Question on travel limiters

[itsafatboy]

What would
Be the issue with putting the spacer on top of plunger ? Would there be any difference,? 

I noticed the new fueling short travel lifters have the spacer on top and trying to understand why except maybe less oil in body of lifter so less chance airation of oil since spacer is not a solid disk.

I saw that this was one of the benefits of the short travel lifters

Also anyone put a travel limiter in a woods lifter

[Pirsch Fire Wagon]

Call Feuling and ask them They're pretty good at Customer Service: 1-866-966-9767

[wfolarry]

Let's say you put the limiter on top in any lifter. That puts the piston down whatever the thickness is of the limiter. To keep it simple we'll say .100. Total travel is .200 so now we have cut that in half. Now you adjust your pushrod .050 down to put it in the middle of the travel. Now there's less room for oil so the recovery is supposed to be better. now the oil gets aerated.[just for example] Now the lifter collapses the .050 & it starts to rattle & some valve lift is lost. Now if the spacer was under the piston & the oil aerated it would collapse onto the limiter & maintain better valve action until the lifter was able to recover which it would to do faster because the piston is in the middle of it's travel so the oil port is exposed. On some lifters when the piston is all the way down the oil port is covered so it takes longer for the lifter to recover. JMO

[hrdtail78]

The advantage of the spacer in the S&S is you can have a solid lifter at higher rpm's and still have the advantage of a hyd at lower rpm's.  Spacer on top will not accomplish this same advantage.  Limiter travelers isn't something I recommend for most of the street builds I do.  Every last drop of HP and crane does make solid lifters that will work in a TC and M8 if wanting to go that route.

[Don D]

Feuling sells solids too.
I have put limiters in the Hylift Johnsons. I believe those are who Bobby Wood uses for his lifters

[itsafatboy]

Just talked to fueling , the reason they put the limiter on top is it will be less oil under the plunger so less chance if oil airation so more chance it will open the valve to desired level, since the limiter has a hole in the middle if put on top then adjust pluger half way down below the limiter you will have less oil in body , if on top dont have that issue,  i suppose you could just adjust the lifer deeper in hole like 160 or so and it would be just like you had limiter on top of lifer ,     

[kd]

Many of us, me at least, that use limiters (on top) adjust the pushrod just cracked off the bottom (like 1 flat max).  This is literally like solids when cold.  As the engine gets up to temp the heads and barrels grow up to .040 to .060 which brings the hot adjustment (for plunger volume)into that >040 / .050 range that seems to be where Fueling told you they want them.  Done like this I have not noticed any hot start starter stalling or kickback.

[Ohio HD]

You can adjust the lifter to 0.160" all day and not need top side limiters. It won't get any higher in the lifter unless the pushrod loosens.

[Don D]

All good but the lifters I sell have .160 travel and no spacers. You can adjust them off the bottom.

[itsafatboy]

Thanks for the input , and

woods lifters are made by HYLIFT/JOHNSON, so that's good made to his specs I'm guessing they are a version of the 2313se lifter

[Don D]

Thanks

[itsafatboy]

So not to bash anyone i use a lot of woods stuff on my bike but would like opinions on these two lifters

woods alpha series lifters ,  they are made by HYLIFT/JOHNSON so the best manufacturer they are made to bobbies specs ,

next lifter

2313SE - HYLIFT/JOHNSON premium lifter for harley with the roller bearing pressure feed hole like woods, i believe these were the original harley ones that worked good way back, hylift/johnson designed them just for harley , then crap happened and hd switched to delphi crap, these are also what i believe were the SS premiums 


So between these two lifters wich one would you chose and why , also if anyone has had problems with woods what was it. i have the alpha ones in bike but going to try the 2313SE with limiters in them ,       

just trying to learn about some lifter stuff 

[wfolarry]

Just talked to fueling , the reason they put the limiter on top is it will be less oil under the plunger so less chance if oil airation so more chance it will open the valve to desired level, since the limiter has a hole in the middle if put on top then adjust pluger half way down below the limiter you will have less oil in body , if on top dont have that issue,  i suppose you could just adjust the lifer deeper in hole like 160 or so and it would be just like you had limiter on top of lifer ,   

Total BS. Having less volume will not help you if the oil is aerated.

