Question on Heads???

[foxfloat]

I have a 2010 Streetglide with an S&S 106, SE54h cam and a Vance and Hines Pro Pipe....I am looking at the SE 103" Heads OR having the stock ones ported and polished at Big Boyz......Wondering what people in the Know think is the better route....Thanks

[Admiral Akbar]

I'd get the sock heads ported so that they flow 260-270 intake, 210-230 ex at 600 lift 28 in.

Max

[Hillside Motorcycle]

That would do it.
Scott

[strokerjlk]

I have a 2010 Streetglide with an S&S 106, SE54h cam and a Vance and Hines Pro Pipe....I am looking at the SE 103" Heads OR having the stock ones ported and polished at Big Boyz......Wondering what people in the Know think is the better route....Thanks

get your stock heads ported,instead of buying a set that need ported as well.
whats your goal?
if your not at 95-100 hp 105-110 tq. right now. then it needs a good tune.
here is what I see a lot. guy spends money on ported heads,then has a so-so tuner tune it. it isn't near as good as the guy who bolts the same cams in a stock head bike,then gets a good tune.
I guess my point is, if it is at it,s most optimal operation state now and you want more go for the heads. and another tune from the guy who got it there. if it isn't where it should be now don't get the heads done and re tune with the same tuner. you will only end up with what you could of had with stock heads and a good tune.

[Steve Cole]

Make sure that you talk with a few people if you can with your combination and see if there results fit your riding style. I see way too many people buying into the last 3 - 4 Hp at 5500 - 6200 RPM that gets pushed on them. Go out and figure where you ride at, for most it is in the 2000 - 4500 RPM range and the majority of it is 2000 - 3500. If that's the area you ride in then get your combination setup for that and forget about winning a dyno number game

[JohnCA58]

   with Steve,  that is what make my bike so much fun to ride.  I am generally in the 2500 to 4500 rpm  and still have something to redline.  I may not be at the front of the pack, but they are not leaving me either.

[Dennis The Menace]

+2 what Steve said.  It worked for me.

I would get your current heads reworked and save some coin.  But, thats just me--it's your money.  Reworked with new springs, keepers valves and guides, and they are good as new and likely better than the SE heads out of the box.

JMO

Dennis

[strokerjlk]

he already has a combo that works well. 103 ci and either 54 cams OR se 254 cams  either way it will work out to be a good combo. I think his question was 103 SE heads or have the stock heads ported?

[Don D]

Send what ya got
Either can be made to work very well.

[Admiral Akbar]

I am generally in the 2500 to 4500 rpm  and still have something to redline.

Sounds good to me.. Torque don't need to be going up above 4500 but it's nice if HP is..

Max

[prodrag1320]

have your stock heads ported,look around,lots of very good porters out there

[foxfloat]

TO get the heads done I am looking at about $699.00.....I can get a brand new pair of SE 103" Heads for $750.00...So the cost is pretty much the same.

[02roadcling]

Your stock with 699 will smoke the se heads unless you spend a few hundred on them too.

[autoworker]

It's your money and spend it as you please.
In my opinion you will get a better final product for less money spent using a good porter.There are a few good ones on this forum and on a couple other forums.

[foxfloat]

So do you suggest a just a Port/Polish Job....Or should i plain the heads as well?

[mayor]

I'm with cling and autoworker, I think that a good head porter can make stock heads outperform out of the box heads.  I think you would be best served asking a few head porters what they might recommend based on your budget and goals, and decide from that info on which way you think aligns with those goals.  Each porter has their own technique and style, so each might give you a different take on what they think would be best to do based on what you are trying to accomplish.  Some like port and polish, some prefer larger valves, some prefer....etc. 

[autoworker]

Have them decked to achieve the desired compression based on your cam and to make the compression equal on both cylinders.
Hopefully a few porters will chime in and give you some more suggestions.
It wouldn't hurt to contact Bean at BigBoyz and explore your options and weigh costs.

[05FLHTC]

Sure would be nice to see the before & after dyno numbers performed by a good dyno operator on the same machine...

