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Antigravity ATX30-RS

Started by Ohio HD, September 19, 2021, 04:28:15 PM

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Ohio HD

The Antigravity ATX30-RS battery has two sets of terminals, so the battery can be used in different applications. Do they supply plastic covers for the two sets of terminals that you won't be using? Or do you have to fab something yourself?



Rockout Rocker Products

www.rockout.biz Stop the top end TAPPING!!

kd

My ATX30-HD came with at least 2 (one ea. red and black) and a pair of protective rails that fit under the battery.  If you need them I'll bet a phone call or email will do it. I can tell you that my extra posts are in use for charge and heated gear Jack's. They are a great addition to a touring bike.

I don't know your intention with the RS version is but you should be aware that your seat will have to be removed to access the restart button. It was initially intended to have a remote but production was delayed.  For that reason, I chose to use the HD version. It has 970 CCA as compared to the RS at 880 CCA.  The difference is the HD has a lower voltage protection and can be reset (turned back on) with enough cranking amps to restart by simply tickling the positive side anywhere (like the starter lug) with 12 volts. A small jump pac or a wire from another vehicle or battery will suffice.  The HD is more tolerant to heavy draw with the lower protection point setting and is less likely to switch itself off.  That's why AG recommends the HD over the restart for big high compression engines even though many say the RS has worked flawlessly for them.
KD

Ohio HD


Ohio HD

Quote from: kd on September 19, 2021, 05:52:33 PM
My ATX30-HD came with at least 2 (one ea. red and black) and a pair of protective rails that fit under the battery.  If you need them I'll bet a phone call or email will do it. I can tell you that my extra posts are in use for charge and heated gear Jack's. They are a great addition to a touring bike.

I don't know your intention with the RS version is but you should be aware that your seat will have to be removed to access the restart button. It was initially intended to have a remote but production was delayed.  For that reason, I chose to use the HD version. It has 970 CCA as compared to the RS at 880 CCA.  The difference is the HD has a lower voltage protection and can be reset (turned back on) with enough cranking amps to restart by simply tickling the positive side anywhere (like the starter lug) with 12 volts. A small jump pac or a wire from another vehicle or battery will suffice.  The HD is more tolerant to heavy draw with the lower protection point setting and is less likely to switch itself off.  That's why AG recommends the HD over the restart for big high compression engines even though many say the RS has worked flawlessly for them.

The restart feature is a great bonus for just in case. I spin over my 124" with 380 cca now. So the 880 cca will be more than enough. I need a new battery for the 124", so I may as well jump in with both feet, get one of these and a CTEK charger.

I was just curious about the additional terminals being exposed. A little Gorilla Tape will insure they stay there.



kd

September 19, 2021, 06:25:02 PM #5 Last Edit: September 19, 2021, 06:32:00 PM by kd
To AG's point, any accidental power draw like key on, lights, stereo, security etc can bite you and shut the battery down to protect it.  It may just draw it down and when you try to start it the starter draw pulls (spikes) the voltage draw down to the protection point before the engine rolls and shuts it off.  The HD allows it to spike much lower and reserves more because it has more.

I bet you'll put the extra terminals into service and won't use the caps.  Your CTEC  badger comes with a specially configured water proof jack and as said I added that and other jacks for my heated gear which double to reset the battery (which has never been required). The bottom of the seat is nylon or plastic and doesn't come close to contact and likely won't need them. 

BTW, I also dropped $35 on the Battery Tracker so I could monitor all aspects of charging and cranking performance. It's a neat gadget and Bluetooth to my phone.  It gave me a greater appreciation of what the battery is capable of.  It has a memory and I even used it to see the exact time I started the bike to leave and reach destination points.  :teeth:
KD

Ohio HD

The seat doesn't come close because the ECM and ECM/battery bracket are above the battery. I'll only use the CTEK when the bike sits a while. As far as gadgets, mehh, it's a motorcycle. I never even turn the radio on except for on a long ride when on open road and no traffic. I prefer to listen to the bike, it's part of the experience of riding them.


TN

Do yourself a favor and call the company to discuss battery for your application. I bet they won't recommend the RS model.


