Preparing to refresh my first top-end, pics and questions

[SixShooter14]

Howdy folks, following up on my previous thread about replacing my '97 FLHR base gaskets. I'm hoping to begin work this weekend. I have a service manual and James Top-end gasket set. As well as S&S wrist pin clips. I have not yet purchased studs or head bolts. But I may do so before I'm finished.

Anyway....Today, just to see what's-what, I did a compression test and took a look at the spark plugs. These were installed in May and only have about 2000 miles on them. Dummy me forgot my gapping disc at home, 120 miles away, so I didn't check that.

Compression test was done cold with a decently charged battery, though I don't have a charger or tender to make sure it was 100%.
I'll post the results in following posts.

Any comments are welcome. 

[SixShooter14]

Front cylinder.

[SixShooter14]

Rear cylinder.

[thumper 823]

If you get me involved it become a slippery slope-
I guess you are trying to stop a rear cylinder seep?
Check for pull dimple around the two rear studs.

[SixShooter14]

If you get me involved it become a slippery slope-
I guess you are trying to stop a rear cylinder seep?
Check for pull dimple around the two rear studs.

nah, I appreciate any information.
I have seepage from both cylinder bases that I would like to seal up.

Would you mind elaborating a bit on what I'm to look for there?
Thanks

[thumper 823]

I will try-
Everyone's pocketbook, needs, desires are different.
As a minimum,  set a straight edge against studs on top of the cylinder bore.   The thinner the straight edge the better, or remove the studs.
(dont reuse them)
You will prolly see room to drive a truck under the straight edge.

At this point, it gets more complicated.
There are a dozen ways to address this, poor mans to rich mans.

You could stuff rags in all the holes and flat-file it off , that would be poor man and will work with Yamma bond.
Or tear it dwn and have it machined flat.
If you elect to tear it dwn , maybe its time for some other upgrades and take advantage of "whilst you are there"

[SixShooter14]

I will try-
Everyone's pocketbook, needs, desires are different.
As a minimum,  set a straight edge against studs on top of the cylinder bore.   The thinner the straight edge the better, or remove the studs.
(dont reuse them)
You will prolly see room to drive a truck under the straight edge.

At this point, it gets more complicated.
There are a dozen ways to address this, poor mans to rich mans.

You could stuff rags in all the holes and flat-file it off , that would be poor man and will work with Yamma bond.
Or tear it dwn and have it machined flat.
If you elect to tear it dwn , maybe its time for some other upgrades and take advantage of "whilst you are there"

Thanks, I'll definitely check that. I have a rather thin 150mm scale that I can use and I'll post up some more pics as I go. This is my first time getting below the rocker boxes, so it's a learning process.

I'm not really wanting to do any upgrades yet, a sealed up reliable engine is the goal right now.

[thumper 823]

If your heads are off I would pull the valves and check guides . If virgin heads run 0.050 off.
If a lot of miles new lifters.
slippppery slope.....

[Hillside Motorcycle]

Leaking Evo base gaskets are a result of the Moco never machining that area.
We mount those in a fixture, and skim/machine them perpendicular to the C/L of the bore.
No mo leaks.

[thumper 823]

Pay attn to Scott. He deals with these every day.
My cylinders are not HD (axtell)  nodular,  they dont leak .......(slippery slope)


Plus you should visit him and his shop if you ever get a chance.

It is not a back yard    "want a be shop! "
It is the real deal with all kinds of machine capabilities.

[MikeL]

The hardest part of that job is scraping the old base gasket off the cylinder base. Before I got my little bench lathe I would use the James print o seal base gaskets they are thick and forgive some of the deeper scratches from scraping.
For the studs if this is the first top end use them over. Make a note when you remove the head nuts if there was 1 nut a little looser than the other check that stud and check the block surface for pull out.
Sounds like you are going to leave the piston in the cylinder by removing the wrist pin.Good way to keep down costs.

                                                                                                MIKE

[SixShooter14]

Thanks for the info. guys.
I forgot I already had studs from a few months ago. But not head bolts.

I do plan to leave the pistons in the cyl.

[JW113]

Make a note when you remove the head nuts if there was 1 nut a little looser than the other check that stud and check the block surface for pull out.

