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Ignition module for a 89 FXR

Started by 1340evo, July 13, 2021, 02:02:46 PM

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1340evo

I've been looking on e-bay at the available modules for sale and getting all sorts of numbers for a 89 FXR?
32421-85b, 32410-91, 32405-91, 32433-91 etc?
Does anyone know what the differance is with all of these as all the above are listed as being for a 89 FXR?

I have a VOES on the bike so guess I need one to work with that, but are all the curves differant in these units, or is it just something silly like the plug thats fitted?

In my application the plugs are gone anyway so that don't matter too much to me.

Just looking as reading one of my old posts, it don't look like the unit is advancing and retarding right? https://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php/topic,113557.0/topicseen.html

Or do I just rip it all out and fit a nose cone unit??

Scotty

If you have a black 7 pin Cannon plug you can run any of the modules even with an adapter to convert the 7 pin to a 8 pin Deutsch ignition.
Run a later Dyna one or preferably get an adjustable ignition line a Dyna 2000p or rip it out and put in a Dyna 2000i in the nosecone.

hogget

i can recommend the dyna/ultima  2000i nosecone module - replaces the sensor in the nose and the ecu - fitted to my 1988 flstc
very easy and worked straight out of the box - about 1/3 the price of hd sensor and ecu
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/141637555572
says it fits an 89 dyna
good luck
rory

1340evo

Thanks for the info Guy's. I don't have a plug as the guy before soldered everything which does look neater, but also needs re-doing at some point.
When you say I can use any of them, don't they come with different curves and advance? the max on the BT is 35 deg, but a sportster I think goes beyond this. Or maybe you mean any ECU from a BT?
Would a FXR have the same curve? I know the VOES comes in earlier on a lighter bike, so maybe this is the only difference.. but if it is.. why so many part codes for the things?

I think the cone units are a great idea, as you say it replaces a lot of components on the bike and is easy to use. But have see posts on them failing due to heat etc?

turboprop

Quote from: 1340evo on July 14, 2021, 01:14:47 AM
Thanks for the info Guy's. I don't have a plug as the guy before soldered everything which does look neater, but also needs re-doing at some point.
When you say I can use any of them, don't they come with different curves and advance? the max on the BT is 35 deg, but a sportster I think goes beyond this. Or maybe you mean any ECU from a BT?
Would a FXR have the same curve? I know the VOES comes in earlier on a lighter bike, so maybe this is the only difference.. but if it is.. why so many part codes for the things?

I think the cone units are a great idea, as you say it replaces a lot of components on the bike and is easy to use. But have see posts on them failing due to heat etc?

You can use any aftermarket module for evo powered big twins. They will all have an assortment of curves and settings. I would not waste anytime looking at oem harley modules.
'We' like this' - Said by the one man operation.

1340evo

July 14, 2021, 09:30:20 AM #5 Last Edit: July 14, 2021, 09:56:03 AM by 1340evo
so I've ordered the Dyna 2000i  :)
any bad reports on this one at all?

Will I need a new coil if I use it dual fire initially?


lumberjacklloyd

I do not recommend the nose cone modules; I have seen multiple fail due to heat. Crane, Dyna and Ultima.

If you have the option to switch between dual and single you do not need a new coil.

1340evo

I can fit a vented cover ;)     anyway, its never that hot in the uk :)

Scotty

I have a Dyna 2000i fitted and so far 5 years on this one and not an issue at all in the nosecone and it gets hot here in Australia.
Biggest thing is how close the exhaust runs to the nosecone and how well tuned your bike is in regards to heat.
I have seen external modules fail and internal but that is the roll of the dice we all play.

Fugawee

I have an 88' FLSTC, and a 94' FLHTC that both have Crane HI-4 Nosecone Units in them.  I installed both of them in 1995.  Haven't had any problems with either Bike, or those units with approx. 170 thousand miles between the two of them.  Good Luck on what You should decide.