Just trying to help based on real world experience.
Just Ride..........

Ohio HD

Quote from: TN on September 20, 2021, 03:59:00 AM
Do yourself a favor and call the company to discuss battery for your application. I bet they won't recommend the RS model.


Just trying to help based on real world experience.

I suspect that you know something, so why not tell us?

hattitude

Quote from: Ohio HD on September 20, 2021, 07:58:11 AM
Quote from: TN on September 20, 2021, 03:59:00 AM
Do yourself a favor and call the company to discuss battery for your application. I bet they won't recommend the RS model.


Just trying to help based on real world experience.

I suspect that you know something, so why not tell us?

He's just echoing what Kd posted...

They recommend the HD version, that has the lower voltage protection point, for larger displacement engines.

I sent them an email, asking why the restart battery is not recommended for my 124" engine. This was their reply..


Staff <info@antigravitybatteries.com>

To:
hattitudexxxxxx@yahoo.com


Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 2:35 PM

Hello Bernie,

Thank you for reaching out to us.

Those 103 ci and larger engines create a very high current draw, so they can trigger the Restart feature of the ATX30-RS.
In other words, the battery itself can handle that engine just fine, but its Restart parameters for the "sleep mode" are not set up for that kind of a draw.
Kind of like how some cars could easily reach 160 mph but are electronically limited to 140 mph.

For your bike we recommend the ATX30-HD. It doesn't come with the Restart feature, but still offers full BMS and all the protections, while packing even more cranking power and a higher capacity. This battery allows for a higher draw those engine create. 

If you can fit Yuasa's YTX20 battery in your bike (6.89 x 3.4 x 5.12 in), then you can use the ATX20-HD, the YTX12-20, and the YTX12-24 as well.

I hope this helps, but please let me know if you have any additional questions.

Best Regards,
Sonny

Ohio HD


TN

Quote from: Ohio HD on September 20, 2021, 07:58:11 AM
Quote from: TN on September 20, 2021, 03:59:00 AM
Do yourself a favor and call the company to discuss battery for your application. I bet they won't recommend the RS model.


Just trying to help based on real world experience.

I suspect that you know something, so why not tell us?

Using their search function on their website suggested my stock cvo 110 to use the RS model you listed, then if you look further there is statements not to use the RS model on such. After I had ordered one I caught that and called, I shipped the order back and they wouldn't refund my monies for shipping either way, left a bad taste in my mouth, tried to reach out to them and no response.


YMMV

I'm just a parts changer BTW, so wut the heck do I know. I can ride though.  :SM:
Just Ride..........

Ohio HD

Turboprop, what's your take on the restart battery?



Quote from: turboprop on July 07, 2020, 12:38:42 PM
I have not talked with anyone at AG. Ever. My history with these things is I was an early adopter of Lithium batteries. Loved the light weight, slow to non existent discharge, and incredible power. Early on there were nay sayers about about having to warm them up in cold temps. That turned out to be a non issue, but the real issue was letting the voltage get too low. Unlike a traditional AGM there is no bringing one of these back. I bricked a bunch lithium batteries from a bunch of different brands, including a pre-restart AG and a Twin Power unit. All of the brick-ings were my own fault. I left something on and walked away without knowing. When I saw the re-start video, it was like a light bulb had turned on. Whalla! The one in my red/white FXR with the TC124 with 12.9 compression is going on three years. That battery has gone into re-start mode a few times (my own fault), but every time I simply press the button and it fires up. Immediately. About that firing up, the voltage drop with this battery is negligible. Admittedly, the rest of the system is pretty robust, bordering somewhat on ridiculous. , but this engine fires (not cranks) immediately when the start button is pressed. No cranking, no waiting for the crankshaft to spin three times. Press the button, instant ignition. Always. A bunch of my friends bought into th Twin Power batteries when they came out. They worked great, but did not have any type of internal protection like re-start. Myself and everyone I know have bricked them. TP explained what we did wrong and even offered to comp me one. But i recognized it was my fault and bought a re-start battery. Best battery I have ever had. I have the same battery in both of my FXRs equipped  with high compression TC124 engines.

kd

Brian, just so you know, what I was saying and I am sure you get it, both the RS and HD have the protection (as pointed out by Hattitude) but the procedure to reactivate is different.  Because the RS button is under the ECM it can be more hassle to reset than having a harness connector off the spare terminals that you can "tickle" from an external position with ease and no tools. Plus it has way more power and therefore reserve to the BCM cutout point.
KD

turboprop

Quote from: Ohio HD on September 20, 2021, 09:03:08 AM
Turboprop, what's your take on the restart battery?