Many of us, me at least, that use limiters (on top) adjust the pushrod just cracked off the bottom (like 1 flat max).  This is literally like solids when cold.  As the engine gets up to temp the heads and barrels grow up to .040 to .060 which brings the hot adjustment (for plunger volume)into that >040 / .050 range that seems to be where Fueling told you they want them.  Done like this I have not noticed any hot start starter stalling or kickback.

That's the same way you would adjust them if you had the limiters. Adjusting off the bottom is not something that I would recommend but a lot of guys have done it. No need for a limiter on top unless you float the valves a lot then you need more than just a limiter. It's just dead space. The pushrod adjustment is holding the plunger down.

You can adjust the lifter to 0.160" all day and not need top side limiters. It won't get any higher in the lifter unless the pushrod loosens.

 

So not to bash anyone i use a lot of woods stuff on my bike but would like opinions on these two lifters

woods alpha series lifters ,  they are made by HYLIFT/JOHNSON so the best manufacturer they are made to bobbies specs ,

next lifter

2313SE - HYLIFT/JOHNSON premium lifter for harley with the roller bearing pressure feed hole like woods, i believe these were the original harley ones that worked good way back, hylift/johnson designed them just for harley , then crap happened and hd switched to delphi crap, these are also what i believe were the SS premiums 


So between these two lifters wich one would you chose and why , also if anyone has had problems with woods what was it. i have the alpha ones in bike but going to try the 2313SE with limiters in them ,     

just trying to learn about some lifter stuff 

The 2313 is the lifter that came in Twin Cams when they first came out. There wasn't a 2313SE back then.
Delphi are not bad lifters. What do you think the B lifters were that everybody was in love with?
Wood lifters are made to his specs. There are features in them that he thinks are beneficial. It's a quality piece.

[kd]

Just talked to fueling , the reason they put the limiter on top is it will be less oil under the plunger so less chance if oil airation so more chance it will open the valve to desired level, since the limiter has a hole in the middle if put on top then adjust pluger half way down below the limiter you will have less oil in body , if on top dont have that issue,  i suppose you could just adjust the lifer deeper in hole like 160 or so and it would be just like you had limiter on top of lifer ,   

Total BS. Having less volume will not help you if the oil is aerated.

Many of us, me at least, that use limiters (on top) adjust the pushrod just cracked off the bottom (like 1 flat max).  This is literally like solids when cold.  As the engine gets up to temp the heads and barrels grow up to .040 to .060 which brings the hot adjustment (for plunger volume)into that >040 / .050 range that seems to be where Fueling told you they want them.  Done like this I have not noticed any hot start starter stalling or kickback.

That's the same way you would adjust them if you had the limiters. Adjusting off the bottom is not something that I would recommend but a lot of guys have done it. No need for a limiter on top unless you float the valves a lot then you need more than just a limiter. It's just dead space. The pushrod adjustment is holding the plunger down.

You can adjust the lifter to 0.160" all day and not need top side limiters. It won't get any higher in the lifter unless the pushrod loosens.

 

So not to bash anyone i use a lot of woods stuff on my bike but would like opinions on these two lifters

woods alpha series lifters ,  they are made by HYLIFT/JOHNSON so the best manufacturer they are made to bobbies specs ,

next lifter

2313SE - HYLIFT/JOHNSON premium lifter for harley with the roller bearing pressure feed hole like woods, i believe these were the original harley ones that worked good way back, hylift/johnson designed them just for harley , then crap happened and hd switched to delphi crap, these are also what i believe were the SS premiums 


So between these two lifters wich one would you chose and why , also if anyone has had problems with woods what was it. i have the alpha ones in bike but going to try the 2313SE with limiters in them ,     

just trying to learn about some lifter stuff 

The 2313 is the lifter that came in Twin Cams when they first came out. There wasn't a 2313SE back then.
Delphi are not bad lifters. What do you think the B lifters were that everybody was in love with?
Wood lifters are made to his specs. There are features in them that he thinks are beneficial. It's a quality piece.

Larry, I was describing lifters with limiters.  S&S Premiums to be exact.  I still have another set and will change out the ones in there at the 35,000 miles from new mark.   With my spring weight and the way I ride, I consider them a service item.  I won't wait until something happens.

[Don D]

Truth be told there is room at the top for many good lifters. This is the case and there are still some that will take the hard life we demand available off the shelf. I agree with Larry 100%, Woods lifters are just another flavor of a Topline Hylift lifters and are single directional.