91-03 or 04-up heads on an '89 xlh?

[andyxlh]

Hello folks
I have an option on a set of late model heads for my '89 xlh, but am on vacation at the moment so can't get to my parts books. are the heads on the sporty 4 speeds the same as the ones on the later bikes? I mean specifically the 91-03 rigid mount 5 speeds, also the later 'Buell'' style heads on the '04-up bikes? anyone out there with a part book and a bit of experience who can let me know?
Cheers
Andy

[14Frisco]

I believe they do.  I have a '93 XL and the OEM heads have part numbers ending with -89 indicating they are the same heads as yours.  And I have put XB heads (probably would you refer to as later Buell style heads) on my '93.  The only thing I had to do was machine the front mounting bracket slightly.  The XB heads are ~25 thous shorter than the stock heads but I am still using non-adjustable OEM pushrods.  One more thing, I think the heads come without the breather holes drilled - I bought mine from NRHS and I asked them to have them drilled and tapped.  There is more info here: http://nrhsperformance.com/partsoemheads.shtml

[andyxlh]

OK I have found out the heads and barrels are off a 2007 model 883R.
Part numbers on heads are:
Front= 16663-07
Rear= 16662-07
So any more ideas? I believe these heads and barrels have bigger fins than the earlier ones, but not sure about the rest.
Cheers
Andy

[jonkraushaar]

Hey Andy and Frisco,

Yes you are correct the 04 sporty head are the same as the XB heads the only differences are that the XB heads are silver and the sporty heads are black highlighted and already have the breather holes drilled. I use to work at NRHS for 8 years and did all the work in the back. I taught the guy in the back how to port heads and im not sure how their fairing. I'm trying to get started again because I loved doing the head porting and getting the results from the customers. Knowing that they got more power than they expected that made me fell good. As a matter of fact Frisco I probably did your heads on your bike. If you tell me your name ill tell you if I did them or not. Of course you dont have too.

[jonkraushaar]

If you want you can google my name if you think I'm telling false info. As a matter of fact Frisco I did your heads I dont remember your first name but you got your heads done in 05 or 06 and I think it was a stage 2. I was doing 20 sets of heads in a month sometimes 30 sets of heads a month my lowest month was 14 I think.

[14Frisco]

As a matter of fact...

OK, factual things to follow...

...I did your heads...

Nope.

...you got your heads done in 05 or 06...

Nope.

...I think it was a stage 2.

Nope.

[jonkraushaar]

I guess I was wrong but there is more than 1 person with the last name of frisco so oops my bad but there was a guy with the last name of frisco that I had done oh well sorry. The guy in the back has been only doing it for just about a year and a half Ive been doing it for 8. The difference between him and I is his are the repetitve cnc ported and mine are a form of art hand ported. Then again I taught him everything he knows so its all good.

[jonkraushaar]

Oh yeah well hers some factual info for you the 3 bikes that nrhs runs at the bonneville salt flats and have  land speed records on I did the heads on them. I did Dan Norlins heads. He has 140hp out of an 82ci so if you really want facts I'll give them to you frisco. I have no problem with that all you have to do is ask.

[mayor]

OK I have found out the heads and barrels are off a 2007 model 883R.
Part numbers on heads are:
Front= 16663-07
Rear= 16662-07
So any more ideas? I believe these heads and barrels have bigger fins than the earlier ones, but not sure about the rest.
Cheers
Andy

Yes you are correct the 04 sporty head are the same as the XB heads the only differences are that the XB heads are silver and the sporty heads are black highlighted and already have the breather holes drilled.

Looks like Andy bought 883 heads.  I didn't think the 883's have the XB heads.  I thought the XB castings were limited to factory 1200's?  My guess is they have smaller chambers, but I wonder if the ports are the same as the XB's? 

[14Frisco]

Oh yeah well hers some factual info for you the 3 bikes that nrhs runs at the bonneville salt flats and have  land speed records on I did the heads on them. I did Dan Norlins heads. He has 140hp out of an 82ci so if you really want facts I'll give them to you frisco. I have no problem with that all you have to do is ask.

WTF?  I never asked to begin with.  You came along in an old thread and stated a few "facts" about me and I simply pointed out you were incorrect.