Quote from: turboprop on July 07, 2020, 12:38:42 PM
I have not talked with anyone at AG. Ever. My history with these things is I was an early adopter of Lithium batteries. Loved the light weight, slow to non existent discharge, and incredible power. Early on there were nay sayers about about having to warm them up in cold temps. That turned out to be a non issue, but the real issue was letting the voltage get too low. Unlike a traditional AGM there is no bringing one of these back. I bricked a bunch lithium batteries from a bunch of different brands, including a pre-restart AG and a Twin Power unit. All of the brick-ings were my own fault. I left something on and walked away without knowing. When I saw the re-start video, it was like a light bulb had turned on. Whalla! The one in my red/white FXR with the TC124 with 12.9 compression is going on three years. That battery has gone into re-start mode a few times (my own fault), but every time I simply press the button and it fires up. Immediately. About that firing up, the voltage drop with this battery is negligible. Admittedly, the rest of the system is pretty robust, bordering somewhat on ridiculous. , but this engine fires (not cranks) immediately when the start button is pressed. No cranking, no waiting for the crankshaft to spin three times. Press the button, instant ignition. Always. A bunch of my friends bought into th Twin Power batteries when they came out. They worked great, but did not have any type of internal protection like re-start. Myself and everyone I know have bricked them. TP explained what we did wrong and even offered to comp me one. But i recognized it was my fault and bought a re-start battery. Best battery I have ever had. I have the same battery in both of my FXRs equipped  with high compression TC124 engines.

I have the ATX-20 (680 Cranking Amps) in all three of my FXRs (w/TC124 engines). Love them. I cannot imagine ever using a different battery in my FXRs.

The re-start future has saved me several times. Not sure what the issue would be getting to the button on a bagger, but on my FXRs I can get under the seat, hit the button, and close the seat in under a minute. My bagger might take a little longer as I have to snake my hand under the tour pac to the thumb screw holding the seat down. But thats it, and it is not like this has to be done frequently.

I will add that my TC124s all crank at over 200 Lbs CCP. The red bike has a Cycle Tech 2.0kw starter and I have never heard the engine crank. It simply fires off the instant the start button is pushed. Warm, cold, freezing, doesn't make a difference. The other bikes have little 1.4kw starters. They crank, but not very long. Again, no issues with ambient air or engine temps.
'We' like this' - Said by the one man operation.

Coyote

On some touring bikes (2010-2014 for sure) there is a tray that is mounted above the battery. The ECM, security antenna and purge valve mount to that tray. There are also two bolts holding the tray down. So depending on where this reset button is, you may not be able to get to it without removing all that stuff.

kd

That's my point Coyote.  You need tools to access.  I have the HD version in a 2011 and use a charger connector jack to allow a flash to turn it on again.  Much easier.  The 12V tickle has no amperage requirement so even a small jumpstart is plenty. 
KD

boooby1744

I don't know anything about c trek chargers,I'm using an Optimate 4s5A, works well. Their literature states they are recommended by various battery manufacturers and AG is listed. I'd put up a put up a screenshot but I'm not sure it's allowed.

Ohio HD

Quote from: Coyote on September 20, 2021, 12:08:22 PM
On some touring bikes (2010-2014 for sure) there is a tray that is mounted above the battery. The ECM, security antenna and purge valve mount to that tray. There are also two bolts holding the tray down. So depending on where this reset button is, you may not be able to get to it without removing all that stuff.

My 2008 and 2009 are the same, the seat and the ECM and battery retainer have to come loose and lift up. In the event of a dead bike out on the road or parked where you don't have a charger. The restart would be really nice.