[Don D]

Hmmmmm
Well if you don't have the 103 heads already then I would not buy them and just bolt them on and expect them to be equal or better than the stock head reworked.
You should look around at porting. $699 is a nice round number but there is the same to be had for ~$250 less. Your heads on that 106" with a .030 head gasket and only enough milling to equalize the chambers will get you right where you need to be for compression. Another option is boring the stock cylinders to 3.932" and using Axtell / Wossner 107" pistons.

[foxfloat]

Thanks All!

[BVHOG]

699 at BigBoyz? since when?    Get your heads done, set up the 54H for 10 to1 and get a better pipe than the Pro Pipe. (Bassani Road Rage, Fatcat, ST Supermeg) And I agree with Don, look into getting your cylinders bored and by all means pay attention to the tune and ignore the numbers.

[Bagger]

$699 at BigBoyz? since when?    Get your heads done, set up the 54H for 10 to1 and get a better pipe than the Pro Pipe. (Bassani Road Rage, Fatcat, ST Supermeg) And I agree with Don, look into getting your cylinders bored and by all means pay attention to the tune and ignore the numbers.

Big Boyz advertises $299, but it's really À la carte, $299 sounds like an inviting price initially.
Why not have a head reworked with new valves, valve guides, springs, retainers and keepers, who wants their old parts reinstalled, just saying... 

$299 Port heads (reuse your old valves and springs)
$25   cc heads
$70   Mill heads
$       Replace valve guides
$      1.9" intake valve
$       New exhaust valve
$       New springs / retainers / keepers

As an example for $650 you can get something like this from Syke Performance (PanHeadRed), Westminster, MD:

Full porting & CNC machined combustion chambers
Milling and cc'ing of heads to achieve desired combustion chamber size
New AV&V 1.900" intake valves & AV&V 1.570" / 1.610" / 1.615" / 1.630"  exhaust valves (Depends on build & customer desire).
New AV&V premium springs
New AV&V 4340 chromoly retainers.
New AV&V locks
New AV&V Viton seals
Heads will be flowed tested & provided flow testing data

Link for AV&V info.
Valves: http://www.av-v.com/high_flow_valves.htm
Springs: http://www.av-v.com/valve_springs.htm
Valve Guides: http://www.av-v.com/valve_guides.htm

Or use anyone of these porters on this attached excel spreadsheet, it's easier to add
head porters too than the HTT list I compiled in 2006.

Edited to add exhaust sizes to Syke Heads info.
Edited to add HTT Link: http://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=15.0


[attachment removed after 60 days by system]

[Barrett]

The compression releases are another item that increase the cost.  My heads were $375. including shipping.

[Don D]

IME there are items that are value added and then some just add cost, won't give any added life / reliability to the motor nor will they add torque or power. Simple as that. Opinions vary on this topic.
IME Premium valves, guides and seals are essential. Springs on a case by case basis. The Andrews 54 is listed on their website as using "stock" springs. Compression releases can be avoided if the corrected compression is kept reasonable. Some have voiced interest in the new ACR valves retrofitted to the late heads. They work well and with the proper software can be activated in the ECU on 07up bikes. These solenoid valves will also work with the older bikes using a starter trigger and adjusting the flow.

[Admiral Akbar]

New AV&V 1.900" intake valves & AV&V 1.570" / 1.610 exhaust valves.

Red is caving in on the 1.57?   

Max

[Deye76]

Probably giving the customer what they want. After all "the customer is always right" . 

[Admiral Akbar]

Probably giving the customer what they want. After all "the customer is always right" . 

Not when it comes to Red..    Max

[Bagger]

Probably giving the customer what they want. After all "the customer is always right" . 

Yep, what the customer wants; stock size or larger exhaust valve depending on the build.

[aharp]

I'm with Don. We do the guides, valves, seals, and springs (as needed). IMO, you can't put a price on a properly fit valve train. Added flow from the tapered guides is minimal (compared to other port mods) but being able to control the valve to guide fit is critical. A quiet top end and the oil control that comes with properly fit components is more than just a small added benefit.

[troop]

I'm with cling and autoworker, I think that a good head porter can make stock heads outperform out of the box heads.  I think you would be best served asking a few head porters what they might recommend based on your budget and goals, and decide from that info on which way you think aligns with those goals.  Each porter has their own technique and style, so each might give you a different take on what they think would be best to do based on what you are trying to accomplish.  Some like port and polish, some prefer larger valves, some prefer....etc.