1340evo

July 14, 2021, 11:27:47 PM #10 Last Edit: July 14, 2021, 11:40:02 PM by 1340evo
well, for £150 delivered in the UK, we'll risk it. (its actually a Ultima I ordered.. are they exact the same unit)

Just reading the manual for them last night.. what can't they do!.. look a fantastic piece of kit.

1340evo

Why am I so unlucky on things shipped from the US  :emsad:

The shop has just mailed me to say they have shipped a kickstart version and not one with the 3 cranks before it fires which is the one I ordered  :cry:

Does this matter.. otherwise is it the same unit  :nix:  I know you can get software and a cable to go into them and change the setting...

FFS.. it's unbelievable on overseas shipments, you'd expect them to take a lot more care ??

motorhogman

Quote from: 1340evo on July 15, 2021, 07:18:07 AM
Why am I so unlucky on things shipped from the US  :emsad:

The shop has just mailed me to say they have shipped a kickstart version and not one with the 3 cranks before it fires which is the one I ordered  :cry:

Does this matter.. otherwise is it the same unit  :nix:  I know you can get software and a cable to go into them and change the setting...

FFS.. it's unbelievable on overseas shipments, you'd expect them to take a lot more care ??

You are not alone there. Seems the world has become incompetent. I just ordered a new office chair.. Brown, max height 23 1/2 inches.  First FED EX put it on the wrong truck.. (again, same thing happened last month with a new battery I ordered) When the chair arrives and it's black and max height is only 22 inches.   :banghead:
where's the points and condenser ?<br />Tom / aka motor

1340evo

July 15, 2021, 01:20:32 PM #13 Last Edit: July 15, 2021, 02:19:23 PM by 1340evo
Further info.. they may of been able to swap it out last minute  :dgust:  How come they don't know ??

reading a few posts and they say the Dyna and the Ultima has different curvs.. is this correct...Whats best for a 89  1340?

Scotty

Quote from: 1340evo on July 15, 2021, 01:20:32 PM
Further info.. they may of been able to swap it out last minute  :dgust:  How come they don't know ??

reading a few posts and they say the Dyna and the Ultima has different curvs.. is this correct...Whats best for a 89  1340?

Never used the Ultima version but have read on multiple sites that its curves are more aggressive than the Dynatek one.
Lot's of people running the Ultima or Dynatek one on curve 1 or 2 just depends what your motor likes and if you have a cam or not and how much compression.
You can use the programming cable and program the Dynatek curves in and vice versa so it's not a big deal.

1340evo

Quote from: Scotty on July 15, 2021, 07:12:30 PM
Quote from: 1340evo on July 15, 2021, 01:20:32 PM
Further info.. they may of been able to swap it out last minute  :dgust:  How come they don't know ??

reading a few posts and they say the Dyna and the Ultima has different curvs.. is this correct...Whats best for a 89  1340?

Never used the Ultima version but have read on multiple sites that its curves are more aggressive than the Dynatek one.
Lot's of people running the Ultima or Dynatek one on curve 1 or 2 just depends what your motor likes and if you have a cam or not and how much compression.
You can use the programming cable and program the Dynatek curves in and vice versa so it's not a big deal.

Okay, i'll have a look for a cable and assume I need software??

By the sound of things, the curve you need for a more standard set up is somewhere in the middle of the Dyna and the Ultima?

Scotty

Quote from: 1340evo on July 16, 2021, 12:31:56 AM
Okay, i'll have a look for a cable and assume I need software??

By the sound of things, the curve you need for a more standard set up is somewhere in the middle of the Dyna and the Ultima?

Software from here https://www.dynaonline.com/downloads/software-firmware/

Dyna curve works for me and really if bike is stock Ultima curve will work no problems. It's only when you have modified the motor etc that is becomes an issue.