I'd have too look at my bikes and see if I could fab a rocker made from plastic that could be pulled to rest the battery. I don't know that there's room.

$400 is a good amount to pay for a battery, I can get it for $350, a little better. North of $550 for a battery, I'll use a Yuasa 500 cca AGM.

   

Ohio HD

Quote from: kd on September 20, 2021, 01:37:37 PM
That's my point Coyote.  You need tools to access.  I have the HD version in a 2011 and use a charger connector jack to allow a flash to turn it on again.  Much easier.  The 12V tickle has no amperage requirement so even a small jumpstart is plenty.

All I have to do is have the charger and the time if I'm not at home with the bike. Kinda defeats the advantage of the lithium to me, the restart is the feature that attracts me to it. My 124" cranks over hot with 380 cca, even when heat soaked.

Ohio HD

Quote from: turboprop on September 20, 2021, 12:02:56 PM
Quote from: Ohio HD on September 20, 2021, 09:03:08 AM
Turboprop, what's your take on the restart battery?



Quote from: turboprop on July 07, 2020, 12:38:42 PM
I have not talked with anyone at AG. Ever. My history with these things is I was an early adopter of Lithium batteries. Loved the light weight, slow to non existent discharge, and incredible power. Early on there were nay sayers about about having to warm them up in cold temps. That turned out to be a non issue, but the real issue was letting the voltage get too low. Unlike a traditional AGM there is no bringing one of these back. I bricked a bunch lithium batteries from a bunch of different brands, including a pre-restart AG and a Twin Power unit. All of the brick-ings were my own fault. I left something on and walked away without knowing. When I saw the re-start video, it was like a light bulb had turned on. Whalla! The one in my red/white FXR with the TC124 with 12.9 compression is going on three years. That battery has gone into re-start mode a few times (my own fault), but every time I simply press the button and it fires up. Immediately. About that firing up, the voltage drop with this battery is negligible. Admittedly, the rest of the system is pretty robust, bordering somewhat on ridiculous. , but this engine fires (not cranks) immediately when the start button is pressed. No cranking, no waiting for the crankshaft to spin three times. Press the button, instant ignition. Always. A bunch of my friends bought into th Twin Power batteries when they came out. They worked great, but did not have any type of internal protection like re-start. Myself and everyone I know have bricked them. TP explained what we did wrong and even offered to comp me one. But i recognized it was my fault and bought a re-start battery. Best battery I have ever had. I have the same battery in both of my FXRs equipped  with high compression TC124 engines.

I have the ATX-20 (680 Cranking Amps) in all three of my FXRs (w/TC124 engines). Love them. I cannot imagine ever using a different battery in my FXRs.

The re-start future has saved me several times. Not sure what the issue would be getting to the button on a bagger, but on my FXRs I can get under the seat, hit the button, and close the seat in under a minute. My bagger might take a little longer as I have to snake my hand under the tour pac to the thumb screw holding the seat down. But thats it, and it is not like this has to be done frequently.

I will add that my TC124s all crank at over 200 Lbs CCP. The red bike has a Cycle Tech 2.0kw starter and I have never heard the engine crank. It simply fires off the instant the start button is pushed. Warm, cold, freezing, doesn't make a difference. The other bikes have little 1.4kw starters. They crank, but not very long. Again, no issues with ambient air or engine temps.

Thanks Ed, I figured your point of view hadn't changed, but wanted to ask. I'm just at 200ccp and use a 1.4kw starter, and always lights up with a jab at the button. I think I'll give the restart battery a shot. I'm in the habit of using a battery tender on an AGM when the bike will sit a week or so. I just may have to be more diligent with my efforts using the lithium charger. More than likely, if it doesn't start I'm home, but you never know.


Ohio HD

September 20, 2021, 09:09:11 PM #21 Last Edit: September 20, 2021, 09:32:35 PM by Ohio HD
I'll have to look at the bikes, but I may be able to just create an access hole or slot, what ever fits, in to the top of the ECM caddy.

I use an oversized chrome thumbscrew to retain the seat, so that's removable by hand. Then lift the ECM from the caddy, and if it all lines up, restart. 