I'm finding this out to be very true! I proposed my build (2009 96"/SE204/SE 1.725/.030) to several porters and have been told bigger valves, stock valves, no porting, mild porting, wild porting, etc. The main consistent thing was CC'ing. But then again, prices also ranged from $235 > $900. I have narrowed it down but am still always reading...... 

[Scurvy]

I have a 2010 Streetglide with an S&S 106,

So you are already at 106"? You will want to talk to your head porter about options for keeping your compression manageable. Dan Baisley gave me excellent advice and did the heads for my 107".

[prodrag1320]

bagger,you left us off your spreadsheet,we`re listed on the HHT "head porters" post
WWW.VEETWINPERFORMANCE.COM

[Barrett]

I'm finding this out to be very true! I proposed my build (2009 96"/SE204/SE 1.725/.030) to several porters and have been told bigger valves, stock valves, no porting, mild porting, wild porting, etc. The main consistent thing was CC'ing. But then again, prices also ranged from $235 > $900. I have narrowed it down but am still always reading...... 
[/quote] I've been told my 37's were too big from some and not big enough for porting from others, so I know where you're coming from. My heads cc'd at 85.8/86 and it's running great with the .030HG and 1.725's, I'm advancing my cams +4 to see how I'll like the earlier intake close and it would put me at 9.2 corrected, it would pretty much be the same as your build and I'm liking what I'm feeling so far, the sprocket should be here soon so I'll give you an update.

[troop]

I'm finding this out to be very true! I proposed my build (2009 96"/SE204/SE 1.725/.030) to several porters and have been told bigger valves, stock valves, no porting, mild porting, wild porting, etc. The main consistent thing was CC'ing. But then again, prices also ranged from $235 > $900. I have narrowed it down but am still always reading...... 

I've been told my 37's were too big from some and not big enough for porting from others, so I know where you're coming from. My heads cc'd at 85.8/86 and it's running great with the .030HG and 1.725's, I'm advancing my cams +4 to see how I'll like the earlier intake close and it would put me at 9.2 corrected, it would pretty much be the same as your build and I'm liking what I'm feeling so far, the sprocket should be here soon so I'll give you an update.
[/quote]

Nice.. Thanks !!

[prodrag1320]

no cams are "too big or too small" for ported heads,with the 37`s,we like 1.900/1.625 heads with moderate compresion,works very well for a milder build

[Bagger]

bagger,you left us off your spreadsheet,we`re listed on the HHT "head porters" post
WWW.VEETWINPERFORMANCE.COM

Ok, you are now on the list. 

And here is the HTT link, it's grown since my first compilation in 2006
http://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=15.0

[Sonny S.]

no cams are "too big or too small" for ported heads,with the 37`s,we like 1.900/1.625 heads with moderate compresion,works very well for a milder build

just curious....have any dyno sheets with those heads on a 95" TW37 build ?

[mayor]

And here is the HTT link, it's grown since my first compilation in 2006
http://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=15.0

I modified the title to credit you for the list.    I knew it was from the old site, but couldn't remember who created it. 

[Bagger]

And here is the HTT link, it's grown since my first compilation in 2006
http://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=15.0

I modified the title to credit you for the list.    I knew it was from the old site, but couldn't remember who created it.

Do I get free points or stamps to redeem 

[prodrag1320]

no cams are "too big or too small" for ported heads,with the 37`s,we like 1.900/1.625 heads with moderate compresion,works very well for a milder build

just curious....have any dyno sheets with those heads on a 95" TW37 build ?

im out of town till 12/7,post some when i get home(thanks bagger for the updated list)

[Sonny S.]

Kirby 

[BVHOG]

$699 at BigBoyz? since when?    Get your heads done, set up the 54H for 10 to1 and get a better pipe than the Pro Pipe. (Bassani Road Rage, Fatcat, ST Supermeg) And I agree with Don, look into getting your cylinders bored and by all means pay attention to the tune and ignore the numbers.

