Top fork cap question

[Adam76]

Hey guys,  kinda stuck with this top nut and don't want to break anything.   1996 Heritage softail
Can't seem to crack the top nut of the fork loose, even when put back up through the lower tree just low enough between the two trees to get good access and tightened up pinch bolts to 40 ft/lbs. The fork tube keeps slipping/ spinning round and the nut jammed tight.... Tried tapping with rubber mallet.  Any ideas on how to get this one off?
My manual and YouTube have not been any help. 
Thanks.

[98fxstc]

you got one undone but not the other ?

Put it back in original position with both clamps, upper and lower tightened to spec
if it wont shift with pressure on with open end spanner or shifter, give it a tap on top with a wooden mallet while under pressure

[FSG]

this pic is of 95 - 96, never mind that it's wrong .......  it was 25 yrs ago 

the upper tree doesnt do much other than stop the leg from falling out, clamping is done by the lower tree and bolt # 7

if you haven't already changed out those bolts to good quality high tensile then I suggest you do

put the leg back into the other side of the tree and have another go, it maybe the tree holes are slightly worn/different in diameter

failing that .....  I used a gal garden gate pipe clamp hinge to hold the tubes in the bench vise, give something like that a go

[Adam76]

this pic is of 95 - 96, never mind that it's wrong .......  it was 25 yrs ago 

the upper tree doesnt do much other than stop the leg from falling out, clamping is done by the lower tree and bolt # 7

if you haven't already changed out those bolts to good quality high tensile then I suggest you do

put the leg back into the other side of the tree and have another go, it maybe the tree holes are slightly worn/different in diameter

failing that .....  I used a gal garden gate pipe clamp hinge to hold the tubes in the bench vise, give something like that a go

Thanks  FSG,  long time no chat 😁  yes, good idea to swap those bolts out to new high tensile ones. 

How far up the lower clamp should I position it? Close up to the top clamp but not into it? Or just slightly through the bottom clamp?
Thanks

[Adam76]

you got one undone but not the other ?

Put it back in original position with both clamps, upper and lower tightened to spec
if it wont shift with pressure on with open end spanner or shifter, give it a tap on top with a wooden mallet while under pressure

Thanks, but I don't understand what you mean by put in original position and tighten up both clamps?   If I do that then I can't get access to the cap nut at the top to undo it with because it's inside the top clamp.. 

[FSG]

Close up to the top clamp but not into it?

     just enough room to get the spanner on

Or just slightly through the bottom clamp?

NO as then you'll be clamping the tube to item # 26

[capn]

Use a dead blow hammer and hit the wrench as hard as you can.

[Adam76]

Close up to the top clamp but not into it?

     just enough room to get the spanner on

Or just slightly through the bottom clamp?

NO as then you'll be clamping the tube to item # 26

[Adam76]

Use a dead blow hammer and hit the wrench as hard as you can.

I was tempted,  but thought I would damage the fork tube?  Looks like it's come to that anyway.
Thanks

[98fxstc]

you got one undone but not the other ?

Put it back in original position with both clamps, upper and lower tightened to spec
if it wont shift with pressure on with open end spanner or shifter, give it a tap on top with a wooden mallet while under pressure

Thanks, but I don't understand what you mean by put in original position and tighten up both clamps?   If I do that then I can't get access to the cap nut at the top to undo it with because it's inside the top clamp.. 

I can get the cap nut on my 98 from above the top clamp
I can see from FSG's pic that you cannot do that 

[Adam76]

you got one undone but not the other ?

Put it back in original position with both clamps, upper and lower tightened to spec
if it wont shift with pressure on with open end spanner or shifter, give it a tap on top with a wooden mallet while under pressure

Thanks, but I don't understand what you mean by put in original position and tighten up both clamps?   If I do that then I can't get access to the cap nut at the top to undo it with because it's inside the top clamp.. 

I can get the cap nut on my 98 from above the top clamp
I can see from FSG's pic that you cannot do that 

Yeah, l wish l could.... would make things a little easier having two clamping points on the fork rubber instead of just one.

[Racepres]

Lucky me... I have more than one 41mm lower tree...and one is used simply for a Tool... a holding tool...
Shock may be the only way to loosen an overtightened Cap.. Try a Brass Hammer first... Then...about a 3 pounder..
That threaded part at the top...where the Cap goes On... is a common Straight thread... put a Shortened bolt in it ..and Hit that Sucker with yer three pounder like ya Hate it... shock will loosen the Top and I do Mean... drive it like a big nail...