04 SE Deuce

CTEK 56-926 charger that AG recommends is 92.99 at rcagarage.com

I also got a 56-564 Comfort indicator/charging port on sale for 7.99 

Shipping was quick and free with $100 order.

On my FXDXI I ran a battery tender SAE harness up to the front of the gas tank and connected a water resistant SAE splitter/Y so I have 2 SAE plug-ins.  One has the 56-564 which gives a general indication of the battery charge and allows the CTEK charger to plug in.  The other SAE plug-in I use for a dual USB charging port.  Both the Comfort indicator and the USB port are on flat top of the frame right at the front of the tank.

turboprop

Quote from: Ohio HD on September 20, 2021, 07:34:38 PM
Quote from: turboprop on September 20, 2021, 12:02:56 PM
Quote from: Ohio HD on September 20, 2021, 09:03:08 AM
Turboprop, what's your take on the restart battery?



Quote from: turboprop on July 07, 2020, 12:38:42 PM
I have not talked with anyone at AG. Ever. My history with these things is I was an early adopter of Lithium batteries. Loved the light weight, slow to non existent discharge, and incredible power. Early on there were nay sayers about about having to warm them up in cold temps. That turned out to be a non issue, but the real issue was letting the voltage get too low. Unlike a traditional AGM there is no bringing one of these back. I bricked a bunch lithium batteries from a bunch of different brands, including a pre-restart AG and a Twin Power unit. All of the brick-ings were my own fault. I left something on and walked away without knowing. When I saw the re-start video, it was like a light bulb had turned on. Whalla! The one in my red/white FXR with the TC124 with 12.9 compression is going on three years. That battery has gone into re-start mode a few times (my own fault), but every time I simply press the button and it fires up. Immediately. About that firing up, the voltage drop with this battery is negligible. Admittedly, the rest of the system is pretty robust, bordering somewhat on ridiculous. , but this engine fires (not cranks) immediately when the start button is pressed. No cranking, no waiting for the crankshaft to spin three times. Press the button, instant ignition. Always. A bunch of my friends bought into th Twin Power batteries when they came out. They worked great, but did not have any type of internal protection like re-start. Myself and everyone I know have bricked them. TP explained what we did wrong and even offered to comp me one. But i recognized it was my fault and bought a re-start battery. Best battery I have ever had. I have the same battery in both of my FXRs equipped  with high compression TC124 engines.

I have the ATX-20 (680 Cranking Amps) in all three of my FXRs (w/TC124 engines). Love them. I cannot imagine ever using a different battery in my FXRs.

The re-start future has saved me several times. Not sure what the issue would be getting to the button on a bagger, but on my FXRs I can get under the seat, hit the button, and close the seat in under a minute. My bagger might take a little longer as I have to snake my hand under the tour pac to the thumb screw holding the seat down. But thats it, and it is not like this has to be done frequently.

I will add that my TC124s all crank at over 200 Lbs CCP. The red bike has a Cycle Tech 2.0kw starter and I have never heard the engine crank. It simply fires off the instant the start button is pushed. Warm, cold, freezing, doesn't make a difference. The other bikes have little 1.4kw starters. They crank, but not very long. Again, no issues with ambient air or engine temps.

Thanks Ed, I figured your point of view hadn't changed, but wanted to ask. I'm just at 200ccp and use a 1.4kw starter, and always lights up with a jab at the button. I think I'll give the restart battery a shot. I'm in the habit of using a battery tender on an AGM when the bike will sit a week or so. I just may have to be more diligent with my efforts using the lithium charger. More than likely, if it doesn't start I'm home, but you never know.


I am not sure about the need for the tender with the RS battery. These batteries have very little, if any self discharge. Your newer TC probably has some current draw when it is parked. Experience tells us that it is enough to drain a battery in a relatively short period of time. With the RS tech, once the battery drains down to its limit of advance, the current draw stops. The rider can then simply hit the button, fire it up and go. I had this exact same experience with red this summer. Bike was down for a repair, I have a couple other bikes, it got pushed aside, etc. Made the repair, battery seemed to be bricked. Hit the RS button, it fired off instantly. I have specific tenders for them but rarely use them, and have only had to hit the button a couple of times. Usually because I left the ignition on. I think you will like the battery.
'We' like this' - Said by the one man operation.