Big Boyz advertises $299, but it's really À la carte, $299 sounds like an inviting price initially.

Why not have a head reworked with new valves, valve guides, springs, retainers and keepers, who wants their old parts reinstalled, just saying...  [/font][/color]

$299 Port heads (reuse your old valves and springs)
$25   cc heads
$70   Mill heads
$       Replace valve guides
$      1.9" intake valve
$       New exhaust valve
$       New springs / retainers / keepers

Ok, we are talking about a relatively mild cam here, why replace stock low mileage guides?, why replace stock springs and retainers when they are still very serviceable items running well within spec? Money to burn? Have them install the 1.9's? hardly worth it IMHO. These are entry level heads any way you look at it.  The things you mentioned are not necessary for the average street rider at this level of build, I would rather use the basic port job and use the extra money on the bottom end.
I am sure the porter you mentioned does flawless work as well but I am just not into needlessly replacing part$.

[se]

when comparing head porters compare them to the quality of work that they do.
a 299 dollar job is just that a cheap job.
when you start getting into cnc and street ports and replacing parts the cost goes up. true some parts may be needless. but not many.
the rule of thumb is if its off the bike have it done correctly a needless part can soon be the weakest link and have seen far too many cheap heads come apart a few miles later and now a cheap job becoms an expensive fix,
quality costs
compare apples to apples not pintos to porsches

[Bagger]

Ok, we are talking about a relatively mild cam here, why replace stock low mileage guides?, why replace stock springs and retainers when they are still very serviceable items running well within spec? Money to burn? Have them install the 1.9's? hardly worth it IMHO. These are entry level heads any way you look at it.  The things you mentioned are not necessary for the average street rider at this level of build, I would rather use the basic port job and use the extra money on the bottom end.
I am sure the porter you mentioned does flawless work as well but I am just not into needlessly replacing part$.

It might be one thing if the stock heads are very low mileage,
but really, are their folks with stock heads that have 50,000 or 60,000  or more miles on them, that'll just rebuild with
the same worn high mileage parts - wow.... 

And who is going to only pay $300 and not pay the additional $100 for cc'ing and milling to equalize the chambers or achieve the desired compression ratio - now your at $400?  What if they are high mileage heads,  ching, ching for new parts?  My experience with three sets of pre 2005 heads have been that they all were 87-89 cc's, not the 85cc Harley states in my 2002 service manual.

[Barrett]

when comparing head porters compare them to the quality of work that they do.
a 299 dollar job is just that a cheap job.
when you start getting into cnc and street ports and replacing parts the cost goes up. true some parts may be needless. but not many.
the rule of thumb is if its off the bike have it done correctly a needless part can soon be the weakest link and have seen far too many cheap heads come apart a few miles later and now a cheap job becoms an expensive fix,
quality costs 
compare apples to apples not pintos to porsches

My Pinto is a Pangra, it worked for me.

[prodrag1320]

giudes are replaced(in our heads anyway),to conture the port & reconture the guide boss itself.while some do have head packages for around 299.00(that pretty much concentrate on the bowl & valve job itself)all of our fully ported heads(as well as most decent porters)will remove the guides to properly work the port itself)you get what you pay for

[Don D]

Barrett
Sorry OT
Nobody knows about those Pangras.
My Pinto back in the day was a Pangra ( and Porsche) killer. I ran it on Galpin Fords dyno and they shut it down at 5K (was good to 8,500) when I topped their Spearco Turbo Pangra. They said they didn't want to hurt my motor, What a joke. On another dyno Geraghty it made 195 rwhp, NA, with twin 45 DCOE. Would run 13.75 in street trim and pull more than 1g skidpad. Ugly as sin ride hard as hell and tools in the trunk

[Barrett]

I bet that Pangra was fun. I paid $3,000 for porting on my LS1 heads and I do understand that you get what you pay for but I wasn't ready to go to that level yet with my FXDF, the larger valves needed the brows cut and I didn't want to go with larger pistons til my crank was done so I was just going to do the .030HG for a compression bump but when I saw how the heads looked I decided to have them cleaned up and keep the stock valves/springs for now. It did turn out real good for me and with what little I have in my bike it kicks butt. I am still learning HD's and my next plan is 3.885/1700cc Wiseco's and either a Wood TW5-6, TW7 or TW6H, then I'll be ready to spend the money on my heads. I also have a 40HP dry shot from my ZX12R that I'll probably be using.

