To all you might as well 124 guys

[Raleigh111]

So i got my cases back from being bored for the 4.625 crank and 4.125 cylinders. Looks like he machined and drilled out the top case bolt and mentioned getting a special s&s bolt. Its a 13 road glide. I think i need sns 50-3027 and sns 50-8063-s looks like a longer bolt with a oil seal washer . He machined a flat surface on case for seal. Can anyone confirm.

Next question will be checking connecting rod clearance:)

[Ohio HD]

https://www.sscycle.com/search/?keyword=50-8063-S


https://www.sscycle.com/search/?keyword=50-0327

[Raleigh111]

Thanks Ohio!
I will get that ordered up and/ i have the correct piston oilers. Can you think of anything else I should do or check?

[Raleigh111]

Not sure how this happened but i ended up zero deck height. I thought for sure because they were older twin cam cylinders I would have to adjust. .018 base put me at zero.  Do i ignore the oil groove now where oring went because of using paper gasket? how does my mock up look? I snugged up all the case bolts then snug cylinders down with 2 brass spacers. First try i did not put a base gasket on and cylinder would not snug down to case, must  be the dowl pin hanging it up, it was about .004 from flush?

[turboprop]

Thanks Ohio!
I will get that ordered up and/ i have the correct piston oilers. Can you think of anything else I should do or check?

Those TC piston oilers scare the heck out of me. Their small mounting bolts, inside the crankcase where they cannot be easily checked, etc. The torque spec on them is minute. I bought a small torque screwdriver just for those bolts, as I was afraid of over torquing them and pulling threads in the case or under torquing them and allowing a bolt or to  vibrate out. I also used red Loctight and primer on them to ensure they did not come out. Probably overkill, but I can sleep at night.

[turboprop]

Not sure how this happened but i ended up zero deck height. I thought for sure because they were older twin cam cylinders I would have to adjust. .018 base put me at zero.  Do i ignore the oil groove now where oring went because of using paper gasket? how does my mock up look? I snugged up all the case bolts then snug cylinders down with 2 brass spacers.

That engine will no longer use the o-rings at the base of the cylinders. Not an option. Whatever gaskets you select will not come with that o-ring.

[turboprop]

Are those the cylinders that you had bored and sleeved?

[Raleigh111]

Are those the cylinders that you had bored and sleeved?

I got the cylinders at swap meet. They are older twin cam ones that are supposed to be 5.013 vs 5.003 tall so I thought i would have to cut the bottom to get zero deck, maybe they were cut before? part is S&S 91-7089-S They were 4.135 so someone bored them before me, luckly i ordered .010 over pistons. Gave them a hone job and pistons seem to fit real nice.

[Don D]

Consider checking piston to piston clearance at BDC

[Raleigh111]

Consider checking piston to piston clearance at BDC

Don you may have to explain how to do that? Not sure ?

[turboprop]

Consider checking piston to piston clearance at BDC

Don you may have to explain how to do that? Not sure ?

The clearance between the two pistons when the crank pin is at the six o clock position.

This is checked with the flywheels, cylinders and piston installed in one of the case halves. A simple feeler gauge can be used.

[kd]

Consider checking piston to piston clearance at BDC

Don you may have to explain how to do that? Not sure ?

The clearance between the two pistons when the crank pin is at the six o clock position.

This is checked with the flywheels, cylinders and piston installed in one of the case halves. A simple feeler gauge can be used.

This S&S twin cam stroker instruction sheet should help you understand.  What Don and turboprop are pointing out is when you assemble a longer stroke engine with new pistons it is prudent to make sure the longer travel in the pistons do not interfere with each other (or anything else for that matter).  At the very least, after reading the sheet you will know what questions you may have remaining.  Enjoy the satisfaction of getting to know your engine better. 

[Raleigh111]

Consider checking piston to piston clearance at BDC

Don you may have to explain how to do that? Not sure ?

The clearance between the two pistons when the crank pin is at the six o clock position.

This is checked with the flywheels, cylinders and piston installed in one of the case halves. A simple feeler gauge can be used.

Thanks get it now.

[Hillside Motorcycle]

In certain cases, the 22.5 degree rod scallop on the piston(s) needs to be machined to establish BDC clearance.
Piston vise or related fixturing, makes quick, accurate work of that straightforward operation.
With the flywheels pulled into the left side, and secured, along the cylinders snugged to the case deck with gaskets in place, you can get a good visual.

[Raleigh111]

Consider checking piston to piston clearance at BDC

Don you may have to explain how to do that? Not sure ?