[Burnout]

There is a socket made that fit the top nut of the fork and then you remove it with an impact gun.

[JW113]

I've come across a few that were quite stuck. I have a 15" adjustable wrench that I use on them. Remove the pinch bolt and replace it with a Grade 8. Lower the tube to get the wrench on the cap, tighten the pinch bolt really tight, then use a 5lb or so hammer and beat on the end of the wrench. If the tube still rotates in the clamp, tighten the pinch bolt more. Don't worry about the bolt, you are going to replace it again when you're done.

If that still will not break it free..... get out the torch and heat the tube at the top where the cap threads are. That will always cause it to crack free.

-JW

[04rkryder]

"If that still will not break it free..... get out the torch and heat the tube at the top where the cap threads are. That will always cause it to crack free."

Rebuilt my fork tubes on my 95 Heritage a couple months ago . Had same problem as you. did as JW113 said above to get mine off.

[JW113]

There are very few things that the blue tipped wrench won't loosen...


-JW

[Racepres]

I've come across a few that were quite stuck. I have a 15" adjustable wrench that I use on them. Remove the pinch bolt and replace it with a Grade 8. Lower the tube to get the wrench on the cap, tighten the pinch bolt really tight, then use a 5lb or so hammer and beat on the end of the wrench. If the tube still rotates in the clamp, tighten the pinch bolt more. Don't worry about the bolt, you are going to replace it again when you're done.

If that still will not break it free..... get out the torch and heat the tube at the top where the cap threads are. That will always cause it to crack free.

-JW

No Heat... I won't do that.. Again... just like those Phillips head screws in Cases... Drive it like a Damn Nail.. especially with a Bolt in the Threaded hole to protect the Cap....If you hit a phillips head case screw hard... it will come out with a cheap screwdriver...

[jsachs1]

A fool proof deal I made years ago. 1 1/4" hex bar I used to make Jap Bike starter nuts from. Milled a slot to fit the fork tube. Tigged a band around it so the slot couldn't spread. Now you can nail it with an impact gun, and 1 1/4" socket. Works every time.
John
[attach=0,msg1347901]   

[rigidthumper]

And if you're not a handy as John, you can get one of these.

[JW113]

I don't have that socket, might pick one up it's cheap enough. However, depending on the part in question, heat is no worse and possibly less concern than beating on it. For this case, I would not hesitate to do it again should the need arise. I see nothing that can be damaged from heating the top of the tube. Might get a little smoky, though.


-JW

[Adam76]

I've come across a few that were quite stuck. I have a 15" adjustable wrench that I use on them. Remove the pinch bolt and replace it with a Grade 8. Lower the tube to get the wrench on the cap, tighten the pinch bolt really tight, then use a 5lb or so hammer and beat on the end of the wrench. If the tube still rotates in the clamp, tighten the pinch bolt more. Don't worry about the bolt, you are going to replace it again when you're done.

If that still will not break it free..... get out the torch and heat the tube at the top where the cap threads are. That will always cause it to crack free.

-JW

Thanks JW,  that was exactly going to be my game plan.  Cheers, will let you know how i go today.

[Adam76]

And if you're not a handy as John, you can get one of these.

Thanks rigid, yeah I've seen those - $30 Australian not too bad but add the  $USD  shipping and I can't justify $60+ for a one time use socket....... I will try JWs method or even try and weld ond up like John has done.
Cheers

[Adam76]

A fool proof deal I made years ago. 1 1/4" hex bar I used to make Jap Bike starter nuts from. Milled a slot to fit the fork tube. Tigged a band around it so the slot couldn't spread. Now you can nail it with an impact gun, and 1 1/4" socket. Works every time.
John
[attach=0,msg1347901]

👍  looks good. Dont think my skills are as good as yours. Might be an opportunity to practice my welding skills 😁

[FSG]

the only thing in there from a heat perspective is an o-ring and it's replaceable

so JW is on the money

[JW113]

There are some things that are safe to heat, and some not. If they are heat treated, applying a torch is going to take the treatment out. If it's a wear or strength surface, not good. If simply structural, no problemo. Forks are made from cold formed steel tubing, and not heat treated. They are chrome plated for corrosion and wear, and heat will mess up the color where you apply it, but not in the region of concern (at the sliders). Yep, that O-ring is gonna get toasted, but when rebuilding forks, you need to replace pretty much all the soft parts.

-JW