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M8 big bore success stories

Started by riders1.jt, June 28, 2020, 01:29:17 PM

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kd

Quote from: BigT on October 06, 2020, 04:30:39 PM
Quote from: No Cents on October 06, 2020, 09:19:39 AM
    I'm sorry and it's none of my business but I don't see how they think your bike is tuned properly with the two graphs you have shown.
    The 1st graph shows only 3 pulls being made, and the last one at least shows six pulls. I'm no tuner but I don't see how they can properly tune a bike with so few pulls.
I just can't get over the low HP output of this build. Most 124" builds with the Woods 408 cam, and larger throttle body are closer to 140 hp. If it was my bike I'd be digging a little deeper for some missing power.

Quote from: kd on October 06, 2020, 04:53:27 PM
Sumping?

Quote from: BigT on October 06, 2020, 05:08:08 PM
Quote from: kd on October 06, 2020, 04:53:27 PM
Sumping?
I had a built 117" Twin Cam that I thought was running good...had it on a dyno and it was making 100 hp due to sumping.  It made 130+ once it was straightened out.


All things above considered in comparison that's about the same amount of missing average power for this combination. Has it been checked for sumping?
KD

boggart

Quote from: riders1.jt on October 05, 2020, 05:05:01 PM
Well I got the inserts in. Got the bike dyno tuned AGAIN. This was a 4th gear pull. Was hoping for a little more hp & tq. But it's smooth and stout throughout the gears...

That is a HUGE improvement in curves!

riders1.jt

 Hey guys. Thanks for the replies. I had a big bummer moment today. I did a cold cranking compression test. I unhooked the fuel line and deactivated the acr with my power vision. Pulled the outside plugs and checked each cylinder. Only 170ccp! I thought well maybe the ACRs aren't deactivating. So I pulled the tank and unplugged them. Still only got 180ccp. Definitely something wrong with this build....

kd

October 07, 2020, 07:33:40 PM #53 Last Edit: October 07, 2020, 07:47:36 PM by kd
For what it's worth, I don't think anyone was criticizing your build in any derogatory manner.  To me it just didn't fit the average expectations.  I guess you felt the same.  You've taken the right approach by investigating the foundation.  My understanding is the M8 has good compression and by that I mean more than your best test of 180.  That may not be enough for that cam. It could be cam timing late 1 tooth that can cause low compression but still run reasonable. If the tech didn't check the deck height and the pistons are down in the hole too far with a .045 head gasket that will make a difference. It may be other issues too.  Did you hold the throttle plate open when testing? How many hits did you give it taking the test? Is your battery up to it? (consider a jump from a car battery doing the test) Keep sharing your findings.

BTW, it looks like the Wood 408 cam likes 11:1 compression.  That seems to be what Fuel Moto builds them (128) at and Jaimie would have tested the build.  Here's some info from his m8 testing thread and the first one is a 124 with the 408 cam.

https://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php/topic,102329.msg1268791.html#msg1268791
KD

riders1.jt

 Thanks for the reply. I did hold the throttle wide open and turned it til the gauge stopped. Battery was tended and I kept the tender on before I did the second test with the ACRs unplugged. Think I should of warmed it up? Think I should put my battery charger on start hook it up to the battery and try it? Seemed to turn over pretty good.  I agree with your statements about the cam etc...Thanks again...

Jamie Long

For those following along i've been in touch with this customer over the past several weeks. I'm in full agreement this build is missing a fair chunk of power and unfortunately he's hit some road blocks with the shop that did the build. I've reviewed his info and recommended he perform a compression test, upon doing so its coming up way short. We build this combo day in day out and they crank 220+, and while difficult to make a definitive conclusion having not seen the bike there is a strong chance the cam timing is off.
The integrity of our kits is something that is very important the me, I made a recommendation today to bring us the bike and made the offer i'd diagnose, get to the bottom of the issue, and repair it for no charge; the only cost being a full dyno tune for $449.00. I will personally make sure the bike is turn key, the only thing I ask is we'll need to orchestrate it around our schedule. I truly hope we'll get the opportunity to make this build what it should be.

kd

October 07, 2020, 09:04:13 PM #56 Last Edit: October 07, 2020, 09:15:00 PM by kd
Well that about says it all.  That's a heck of an offer :up: :beer:
KD