[strokerjlk]

Ok, we are talking about a relatively mild cam here, why replace stock low mileage guides?, why replace stock springs and retainers when they are still very serviceable items running well within spec? Money to burn? Have them install the 1.9's? hardly worth it IMHO. These are entry level heads any way you look at it.  The things you mentioned are not necessary for the average street rider at this level of build, I would rather use the basic port job and use the extra money on the bottom end.
I am sure the porter you mentioned does flawless work as well but I am just not into needlessly replacing part$.

It might be one thing if the stock heads are very low mileage,
but really, are their folks with stock heads that have 50,000 or 60,000  or more miles on them, that'll just rebuild with
the same worn high mileage parts - wow.... 

And who is going to just $300 and not pay the additional $100 for cc'ing and milling to equalize the chambers or achieve the desired compression ratio - now your at $400?  What if they are high mileage heads,  ching, ching for new parts?  My experience with three sets of pre 2005 heads have been that they all were 87-89 cc's, not the 85cc Harley states in my 2002 service manual.

50,000-60,000 is high mileage? only on certain forums. the problem isn't reusing 50-60,000 mile parts,the problem is the guys that make money installing new parts telling you it's high mileage. I remember when we didnt install new valves until they couldn't be ground anymore.
of course I have ran .080 piston in one hole and .020 over in the other. things used to be a lot simpler. I see your point though it adds up fast,when you start replacing everything.

[Admiral Akbar]

50,000-60,000 is high mileage? only on certain forums. the problem isn't reusing 50-60,000 mile parts,the problem is the guys that make money installing new parts telling you it's high mileage.

The only way to tell if it's serviceable is to measure the check against the spec.. You may be dating yourself on the regrinding valves.. That has pretty much gone to tossing them unless they clean up with a light touch. Any more and we used to give them back to the customer showing the pits..  Newer valves have hardened faces that you can grind through and you'll be lucky to get 5 to 10 before you need another valve job.

Hardened valve faces has pretty much been the way to go since unleaded gas but motors that spun higher RPM were doing that way before unleaded was mandatory..

Also some of the valve ends are probably shot by 60K.. You could put it back together that way I guess..

It's judgment call on valves. I'll replace 1 bad, 2 if they are the same but will go all new for anything above..  Same with guides..

At 50 -60 K it's trying to judge how far you want the motor to go before you need to pull it down again..

Max

[Don D]

why replace stock low mileage guides

Simple the factory threw us a little screwball and now all the newer heads have ~.0017 intake and ~.0025 exhaust clearance. Valves can be felt and do wobble now, new stock heads are like this. They didn't with the older heads. Why do this? Warrenty simple as that. They will make it past the 2 yr mark before the seals are shot and not seize the rear exhaust valves in the guides. Ethanol fuel, added heat, and the low cost cast iron guide material are the root causes of the need for added clearance. We, the service industry, change them with higher quality guides that are bronze manganese tapered so they flow better, set up safely with less clearance, and last far in excess of 50K miles assuming regular oil changes and no air filter issues. Valve seals are premium viton and last far longer. This lower oil quantity coming down the guides keeps those valves carbon free so they flow the same as they did when installed for a much longer time and mileage period, more power longer.. 

Have them install the 1.9's? hardly worth it IMHO

Hardly worth using the stockers IMHO, more work less flow. To get a decent profile on the seats, concentric (not done with Neway cutters) and grinding the stock valve you end up with the valves sunk and that hinders flow. The stock 2006up intake port has a bowl that measures ~1.920 which without any grinding is sized perfectly for the 1.9 valve, as is the intake opening diameter perfect size, after the seat throat is opened proportionally, a good seat is machined, and the floor and the rest of the port are mildly blended air speed increases at all lifts as well as flow. The 1.9 is a natural fit for the twin cam but has some production cost issues that precludes their use IMO. The sportster valve head size fits a high shareholder model and parts commonality.

