80 Km: nothing to report. I'll tell you later if it's OK.

Offline Karl H.

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #762 on: December 06, 2017, 12:53:02 PM »
 :up:
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Offline 08flstf

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #763 on: December 28, 2017, 06:23:55 AM »
Haven't read or heard anything lately. Has this issue been resolved yet or not?

Offline hattitude

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #764 on: December 28, 2017, 07:51:28 AM »
Haven't read or heard anything lately. Has this issue been resolved yet or not?

Nope....

On another forum I read, the new super fix by the MoCo is not a fix after all... it was a button-looking cap on the end of the pushrod...

It helped some, did nothing for others...

The MoCo continues to search for a band-aide fix, rather than the proper fix (which they probably know by now) that would cost way too money...

The same can be said for their sumping issue...

Offline PoorUB

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #765 on: December 28, 2017, 09:49:00 AM »
And the longer they drag it out, the more bikes will need to be repaired.

They should just fix it with whatever means necessary and repair the rest as needed. It seems not all are affected so I don't see it being a recall issue, but as the bikes come in that transfer oil, fix them! Pick a number, if it transfers 4 ounces in 1,000 miles, then fix it. I don't see it affecting more than a few thousand motorcycles as it seems many out there have never heard of it.
I am an adult?? When did that happen, and how do I make it stop?!

Offline Jim Bronson

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #766 on: December 28, 2017, 10:47:36 AM »
It is kinda hard for me to believe that they have had an engineering team working on this for six+ months with no permanent fix in sight. It seems like it isn't very high on their priority list.
Going down that long, lonesome highway. Gonna live life my way.

Offline hattitude

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #767 on: December 28, 2017, 03:37:52 PM »
It is kinda hard for me to believe that they have had an engineering team working on this for six+ months with no permanent fix in sight. It seems like it isn't very high on their priority list.

I believe they know full well how to fix it, and fix it properly...

But someone has decided the fix is too expensive, so they're experimenting with cheap, partial, band-aide fixes..... hoping to save face (not have to admit to a big engineering mistake) and money (cheap bolt-on fix v  re-engineering a part).....

Offline 1FSTRK

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #768 on: December 28, 2017, 05:59:03 PM »
It is kinda hard for me to believe that they have had an engineering team working on this for six+ months with no permanent fix in sight. It seems like it isn't very high on their priority list.

I believe they know full well how to fix it, and fix it properly...

But someone has decided the fix is too expensive, so they're experimenting with cheap, partial, band-aide fixes..... hoping to save face (not have to admit to a big engineering mistake) and money (cheap bolt-on fix v  re-engineering a part).....

We have a winner

To engineer a true fix is to admit the original design was flawed and that means they would have to provide the new design to all owners back to the Rushmore bikes that used it.
"Never hang on to a mistake just because you spent time or money making it."

Offline PoorUB

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #769 on: December 28, 2017, 06:49:21 PM »
It is kinda hard for me to believe that they have had an engineering team working on this for six+ months with no permanent fix in sight. It seems like it isn't very high on their priority list.

I believe they know full well how to fix it, and fix it properly...

But someone has decided the fix is too expensive, so they're experimenting with cheap, partial, band-aide fixes..... hoping to save face (not have to admit to a big engineering mistake) and money (cheap bolt-on fix v  re-engineering a part).....

We have a winner

To engineer a true fix is to admit the original design was flawed and that means they would have to provide the new design to all owners back to the Rushmore bikes that used it.

Harley does "improvements" all the time and does not do anything on previous models, mainshaft on the six speeds was one, total change of the cams and chains in '06-'07. 25MM wheel bearings going to a A the B suffix, but no problems mentioned. How many different TC breather assemblies are there, four? No problems there either, just and improvement if even mentioned. I am sure there is many more.

HD will find a cure and it will show up as an running change in 2019, and mention something about "improved primary and transmission venting", it will retrofit back a couple years and nothing more will be said about it. Perhaps dealers will get a service bulletin about it getting applied to earlier models if the customer has a complaint of oil transfer. It will be touted as a great improvement over earlier models then swept under the rug like it has been done many times before.
I am an adult?? When did that happen, and how do I make it stop?!

Offline Moparnut72

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #770 on: December 29, 2017, 07:28:10 AM »
Does this problem occur in all TC late models or certain ones. I have a '17 Slim. Guess I better check it.
kk
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Offline rigidthumper

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #771 on: December 29, 2017, 09:33:52 AM »
Does this problem occur in all TC late models or certain ones. I have a '17 Slim. Guess I better check it.
kk

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Offline Moparnut72

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #772 on: December 29, 2017, 09:39:11 AM »
Thanks
kk
Mopar or No Car

Offline PoorUB

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #773 on: December 29, 2017, 03:57:43 PM »
Does this problem occur in all TC late models or certain ones. I have a '17 Slim. Guess I better check it.
kk

Touring only and limited number of motorcycles. I have 18,500 miles om my 2016 Limited and no oil transfer issues.
I am an adult?? When did that happen, and how do I make it stop?!

Offline Jim Bronson

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Re: M8 trans fluid leaking in primary
« Reply #774 on: December 29, 2017, 06:17:10 PM »
22K on my 2015 RK and no transfer issues.
Going down that long, lonesome highway. Gonna live life my way.