Hossamania

I agree, that is really stepping up to the plate. It's unfortunate the op is having such troubles.
If the government gives you everything you want,
it can take away everything you have.

riders1.jt

 Fuel Moto has been with me through this whole ordeal. Their customer service is second to none. I'm done with the testing and racking my brain to find power that just isn't there. I'm waiting for a quote from Haulbikes to get it to Jamie. This is an offer I can't refuse. I'd ride it to Wisconsin myself if I could get that much time off work, but unfortunately this is not the case. Thank you Jamie. I'll be in touch.

kd

I hope (suspect) the original shop that did the work is going to learn something here.
KD

No Cents

   Very nice offer Jamie!    :up:
08 FLHX my grocery getter, 124ci, wfolarry 110" heads, Burns pipe, 158/152 sae

hattitude

Quote from: No Cents on October 08, 2020, 08:42:40 AM

   Very nice offer Jamie!    :up:


I'm not surprised....

One thing I noticed when dealing with FuelMoto during my 124" crate engine install/tune, Jaime really does care about the performance of his products and the satisfaction of his customers..

I'll skip the details, but during my experience, Jaime made a suggestion, that in the end, saved me almost $1K... I didn't expect it, ask for it, or even consider it... It was all from him..

Good customer service, good people...   :up:

klammer76

Nice going Jamie. As always, Fuel Moto is top notch.

riders1.jt

 My bike is on its way to Wisconsin. I'm very interested to see what they find and fix for it to reach its full potential...  Thanks again Jamie!

vetteandharley

  Been following this thread, what was the outcome?   :scratch:

Jamie Long

Quote from: vetteandharley on November 10, 2020, 09:36:58 AM
  Been following this thread, what was the outcome?   :scratch:

Bike was delivered here yesterday afternoon. It will be next week before we're able to get a look at it.

vetteandharley

  Still curious what the problem with this bike was.  TIA

RTMike

Let's hear some input on this bike and the outcome of the trip to Jamie

riders1.jt

 I got the bike back from Fuelmoto a couple of days ago. My shipper took awhile.  It sounds sooo much better. When the ice melts I'll be testing it out. I won't go into details about what the problem was in an effort not to embarrass the original builder. Let's just say they made a huge mistake and Jamie and his guys straightened everything out. I'm beyond thankful and relieved. I'll let Jamie explain the details if he chooses to do so. They truly are the best.. #fuelmoto4life!

Hossamania

Congratulations!
Good on Jamie for getting that straightened out for you, looks like you are going to have a lot of fun with it.
If the government gives you everything you want,
it can take away everything you have.

kd

That's great news.  I do hope Jamie feels he can find a way to explain what the mistake was (without trash talking the builder  :embarrassed: ).  There is much to be learned from that type of information sharing for both the builder(s) and those of us that get satisfaction from doing our own work.
KD

FLSTFIDave

Glad Jamie got it figured out.  Looks like it will be a fun ride this spring now that its sorted out.
2023 CVO Road Glide Whiskey Neat
2021 Pan America Special, Gray,  2003 Fatboy

Hossamania

January 03, 2021, 07:12:13 AM #72 Last Edit: January 03, 2021, 08:43:24 AM by Hossamania
Has the shop that did the work been made aware of their mistake, not to harangue them, but to help them with future builds?
And yes, I think it would be interesting and helpful to know what the issue is. Certainly no reason to name the shop, and technically not allowed here to bash other companies.
If the government gives you everything you want,
it can take away everything you have.

BigT

Quote from: riders1.jt on January 02, 2021, 08:37:39 AM
I got the bike back from Fuelmoto a couple of days ago. My shipper took awhile.  It sounds sooo much better. When the ice melts I'll be testing it out. I won't go into details about what the problem was in an effort not to embarrass the original builder. Let's just say they made a huge mistake and Jamie and his guys straightened everything out. I'm beyond thankful and relieved. I'll let Jamie explain the details if he chooses to do so. They truly are the best.. #fuelmoto4life!
You never named the original builder so how would telling us what was found to be the problem embarrass anyone? I would guess cam timing was incorrect by the low cranking compression.

kd

KD