This work is very beneficial for all cams being used in terms of performance, quiet operation, and added reliability / durabiltiy. It does however take time and parts so the cost goes up very slightly over the low cost leaders.

[wfolarry]

I've heard of hardened seats but who has hardened valve faces? I know they changed material but what kind of hardening process are they using? How deep does it go? What's the safe amount of material that can be removed?
Speaking of valve seats HD uses different material on their stock heads vs the SE heads. Which valves should I be using in each?
Should I put my valve grinder on e-bay now?
All these new valves do you check to see if they were ground within spec?
I paid extra money for a chuck on my valve grinder that has .0002 or less runout. I check every new valve I get.
The only ones tossing the valves are the ones that don't have a valve grinder that can do the job right. Or don't have a valve grinder at all. That's for faces & stems.


As far as valve sizing goes I don't have any problem getting those little 1.8 intakes flowing just fine. Those stock ex. valves work fine too. I'm not against bigger valves but I don't think they are mandatory.

The loose guide fit is oil based. Cars, bikes everything. Big trucks will be next. Caterpillar stopped making engines for highway use because of the EPA.

There is a way to sink valves & improve flow.


I am a little dated as well. Rebuilt my first smallblock chevy in autoshop in 1972. Started doin' HD's a couple years later. I guess it's time for me to retire. I must be fallin' behind the times. Just be an assembler with all new parts. Forget all this machining crap. What was I thinking?

The times they are a changin' [Still holds true today]

[Deye76]

"There is a way to sink valves & improve flow."

The guy I know who builds motors for the Hemi challenge, and runs a car in it also thinks/knows so. He does it to the few H-D heads he's coerced into porting.

Don't retire Larry, the midwest is almost "head porter" bankrupt now.

[Don D]

I agree with you Larry
I know how to do that too, more work sinking the valves and working the chamber for a pressure recovery deal. Bottom line is it takes time and time is money. Most of us know how to take things that are less than our ideal choice and make it work if we have to. We also have a lot of opinions on what the "ideal" is.
Look at the car head porters, the restricted classes, and stock castings etc.
But the bottom line is always there is no free lunch and the bargain low price leaders just don't spend the time or offer any improvement in parts, can't do it, not in the budget. Plus the valve grinding techniques and seats etc are in many cases not as high quality as OEM. We are trying to improve things, and many do, but that takes machines, tooling, time and parts. All things that we need to be paid for. This is not a gouge mind you just a reasonable service offering for a decent return.

[Admiral Akbar]

I've heard of hardened seats but who has hardened valve faces? I know they changed material but what kind of hardening process are they using? How deep does it go? What's the safe amount of material that can be removed?
Speaking of valve seats HD uses different material on their stock heads vs the SE heads. Which valves should I be using in each?
Should I put my valve grinder on e-bay now?
All these new valves do you check to see if they were ground within spec?
I paid extra money for a chuck on my valve grinder that has .0002 or less runout. I check every new valve I get.
The only ones tossing the valves are the ones that don't have a valve grinder that can do the job right. Or don't have a valve grinder at all. That's for faces & stems.

Yep,

Not sure, it may only be heat treat..  Ask your valve reps and see what they say..

I suspect that if you grind of 0.040 you've gone too far..

Don't know

Don't put the grinder on ebay send it to me.. 

Sorta,

cool..

I don't have a valve grinder.. Had one but figured I'd never use it again so sold it.. Needed money at the time.. Right now it's still cheaper to replace.

Max

[Don D]

I have checked new valves and from AV&V they are very close to perfect. I do not grind them after checking. I have an accu-chuck collet system and my machine holds very true tolerances.

[autoworker]

Good post Larry.

[ultra 08]

I,m with Steve I didn,t spend alot of money to get 90 hp and 100 ft. lbs. out of my 96" and the heads haven,t even been off. My power is on at 2145 rpms with 90 ft. lbs It really makes for a nice ride, most people ride in the low to mid range of the rpm band.

[strokerjlk]

Good post Larry.

