Author Topic: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control  (Read 865 times)

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Offline aharp

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08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« on: June 20, 2021, 01:24:48 PM »
I built a FBW harness for my 01 T-sport a couple years ago and been having a blast with it. I used an 08-09 touring ecm and calibration. But like so many before me with 08-09 touring bikes and from what I saw when I was in the industry, these cals seem to occasionally lose track of the butterfly home position and idle somewhere between 1500 and 2000 rpm, leading one to cycle the ignition switch multiple times to get it to reset. Harley and TTS claim it's from inadvertently leaving your hand on the throttle while hitting the kill switch to which I call B.S. Has anyone discovered anything that is a true cause of this?
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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2021, 01:34:08 PM »
I have an '08 and an 09' touring. The '08 has a TTS MAP and the '09 is PV. I've honestly never had either one of them do this, although I've heard from some they have experienced it. But I always let my bikes idle a minute before shutting them off. Not because of this, but because back in the carb. days I always shut the fuel off and let the bike idle a minute to help reduce the fuel in the active circuit to the carb. It's just a habit now. So one could assume I haven't experienced it because of my letting them idle. 
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Offline aharp

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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2021, 02:10:25 PM »
I have an '08 and an 09' touring. The '08 has a TTS MAP and the '09 is PV. I've honestly never had either one of them do this, although I've heard from some they have experienced it. But I always let my bikes idle a minute before shutting them off. Not because of this, but because back in the carb. days I always shut the fuel off and let the bike idle a minute to help reduce the fuel in the active circuit to the carb. It's just a habit now. So one could assume I haven't experienced it because of my letting them idle.

That is a thought actually. And easy enough to try. It doesn't happen every time I get the scoot out, but it's happened to me often enough that it is annoying. Being the butterfly is constantly adjusting maybe I just need to let it "settle" before I park it. I'm usually in a hurry cause I'm a busy guy. I stop just short of throwing the bike down in the yard like an old ten speed.
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Offline kd

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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2021, 04:39:38 PM »
It has been discussed here before and IIRC some of the tuners confirmed that the ECM takes note of the last idle speed and position and reuses it for the next start-up. The claim was it is self inflicted in most cases and can be avoided. I believe shutting it off while still moving or too soon after was another cause.  I notice my 2011 does not idle right down until fully stopped and seems to be reading the fact it is still rolling. (it'll often hold at about 1400 and slow with the rate of speed but not drop to 1050 idle speed)  That probably allows you to throttle up again in a slow traffic situation without having it stall at too low of an RPM to do the work. There may be other causes like TB malfunction not returning to fully closed.
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Offline rigidthumper

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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2021, 06:29:59 PM »
I started using my right hand to operate the ignition switch to kill the engine instead of the run/stop switch- never had an issue after that.   
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Offline Mirrmu

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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2021, 05:28:39 PM »
check seals on throttle body

Offline aharp

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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2021, 11:20:27 PM »
It has been discussed here before and IIRC some of the tuners confirmed that the ECM takes note of the last idle speed and position and reuses it for the next start-up. The claim was it is self inflicted in most cases and can be avoided. I believe shutting it off while still moving or too soon after was another cause.  I notice my 2011 does not idle right down until fully stopped and seems to be reading the fact it is still rolling. (it'll often hold at about 1400 and slow with the rate of speed but not drop to 1050 idle speed)  That probably allows you to throttle up again in a slow traffic situation without having it stall at too low of an RPM to do the work. There may be other causes like TB malfunction not returning to fully closed.

So to update this post...I have been very conscious after a ride of getting off the bike and going about my business while letting it sit and idle for 30 or so seconds. I have not had a single instance of the high idle on cold start up since. There must be something to this.
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Offline hrdtail78

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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2021, 12:08:24 PM »
Doesn't make much sense to me.  We have no control over the blade until the engine is running with the tgs, but first thing that happens with power on is the blade parks itself.  (finds reference of zero throttle)  Then the IAC cranking steps, IAC crank to run, and then it will enter it's closed loop idle target.  Seems like this would wipe out anything it learned during shut down??

Replacing a battery in the older MM's had a procedure, but with the delphi.  You can unplug the ECM.  Swap battery and plug it back in and I have never had trouble starting after that.  Wouldn't that also wipe what was learned during shutdown?  I don't have any answers but I am curious with what is actually going on.
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Offline Coyote

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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2021, 12:36:55 PM »

Offline FSG

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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2021, 02:43:59 PM »

Offline aharp

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Re: 08-09 touring cals and loss of idle speed control
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2021, 04:52:34 PM »


I have this tech tip from my dealership days, I should've dug it out. Admittedly, I do not know the history of the particular TGS I used so that could be the culprit. A voltage variance would really be the only thing I could see causing such an issue.
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