Ohio HD

Quote from: turboprop on September 21, 2021, 01:43:58 AM
Quote from: Ohio HD on September 20, 2021, 07:34:38 PM
Quote from: turboprop on September 20, 2021, 12:02:56 PM
Quote from: Ohio HD on September 20, 2021, 09:03:08 AM
Turboprop, what's your take on the restart battery?



Quote from: turboprop on July 07, 2020, 12:38:42 PM
I have not talked with anyone at AG. Ever. My history with these things is I was an early adopter of Lithium batteries. Loved the light weight, slow to non existent discharge, and incredible power. Early on there were nay sayers about about having to warm them up in cold temps. That turned out to be a non issue, but the real issue was letting the voltage get too low. Unlike a traditional AGM there is no bringing one of these back. I bricked a bunch lithium batteries from a bunch of different brands, including a pre-restart AG and a Twin Power unit. All of the brick-ings were my own fault. I left something on and walked away without knowing. When I saw the re-start video, it was like a light bulb had turned on. Whalla! The one in my red/white FXR with the TC124 with 12.9 compression is going on three years. That battery has gone into re-start mode a few times (my own fault), but every time I simply press the button and it fires up. Immediately. About that firing up, the voltage drop with this battery is negligible. Admittedly, the rest of the system is pretty robust, bordering somewhat on ridiculous. , but this engine fires (not cranks) immediately when the start button is pressed. No cranking, no waiting for the crankshaft to spin three times. Press the button, instant ignition. Always. A bunch of my friends bought into th Twin Power batteries when they came out. They worked great, but did not have any type of internal protection like re-start. Myself and everyone I know have bricked them. TP explained what we did wrong and even offered to comp me one. But i recognized it was my fault and bought a re-start battery. Best battery I have ever had. I have the same battery in both of my FXRs equipped  with high compression TC124 engines.

I have the ATX-20 (680 Cranking Amps) in all three of my FXRs (w/TC124 engines). Love them. I cannot imagine ever using a different battery in my FXRs.

The re-start future has saved me several times. Not sure what the issue would be getting to the button on a bagger, but on my FXRs I can get under the seat, hit the button, and close the seat in under a minute. My bagger might take a little longer as I have to snake my hand under the tour pac to the thumb screw holding the seat down. But thats it, and it is not like this has to be done frequently.

I will add that my TC124s all crank at over 200 Lbs CCP. The red bike has a Cycle Tech 2.0kw starter and I have never heard the engine crank. It simply fires off the instant the start button is pushed. Warm, cold, freezing, doesn't make a difference. The other bikes have little 1.4kw starters. They crank, but not very long. Again, no issues with ambient air or engine temps.

Thanks Ed, I figured your point of view hadn't changed, but wanted to ask. I'm just at 200ccp and use a 1.4kw starter, and always lights up with a jab at the button. I think I'll give the restart battery a shot. I'm in the habit of using a battery tender on an AGM when the bike will sit a week or so. I just may have to be more diligent with my efforts using the lithium charger. More than likely, if it doesn't start I'm home, but you never know.


I am not sure about the need for the tender with the RS battery. These batteries have very little, if any self discharge. Your newer TC probably has some current draw when it is parked. Experience tells us that it is enough to drain a battery in a relatively short period of time. With the RS tech, once the battery drains down to its limit of advance, the current draw stops. The rider can then simply hit the button, fire it up and go. I had this exact same experience with red this summer. Bike was down for a repair, I have a couple other bikes, it got pushed aside, etc. Made the repair, battery seemed to be bricked. Hit the RS button, it fired off instantly. I have specific tenders for them but rarely use them, and have only had to hit the button a couple of times. Usually because I left the ignition on. I think you will like the battery.

That makes sense, the shutdown I guess protects it from complete discharge. I'll still invest in the proper charger for long term sitting. As you said, the newer bikes have some constant draw, and both of mine have security, so that's always drawing juice.