The clearance between the two pistons when the crank pin is at the six o clock position.

This is checked with the flywheels, cylinders and piston installed in one of the case halves. A simple feeler gauge can be used.

Thanks get it now.

Is this what i am looking for? Bdc about as close as the come together.

[Raleigh111]

Consider checking piston to piston clearance at BDC

Don you may have to explain how to do that? Not sure ?

The clearance between the two pistons when the crank pin is at the six o clock position.

This is checked with the flywheels, cylinders and piston installed in one of the case halves. A simple feeler gauge can be used.

This S&S twin cam stroker instruction sheet should help you understand.  What Don and turboprop are pointing out is when you assemble a longer stroke engine with new pistons it is prudent to make sure the longer travel in the pistons do not interfere with each other (or anything else for that matter).  At the very least, after reading the sheet you will know what questions you may have remaining.  Enjoy the satisfaction of getting to know your engine better. 

Thank you for that link, going through it now!

[Raleigh111]

Question, When I have the motor laying on the cam chest side on couple blocks of wood so the crank is free there is a spot it feels like it is rubbing or not spinning smooth when i try to rotate by hand? if i stand the motor up it is fine, bolt other side on and stand it up its fine. Also is there supposed to be side to side play in the crank when installed? I do not remember any washers or spacers inside the case when i split it and now i have side to side play.

[rigidthumper]

End play is set via the sprocket spacer, rotor, and compensator assy. You will have a good 1/4" or more without those items in place.

[Raleigh111]

End play is set via the sprocket spacer, rotor, and compensator assy. You will have a good 1/4" or more without those items in place.

Thank You! Is it okay to install the cam chest now then without compensator assy jnstalled? Thinking I should leave the bottom timing gear bolt loose for now? may need to shim timing gears differently after comp installed to get them flat with each other.

[Don D]

To check the piston to piston clearance the right side case needs to be off and the left on it's side down. Cylinders bolted as you did before. Now you have a full visual of what is happening in the case at BDC.

[les]

Just a couple of notes.  For the top casing bridge bolt, you can get any good grade 8 bolt and I recommend a good ARP 12-point nut.  Mark the hex bolt head with a scribe and put the scribe.  Snug the bolt in the casing with the scribe at 12 o'clock.  Take a marker and color the part of the bolt that needs to be filed down.  In a vice, you can use a small rounded fine hand file to file off the bolt the make the triangular Coke bottle shape.  Don't forget to put all the washers on first so it's in its real position when you color the bolt with the marker.  Even though you use the S&S rubber sealed washers, I still use black RTV high temperature silicone sealant on both ends, which will prevent weeping of oil later on down the road.  I've found that sometimes the S&S rubber washers aren't enough to totally prevent oil weeping.

For the piston jets, use purple loctite (light strength) and torque to specs. 

[Don D]

I use the arp bolts, turn down the center and don't punch out the case with an extra hole but deepen the threaded portion.

[Admiral Akbar]

Don't need an ARP bolt if you are trimming the sides.  I use a standard 18-8 SS 5/16-24 and torque on the light side.  Use a cap nut to cap off the threads.  When you are done boring the cases, there isn't much bridge left. Don't need much tension.  SnS cases use a 1/4 inch bolt.   I also don't use SnS washers with the rubber. I use 0.063 5052 thick aluminum and a little sealer. I also re-cut the underside of the bolt head so it's flat and won't leak there.

[Don D]

 
Have done similar but most of the time I don't drill through  the case left side just deepen the hole and thread it.

[Admiral Akbar]

Personally I don't care for simply extending the thread and machining flats in the center bolt. The reason is that things stretch and squash. Washer/bolt/case surface.  The problem stems from reassembly. If the center part was turned to a diameter instead of flats, threaded cases, it would be OK. If fixed flats, the bolt can only be in one position. With treads in the case this isn't so.  With a hole all they way through, the bolt head can be held in position while the nut is torqued. You have to use a cap nut tho.

[Hillside Motorcycle]

Every single 117", and 124" here, has the cases machined per S&S instructions, to accept the necked c/bolt supplied from S&S.
Never any issues regarding whatsoever, and we build A TON of those.

[Raleigh111]

Just a couple of notes.  For the top casing bridge bolt, you can get any good grade 8 bolt and I recommend a good ARP 12-point nut.  Mark the hex bolt head with a scribe and put the scribe.  Snug the bolt in the casing with the scribe at 12 o'clock.  Take a marker and color the part of the bolt that needs to be filed down.  In a vice, you can use a small rounded fine hand file to file off the bolt the make the triangular Coke bottle shape.  Don't forget to put all the washers on first so it's in its real position when you color the bolt with the marker.  Even though you use the S&S rubber sealed washers, I still use black RTV high temperature silicone sealant on both ends, which will prevent weeping of oil later on down the road.  I've found that sometimes the S&S rubber washers aren't enough to totally prevent oil weeping.

For the piston jets, use purple loctite (light strength) and torque to specs.

Are you using 2 of the sealed washers one on each end of bolt? Do you any flat washers on the out side of the sealed washers? Trying to figure out how they want it installed but i cant find anything. Thanks.

[les]

Just a couple of notes.  For the top casing bridge bolt, you can get any good grade 8 bolt and I recommend a good ARP 12-point nut.  Mark the hex bolt head with a scribe and put the scribe.  Snug the bolt in the casing with the scribe at 12 o'clock.  Take a marker and color the part of the bolt that needs to be filed down.  In a vice, you can use a small rounded fine hand file to file off the bolt the make the triangular Coke bottle shape.  Don't forget to put all the washers on first so it's in its real position when you color the bolt with the marker.  Even though you use the S&S rubber sealed washers, I still use black RTV high temperature silicone sealant on both ends, which will prevent weeping of oil later on down the road.  I've found that sometimes the S&S rubber washers aren't enough to totally prevent oil weeping.

For the piston jets, use purple loctite (light strength) and torque to specs.

Are you using 2 of the sealed washers one on each end of bolt? Do you any flat washers on the out side of the sealed washers? Trying to figure out how they want it installed but i cant find anything. Thanks.

Exactly.  Sealed washers on both ends, covered by high quality flat washers on top of those.  However, I also use black RTV under the sealed washers (between case and sealed washers). 

[Raleigh111]

Just a couple of notes.  For the top casing bridge bolt, you can get any good grade 8 bolt and I recommend a good ARP 12-point nut.  Mark the hex bolt head with a scribe and put the scribe.  Snug the bolt in the casing with the scribe at 12 o'clock.  Take a marker and color the part of the bolt that needs to be filed down.  In a vice, you can use a small rounded fine hand file to file off the bolt the make the triangular Coke bottle shape.  Don't forget to put all the washers on first so it's in its real position when you color the bolt with the marker.  Even though you use the S&S rubber sealed washers, I still use black RTV high temperature silicone sealant on both ends, which will prevent weeping of oil later on down the road.  I've found that sometimes the S&S rubber washers aren't enough to totally prevent oil weeping.

For the piston jets, use purple loctite (light strength) and torque to specs.

Are you using 2 of the sealed washers one on each end of bolt? Do you any flat washers on the out side of the sealed washers? Trying to figure out how they want it installed but i cant find anything. Thanks.

Exactly.  Sealed washers on both ends, covered by high quality flat washers on top of those.  However, I also use black RTV under the sealed washers (between case and sealed washers).

Got it thanks. Found a pic right after i posted this.

[Raleigh111]

So to set end play on crank without timken just using 2 lefty bearings you have to install comp from what i understand? I installed comp on bench then installed timing gears. Is this acceptable practice and does this look okay?

[attach=0,msg1398852]

[attach=1,msg1398852]

[rigidthumper]

Is the 24009-06 spacer in place? Comp bolt torqued down? You shouldn't be able to rotate the comp freely by hand without engaging the ramps, if it's at all snug.
Should be 1 #8, and 1 # 21, on the outboard side of the sprocket shaft as seen here.

[Raleigh111]

Is the 24009-06 spacer in place? Comp bolt torqued down? You shouldn't be able to rotate the comp freely by hand without engaging the ramps, if it's at all snug.
Should be 1 #8, and 1 # 21, on the outboard side of the sprocket shaft as seen here.

I goofed on one of the spacer springs behind the comp. The last smaller one i had on backwards, no more slope  in comp. The timing gears are not perfect lined up but are they okay?

[Ohio HD]

There can be no more than 0.010" offset with the two sprockets. Harley sells shims, 0.100" to 0.150" to correct the cam sprocket alignment. Check the manual, I'm pretty sure that 0.010" is the limit.

[Raleigh111]

There can be no more than 0.010" offset with the two sprockets. Harley sells shims, 0.100" to 0.150" to correct the cam sprocket alignment. Check the manual, I'm pretty sure that 0.010" is the limit.

Thanks Right on the edge, .130 in now and i can slip a .010 feeler in there, .015 drags, ordered .140 , thanks again ohio.