^^^  THIS  ^^^

Evo's with miles and age tend to pop the studs loose first time you take the heads off. Especially pre-95, which I think are less prone, but not immune. Just be prepared when you go to put the heads back on, one or more head nuts might seem like they are not getting tight....   Can't tell you how many cyl studs I've had to Time-Sert.

-JW

[MikeL]

I also like to replace the outboard cylinder head nuts with new H/D cause they chromed them and the chrome lasts. The old style were cadmium and they would look like crap after a while. I never had any luck with those after market covers they would shake off after a while. There like $20 for 4 from the dealer.


                                                                                               MIKE

                                                 

[jsachs1]

Before disassembly remove the timing hole plug, wrap a rag around your air line blowgun, blow in the timing plug hole, and watch where your oil leaks are. You may even find a crack in the lifter block area, or behind and under the rear cylinder, worst case scenario. Evo cases sometimes crack in those areas. Easy way to find your oil weeps, and leaks.
John

[Deye76]

Before disassembly remove the timing hole plug, wrap a rag around your air line blowgun, blow in the timing plug hole, and watch where your oil leaks are. You may even find a crack in the lifter block area, or behind and under the rear cylinder, worst case scenario. Evo cases sometimes crack in those areas. Easy way to find your oil weeps, and leaks.
John

:up:The Master.

[JW113]

Yep. Exactly what happened to mine. Good tip with the air gun, John.

-JW

[david lee]

Yep. Exactly what happened to mine. Good tip with the air gun, John.

-JW

i thought that air gun idea was good until i mentioned it to a mc mech mate who said doing that can blow your seals

[Scotty]

i thought that air gun idea was good until i mentioned it to a mc mech mate who said doing that can blow your seals

Well obviously for the more intelligent "mc mech" you would reduce the pressure from 300psi to say 20 or 30 psi so you don't blow every seal out. 

[SixShooter14]

That is an interesting tip about the air gun. I guess a little pressure would certainly expose the leaks. Sadly, I don't have an air compressor (yet). But, thanks anyways, I'll try to remember that if'n I wind up doing this again (which I'm certain I will at some point)

In other news. After a few delays, I was finally able to get started tonight. I spent about 2 hours building a workbench and draining and removing the fuel tank. Then I had to head in to cook dinner. I'll try to keep y'all updated as I go. But it'll be slow as I only get a few hours per night and I'm trying not to rush through anything. I'm hoping to do the assembly all at once on a weekend. I don't want to split up assembly over several days, I'd likely forget to do something from one day to the next.

[Deye76]

"I'd likely forget to do something from one day to the next."

Label items where sequence is important, take pictures.

[JW113]

And above all, make sure you have TFM! And a parts book doesn't hurt either. Good exploded views of what-goes-where.

-JW

[Hossamania]

And above all, make sure you have TFM! And a parts book doesn't hurt either. Good exploded views of what-goes-where.

-JW

Yup, study that manual before, during, and after each step.

[SixShooter14]

Yep, I have an electronic and hard SM and bookmarked the online parts manual that has the exploded views and part numbers.

I've replaced the rocker box gaskets before with the help of Pete. But this is my first time tackling it alone and then going further.


I have boxes labeled for front and rear and will bag and tag the parts to match fr/rr, in/ex. And I will be taking pictures as well, for my use and to share here so that I know what I'm looking at. Should be able to get both rocker boxes off tomorrow, might get the heads and jugs off too.

[kd]

Six, if you take a gasket and draw the profile on a piece of cardboard you can pierce holes where the fasteners go and screw them in to those holes as they get removed. You can just draw the holes in a miniature pattern too if you want to save space.  Use an awl or ice pic to punch the holes and they'll be small enough to retain the screws when installed.  Some of the fasteners are specific to holes and switching them with the one beside it can have catastrophic results.  Too long and it can bottom and crack or damage the case.  The fasteners that go toward the lifters can dimple the lifter bores for example.  Bags are OK if you are comfortable with which bolts go where and some are real close in size and hard to notice. 

BTW, while on the subject of fasteners, when you have the cam cover off, consider swapping the 2 bolts that go through the dowel pins in the cam plates for 1/4" studs and 12 point flange nuts.  Those fasteners barely catch enough thread to torque and are known to strip the threads out of the block without much effort.