[andyxlh]

Hello folks
Thanks for the help. Turns out I didn't buy the heads - was concerned re the engine mounting system on the front head and didn't want to take the chance so I will get my originals 'freshened up'.
Cheers
Andy

[jonkraushaar]

Oh im not mad I was just stating facts thats all because I was mistaking that I had done your heads. So Ifigured that I would throw some facts in there so people didnt think I was lieing or anything like that you know thats all.

[jonkraushaar]

Hey andy yes they are both the same chambers and ports from the factory. both sets of heads have the 7mm stuff and beehive s Other than that the heads are identicalprings. The only differences is the breaather hole and the color thats all.

[jonkraushaar]

Sorry andy I didnt mean to single you out I was meaning to point this out to everybody but I was replying to mayor. Those castings that you have andy are the best set of heads that harley makes by far they have a nice short side radius which makes for better airflow. but it still needs to be ported and converted to the 5/16

[jonkraushaar]

valve stems also for better airflow. Of course you dont have to but it would give you more hp and torque depending on  your cams. Plus the valve seats are constricting airflow through the ports. If you notice where the seat sit on the aluminium they stick out farther than the aluminium. That causes air restriction in turn causes less power. So if you open those up to match the ports you get better air flow, but if you open them to far you take the risk of seats falling out, no power because your port is now turbulent. I hope I've helped with the info that I have giving If not all you have to do is ask and I will educate you. Thank you for listening.

Jon Kraushaar

[andyxlh]

Thanks Jon,
So you are saying I have the better heads now (the '89 ones?) At the last rebuild I had the heads ported and flowed but kept the stock valves from the 883 - I will have to do the same this rebuild due to costs.
Thanks fo the info!
cheers
Andy

[jonkraushaar]

If you have the 91-03 heads for your sportster than no but if you have the 04 1200r heads than yes those are the best heads because of the floors the stock 883 heads can be good if they are ported and/or just a valve job. Yes money is always the issue but if you want maybe I can work something up for it to be cheap and get you some horsepower and then you spread the word for me and get me some business. Instead of talking prices on air we should email me and Ill give you prices then you can decide but its up to you. jonkraushaar@yahoo.com. Let me know andy I would love to help.

[andyxlh]

Thank you Jon very much for our kind offer, but I live in Sydney Australia! I have the '89 model 883 heads, which I had ported and flowed in the last top end rebuild 100000km ago. I have heard that the early 883 and 1100 heads are supposed to be really good, but I think the 883 I have are different and were changed some point in the late 80's?

[nrhs sales]

Just an FYI,
John Kraushaar is no longer assciated with NRHS in any way. Yes he used to work for us but he does not have any rights to our CNC headporting programs nor to our exclusive competition valve job radius cutters.  He is doing headwork by hand and he does not own a flow bench. I am not even sure how he plans to properly cut the valve seats, deck the heads, etc. without at least a mill but maybe he bought one?

If you do decide to use him for headwork please understand that he is not associated with NRHS in any way and we do not endorse his product.

[jonkraushaar]

Just to let you know dan I have everything I need even a flowbench I am set up to do headwork. So on that note it would be my pleasure to have your work just like before when I was at nrhs.

[-SeabrookTrickBagger]

Jon,

A fellow in your neck of the woods is working on a Buell.  PM me and I will hook you two guys up.  He might be able to use your head work but I don't think Salt Flats is his goal.

[jonkraushaar]

Hey Seabrook sent you a pm Thanks.

[mayor]

Jon,

we have a head porters thread sticky in the indy shops section.  http://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php/topic,15.0.html
PM me your info if you would like to be added to the list. (NRHS, you are already on that list).

[jonkraushaar]

Mayor your the man thanks a lot.

Sincerly, Jon

[xlfan]

What would be the reason for replacing 7mm valve stems and guides with 5/16'' valve stems and guides?

xlfan

[jonkraushaar]

When you have head work done some people change cams and the 7mm valves cant handle the pressure of the new cam it may have way to much TDC lift for those valves to handle so you convert the head to 5/16 valve stems, bigger springs, stronger retainers and heat treated valve locks . This way they can handle the pressure of the new cam and you dont have to worry about popping the heads off the valves because of the higher lift cam.