1340evo

thanks for that.
A few tweaks on the motor that's all.
Ported heads, slight increase on the compression, EV27 cam, K&N filter, V&H pipes.. so std curve will be good i'm sure.. But I do like to mess so will be in there taking a look :)

91evo

You will not need a cable or software with the Ultima unit.
Instructions for the unit are pretty good so you will be able to set it up for your engine combo without any problems, the stock curve will be fine.
I have used the Ultima in 2 bikes without any problems, both with upgraded cams/carbs and exhaust.

Also no problems with heat, I am in Australia also.

Dave.

1340evo

Quote from: 91evo on July 19, 2021, 03:14:59 PM
You will not need a cable or software with the Ultima unit.
Instructions for the unit are pretty good so you will be able to set it up for your engine combo without any problems, the stock curve will be fine.
I have used the Ultima in 2 bikes without any problems, both with upgraded cams/carbs and exhaust.

Also no problems with heat, I am in Australia also.

Dave.

Thanks, that's good to know. What curve do you run?.. number 1?

91evo

Sorry for late reply.
Yeah i run curve 1, the old girl runs fine,Easier cold starts and def a smoother ride.

Dave.



Winston Wolf

I don't understand why people don't just get a Daytona Twin Tec that plugs right in to the stock harness, fits in the same spot as the original ignition, and has unlimited curves you can make yourself...

Dan89flstc

Quote from: Winston Wolf on July 22, 2021, 05:05:51 AM
I don't understand why people don't just get a Daytona Twin Tec that plugs right in to the stock harness, fits in the same spot as the original ignition, and has unlimited curves you can make yourself...

Maybe they want to get rid of that old harness that connected the sensor to the box, maybe they don`t want the box period.

Not everyone likes the same flavor ice cream.
US Navy Veteran
A&P Mechanic

Burnout

The early models don't have a harness, it is part of the OEM module.

The OEM replacement modules have a plug.

You have to buy a separate harness or locate the parts to install a connector to plug in the new module.
They don't call me Ironhead Rick just because I'm "hard headed"

turboprop

Lots of wrong information this thread.

1. That '89 big twin (model is irrelevant) had a sensor in the nose cone with a round connector that plugged into the harness.

The module the OP has purchased does NOT use a separate sensor and module. The Dyna module he purchased is a sensor/module unit that fits in the nose cone and does touch the oem harness. The wires from that Dyna module are run directly to the coil and the VOES that is located right next to it. It draws its power from the oem harness that is attached to one of the terminals on the coil. NOTHING needs to be done to the oem wires. Simply leave everything as they are. Run the wires from the new module directly to the coil as specified in the instructions provided by Dyna. No need to do anything with the unused receptacle that the oem sensor plugged into. Tape it up, whatever.

It really is this simple.
'We' like this' - Said by the one man operation.

Scotty

Quote from: turboprop on July 22, 2021, 12:57:00 PM
Lots of wrong information this thread.

1. That '89 big twin (model is irrelevant) had a sensor in the nose cone with a round connector that plugged into the harness.
It really is this simple.

Perhaps if you had bothered to read the whole thread you might have seen this from the OP

Thanks for the info Guy's. I don't have a plug as the guy before soldered everything which does look neater, but also needs re-doing at some point.
things?


Yes! he does not have a plug as the owner before him cut it off.
We are dealing with old bikes that in a lot of cases have had previous owners and they are not stock.

hogget

i'm not sure about the op's problem with not having a 'plug'. my experience is as turbo says, the ultima doesn't plug into the harness, except for the voes wire - i'm pretty sure it just connects to the coils and the little switches are simple to set up
am i missing something?
rory

Scotty

Quote from: hogget on July 22, 2021, 10:49:25 PM
i'm not sure about the op's problem with not having a 'plug'. my experience is as turbo says, the ultima doesn't plug into the harness, except for the voes wire - i'm pretty sure it just connects to the coils and the little switches are simple to set up
am i missing something?
rory

Just pointing out there is no plug and he will have to cut and seal wires from the existing harness as they have been soldered by the previous owner.
Simple if you read the entire thread but not if you jump in and ASSume there is a plug when there is not.

