Help needed with clutch adjustment with cowpie / rotary four speed transmission

[david lee]

ive always found getting neutral at standstill impossible even with a whole new clutch installed by a hd mech.he said thats how shovels are. slightly moving and it clicks in easy

[fbn ent]

Mine is almost always easy in or out of neutral....

[Ohio HD]

Use one of these to retain and set and end play for the clutch basket.

You'll wonder whose bike your on.....

Not even a gear clash going into first from neutral. Leave the plastic clutch retainers, they're crap.

https://bit.ly/2MfeIT1

[Burnout]

I've always used the plastic retainers and they seem to work well. I have to spot face one of the snap ring holes so I can get 3 snap rings on them though

How does that one work, cant figure it out looking at the parts. Must be extra parts there that are shims?

[Ohio HD]

18-1112 V-twin

[2017FLHTK]

While I have the primary cover off, I figured it'd be a good time to check / verify the alignment on my primary chain.  The "Sprocket Alignment Dry Clutch Procedures" are listed as follows:

1) See Figure 6-3.  Reinstall the clutch hub and take measurement "A" from the chain cover surface to the alternator rotor surface.
2) Take measure "B" from the chain cover surface to the clutch disc friction surface.
3) Subtract "B" measurement from "A" measurement to determine which space listed in dimension "C" to use.


Figure A is easy enough: the distance from the front edge of the rotor to the inner primary gasket surface.  I'm pretty confused where I'm supposed to take measurement B though.  What is the "clutch disc friction surface" that the service manual references?  The inside of the clutch hub?  Some other location?


With all that said, the primary chain alignment actually looks pretty good (the teeth on the sprocket coming off the crankshaft and the teeth on the sprocket connecting the clutch / transmission are centered in the middle of the gap in the chains).  However, I can't wrap my head around what the instructions in the service manual are telling me to check.  Am I missing something simple here?

[Ohio HD]

Remove these and all will be clear.


You cannot view this attachment.

[fbn ent]

Pull the compensating sprocket and primary chain/clutch hub. Measure (B) to the friction disc on the clutch hub and (A) to the rotor.

[JW113]

Which is not to hard to do IF you have the sockets and a lock bar. If not, just push the chain back (toward the inner primary wall) as far as it will go, then measure from the inner primary flange surface to a chain link close to the engine sprocket, and as close as you can to the clutch sprocket. The main point is that you want to see that that chain is running parallel to the inner primary flange surface.

I've also had no issues with the plastic clutch retainer. Clutch works perfectly, no drag, no creep, neutral is a piece of cake rolling or not. If I happen to get into the clutch again, may consider that J&P retainer just to check it out.

Also gave this a passing thought.

https://www.jpcycles.com/product/630-407/sifton-diaphragm-clutch-conversion-kit


-JW

[72fl]

You sure that is what you did on a cow pie Shovel? Never ever heard of that.

Isn't the Clutch the same ? Or am I mistaken ?

[fbn ent]

From Burnout (above)...

"This clutch adjustment procedure is not correct for a 4 speed and you may damage the throwout bearing and push rod by using it with a lever release type, instead of a ball ramp type (5 speed) that it is correct for."

[Burnout]

18-1112 V-twin

I dont understand this step, it seems contradictory?

9. If retainer is to be installed in a KARATA belt drive, DO NOT use steel plate before installing clutch plates. DO use steel plate when installing on
conventional chain drive or Harley belt drive. (Super Max. Primo. or Phase 3) before installing clutch plates.

A stock clutch does not use a steel first against the basket? Is it needed to space out the first friction from the tamer?

[Ohio HD]

18-1112 V-twin

I dont understand this step, it seems contradictory?

9. If retainer is to be installed in a KARATA belt drive, DO NOT use steel plate before installing clutch plates. DO use steel plate when installing on
conventional chain drive or Harley belt drive. (Super Max. Primo. or Phase 3) before installing clutch plates.

A stock clutch does not use a steel first against the basket? Is it needed to space out the first friction from the tamer?

Yes, the clutch fiber needs to be spaced away from the center section of the tamer.

[Burnout]

Yes, the clutch fiber needs to be spaced away from the center section of the tamer.

Their picture does not show that.   

[david lee]

18-1112 V-twin

I dont understand this step, it seems contradictory?

9. If retainer is to be installed in a KARATA belt drive, DO NOT use steel plate before installing clutch plates. DO use steel plate when installing on
conventional chain drive or Harley belt drive. (Super Max. Primo. or Phase 3) before installing clutch plates.

A stock clutch does not use a steel first against the basket? Is it needed to space out the first friction from the tamer?

Yes, the clutch fiber needs to be spaced away from the center section of the tamer.

its been yrs since i converted mine to ince and half belt primary with the 52 roller bearing hub and am pretty sure it came with what is called a black plastic retainer held on with 3 clips.what does it do and if a fibre clutch plate is the first installed what is the last to be installed  metal or fibre.thanks

[Burnout]

The plastic retainer is thinner and will not hit the first friction.

The Tamer is a different setup, much more positive, and it's thickness requires spacing the first friction out to clear it.

[billbuilds]

     Once you get the spring/collar distance set at the initial 5/8" your next step should be to get your 13/16" for your cllutch lever to starter distance. Loosen the clutch cable and the lock nut on the clutch pushrod adjusting screw. Now pull on the clutch lever as the cable would while you simultaneously screw the adjuster screw in or out as needed to get the corrrect distance. Some would say to back off the adjuster screw a half turn or so from here but I don't see the logic. Your next step should be to set yur freeplay at the lever and this is where you're going to loose that half turn anyhow. The freeplay at the handlebar is critical; too tight and your wafter-type throwout bearing gets chewed up.   

[david lee]

The plastic retainer is thinner and will not hit the first friction.

The Tamer is a different setup, much more positive, and it's thickness requires spacing the first friction out to clear it.

thanks but what does it actually do

[friday]

If youre not taking the drive out , just measure the chain like has been mentioned by JW said

[crock]

The plastic retainer is thinner and will not hit the first friction.

The Tamer is a different setup, much more positive, and it's thickness requires spacing the first friction out to clear it.

thanks but what does it actually do

The outer clutch shell is free to float around. By keeping it in place to the back the disks are allowed to separate a little more cleanly

[david lee]

The plastic retainer is thinner and will not hit the first friction.

The Tamer is a different setup, much more positive, and it's thickness requires spacing the first friction out to clear it.

thanks but what does it actually do

The outer clutch shell is free to float around. By keeping it in place to the back the disks are allowed to separate a little more cleanly

got it.what i will say is as i run a belt with a vented derby cover when you operate the clutch you can hear the plates rattle which tells me the clutch is working. correct ? thanks