+2

[Admiral Akbar]

Yeah good post Larry,

I wacked on a early TC  exhaust valve and it don't look hardened.. While the steel is tough, it don't appear to be hard faced or treated. Could be but I wouldn't be surprised if it ain't but just work hardened a little.  Early in the 70s Honda came out with a service bulletin that said to any valve that looked  like it needed refacing because the grinder could remove the hard face on the valves and they would not last... Have seen it on a number of builds (hondas).  I assumed this carried over when everything went unleaded as the hard face and hard seats kept those motor running and others were having problems.. Still I wouldn't be surprised if some of the higher end valves have hardened faces..

Do you want my address to send the valve grinder too?   

Max

[Hillside Motorcycle]

I've heard of hardened seats but who has hardened valve faces? I know they changed material but what kind of hardening process are they using? How deep does it go? What's the safe amount of material that can be removed?
Speaking of valve seats HD uses different material on their stock heads vs the SE heads. Which valves should I be using in each?
Should I put my valve grinder on e-bay now?
All these new valves do you check to see if they were ground within spec?
I paid extra money for a chuck on my valve grinder that has .0002 or less runout. I check every new valve I get.
The only ones tossing the valves are the ones that don't have a valve grinder that can do the job right. Or don't have a valve grinder at all. That's for faces & stems.


As far as valve sizing goes I don't have any problem getting those little 1.8 intakes flowing just fine. Those stock ex. valves work fine too. I'm not against bigger valves but I don't think they are mandatory.

The loose guide fit is oil based. Cars, bikes everything. Big trucks will be next. Caterpillar stopped making engines for highway use because of the EPA.

There is a way to sink valves & improve flow.


I am a little dated as well. Rebuilt my first smallblock chevy in autoshop in 1972. Started doin' HD's a couple years later. I guess it's time for me to retire. I must be fallin' behind the times. Just be an assembler with all new parts. Forget all this machining crap. What was I thinking?

The times they are a changin' [Still holds true today]

 
Scott

[BVHOG]

I've heard of hardened seats but who has hardened valve faces? I know they changed material but what kind of hardening process are they using? How deep does it go? What's the safe amount of material that can be removed?
Speaking of valve seats HD uses different material on their stock heads vs the SE heads. Which valves should I be using in each?
Should I put my valve grinder on e-bay now?
All these new valves do you check to see if they were ground within spec?
I paid extra money for a chuck on my valve grinder that has .0002 or less runout. I check every new valve I get.
The only ones tossing the valves are the ones that don't have a valve grinder that can do the job right. Or don't have a valve grinder at all. That's for faces & stems.


As far as valve sizing goes I don't have any problem getting those little 1.8 intakes flowing just fine. Those stock ex. valves work fine too. I'm not against bigger valves but I don't think they are mandatory.

The loose guide fit is oil based. Cars, bikes everything. Big trucks will be next. Caterpillar stopped making engines for highway use because of the EPA.

There is a way to sink valves & improve flow.


I am a little dated as well. Rebuilt my first smallblock chevy in autoshop in 1972. Started doin' HD's a couple years later. I guess it's time for me to retire. I must be fallin' behind the times. Just be an assembler with all new parts. Forget all this machining crap. What was I thinking?

The times they are a changin' [Still holds true today]

Awesome post!!!!!

[Don D]

Nice work, I am sure, knowing you as I do, regardless of the appearance the result is right on.
And of course we all grind valves.
I just was testing a new 110 head and swapped exhaust valves (stock to another new premium stainless valve) with no other changes picked up 19cfm peak and gains from .100 up.

[Admiral Akbar]

I just was testing a new 110 head and swapped exhaust valves (stock to another new premium stainless valve) with no other changes picked up 19cfm peak and gains from .100 up.

Isn't it neat when you find this.. Max.

[wfolarry]

Put them in the motor & let me know how much more power it makes.

Reminds me of another guy who said he ports the head then tries different valves to see which one flows best & that one goes in there. If he was a REAL porter he would know how to shape the port for the type of valve he was using. Works good if you're racing flowbenches though.

[Admiral Akbar]

Seems to me that since there isn't an easy way to put metal back into the port, that making a port bigger to accommodate a different valve might not be a good idea.. I guess it could be the results of velocity becoming too high, and material needing removal, but it may be just the due to changing the flow around the seat and taking metal out there may or may no be a good thing..

Max
(not a head porter)