1340evo

yes, not a problem not having a plug at all. Ill maybe put a connector under the side cover (FXR) and I can fit either unit that way by bringing the VOSE and coil wires back to that.

It's in the UK so here soon :)

Scotty

Quote from: 1340evo on July 23, 2021, 12:32:22 AM
yes, not a problem not having a plug at all. Ill maybe put a connector under the side cover (FXR) and I can fit either unit that way by bringing the VOSE and coil wires back to that.

It's in the UK so here soon :)

That is right there is not problem having no plug and nothing wrong with any information supplied in this thread as someone else suggested.
Besides the male half of the round plug is no longer available and can't be bought except from rip-off merchants on Ebay or some supplier in the USA who won't ship to the UK or Australia  :hyst:

turboprop

No, nothing about the existing harness has to modified or even touched. From the factory the harness has a 12V lead going to one of the terminals on the coil. This provides the power for the aftermarket nose cone ignition module.

Again, simply run the wires from the nose cone module to the coil. No need to do anything to the factory harness and wether the plug for the ignition sensor is present or not is irrelevant. If there are exposed wire ends they should be dealt with but no need to do anything.
'We' like this' - Said by the one man operation.

Scotty

Quote from: turboprop on July 23, 2021, 08:11:19 AM
No, nothing about the existing harness has to modified or even touched. From the factory the harness has a 12V lead going to one of the terminals on the coil. This provides the power for the aftermarket nose cone ignition module.

Again, simply run the wires from the nose cone module to the coil. No need to do anything to the factory harness and wether the plug for the ignition sensor is present or not is irrelevant. If there are exposed wire ends they should be dealt with but no need to do anything.

You are simply wrong with the first statement as many late model Evo's only have one black/white wire running to one side of the coil and you have to to go back into the harness to find where the white wire joins to that back white wire and separate it from the black/white wire in the harness and join it to the white wire from the new internal ignition to the coil. Since we are talking about Evo's in this thread and not just FXR's you have to consider other people reading this with late model Evo's will read your statement and possibly think that HD just changed the color of the wire when in reality they change how and where.

As per the Dyna 2000i instruction sheet.
3. Coil connection. Typically, there is a white wire from the Run/Stop switch on one of the coil primary terminals. On
the same terminal, there is a second white wire going to the stock ignition module. These wires are the +12V supply
to the coil and the +12V supply wire to the stock ignition module. On the other coil primary terminal, you should find
a pink wire from the stock ignition module. This is the coil minus wire from the ignition module. There may be a
second pink wire from the tach. Remove all these wires from the coil.

Note: On later model bikes, there is only one white wire (w/black stripe) and one pink (w/black stripe) connected to
the coil. The +12 volt supply for the module, and the tach input, are spliced into the harness at some other point.
Locate the original white wire on the bike that is the +12v supply from the ignition switch to the coil (discussed
above). Connect this original white wire and the white wire from the DYNA 2000i to one of the coil primary terminals.
Locate the pink wire from the DYNA 2000i. Connect this wire to the unconnected primary terminal on the coil.



1340evo

Does anyone have a programming cable for these units, or maybe know the pin out for it so I can make one?

they don't sell them any more.

turboprop

Quote from: 1340evo on August 05, 2021, 09:59:32 AM
Does anyone have a programming cable for these units, or maybe know the pin out for it so I can make one?

they don't sell them any more.

Dyna Tech does sell the programing cable for the 2000i, it is currently on their website and shows as in stock. $127.99.
'We' like this' - Said by the one man operation.

1340evo

Quote from: turboprop on August 05, 2021, 12:06:51 PM
Quote from: 1340evo on August 05, 2021, 09:59:32 AM
Does anyone have a programming cable for these units, or maybe know the pin out for it so I can make one?

they don't sell them any more.

Dyna Tech does sell the programing cable for the 2000i, it is currently on their website and shows as in stock. $127.99.

Ouch.. guess I looked at the copy one someone was doing... same question.. anyone have the pin out for it  :teeth: