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TC MM FI to Carb Conversion

Started by PanHeadRed, July 15, 2011, 06:31:39 AM

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PanHeadRed

I would like to hear form those of you that have done this.

dog

Changed 2005 Road Glide, all was plug and play. Cost about $800.00 or under, It depends and what you all ready have at home. I am very happy

tdkkart


truck

#3
This is what it took for a 2001 ElectraGlide a couple of years ago.
It was an easy conversion.

[attach=0]
Listen to the jingle the rumble and the roar.

MikeL

MM to carb definately a good move did mine over the winter used Trucks part list for basics. No regrets should have done it sooner. If I had Delphi FI I would hunker down and fix that system. So much better than MM.


                                                                                        MIKE

evhid1

Did my 2001 Ultra 3 or 4 years ago, MM to Carb. Used a SE42 carb, and I think Trucks parts list too. Sold bike a few months later but the best I can remember there are two harnesses, one with a cam sensor and one without, something like that. Just make sure you get the right one, also a big price difference in the two. A streight forward job pretty eazy, if my dumb ass can do it most anyone can. Good luck and it is deffinently the best way to go.

motown

just a question ! are the part numbers in Trucks parts list H-D part numbers ?

bladerunner

 When I converted my  `01 , I used a  harness  and ign module from an `02  and eliminated the cam sensor .....bladerunner
Erie , pennsylvania

dunbarton

Quote from: truck on July 15, 2011, 01:23:07 PM
This is what it took for a 2001 ElectraGlide a couple of years ago.
It was an easy conversion.
Ditto on 2000 Ultra. In year 2 now since conversion and absolutely no regrets. Bike runs as well or better than it ever did with MM.

aharp

Ive done a few before i knew anyone had a nicely put together parts list. Its easy.
Speed costs money. How fast do you want to spend?

truck

Quote from: motown on July 16, 2011, 03:09:36 AM
just a question ! are the part numbers in Trucks parts list H-D part numbers ?
Yes they are H-D part numbers and two year old prices.
The throttle cables aren't needed for the conversion and the MAP sensor can be reused, it's not called a MAP sensor on the MM system (barometric something or other) but it is the same part.
You will most likely need a spacer for under the motor mount to the front head, I used two thick washers. Check the parts manual.
Listen to the jingle the rumble and the roar.

Deye76

#11
Quote from: dog on July 15, 2011, 07:57:34 AM
Changed 2005 Road Glide, all was plug and play. Cost about $800.00 or under, It depends and what you all ready have at home. I am very happy

You changed a a Delphi over, not a Magneti-Marelli. Only one guy I know of talks people into that bassackwards move. You from Michigan?

Glad it worked out for you. There is a shortage of good EFI tuners in SE Mich

Edit: spelling
East Tenn.<br /> 2020 Lowrider S Touring, 2014 CVO RK,  1992 FXRP

FSG

Changing a Delphi to Carb is not something I'd even consider. 

Deye76

Quote from: FSG on July 16, 2011, 03:22:46 PM
Changing a Delphi to Carb is not something I'd even consider.
Me either. I'll drive a few miles for a good tune. Dougly knows that.
East Tenn.<br /> 2020 Lowrider S Touring, 2014 CVO RK,  1992 FXRP

motown

Thanks truck !  great stuff I have a 2000 flhtc ,which runs good 21,000 miles  I;m getting ready to upgrade the cam plate ,pusrods lifters , I was thinking about cams ,but was afraid I couldnt get a good tuner to set the morelli up ,
some guy wanted $350 for a power commander and another $450 to tuner  just justifie that much cash. have a cv carb just in case    thanks

Topend

Did mine a year ago and no regrets. I used the carb ignition harness for my year 1999. I could have saved some money with I think 00 year harness (was told it would work & cheaper) but wanted to make sure I had no proplems. I get 40 to 42 mph and no complaints what so ever..  :up:
95 cu in, Andrews 37,  Supertrapp mufflers, 42mm Mikuni, SE/Heads, Crane 4HTC

Rugby_fxdwg

Quote from: truck on July 15, 2011, 01:23:07 PM
This is what it took for a 2001 ElectraGlide a couple of years ago.
It was an easy conversion.

Truck,
  What did you do with the ECM? What controls your cruise control? I have the brackets to add to the carb from a swapmeet special to my new SE CV44 but dont understand what controls the cuise control when I go to an ignition... Please help an ignorant brother out.....
1996 80" Wide Glide 10.5-1 85HP/85Ft; 1999 Ultra 95" 6speed; 1989 FXRS

truck

I believe the speedometer controls it. I didn't do anything special with it, just plug and play. I'm not sure I did anything at all with the cruise control, even plug and play. :nix:
Listen to the jingle the rumble and the roar.

Rugby_fxdwg

So you just added an ignition system and a coil? Sweet!
1996 80" Wide Glide 10.5-1 85HP/85Ft; 1999 Ultra 95" 6speed; 1989 FXRS

Rugby_fxdwg

Truck, thanks again... Did you remove the ECM?
1996 80" Wide Glide 10.5-1 85HP/85Ft; 1999 Ultra 95" 6speed; 1989 FXRS

truck

The ECM was replaced with the ignition module and it uses the same coil that was already there.
Listen to the jingle the rumble and the roar.

prodrag1320

did it to a customers bike when we went 124",used a vulcan cam cover,dyna ignition & coil with  S&S G,runs great

Tattoo

We just did one today on 2001 trike conversion went real smooth with no issues.
"You can have anything you want
But you better not take it from me"

Sonny S.

I have   :wink:
Now I'm doing a carb to Delphi EFI conversion.
I'll have all the parts to do the MM to carb conversion available soon.

2glides

I converted my 97 from MM to carb over the winter last year. The bike runs sweet and hasn't skipped a beat. I love it.
2Glides

jluich

One of you guys that have done or doing this should make a video tutorial and upload it to youtube.
Then repost here.

jluich

What are my options and cost to go carbs, and gear drive on a 2001 Twincam mm efi ?
Right now it's SE 204 chain drive, new SE oil pump (orange in color), is there a way to convert my cams to gear drive ?

Admiral Akbar

Quote from: jluich on February 04, 2014, 08:21:15 AM
What are my options and cost to go carbs, and gear drive on a 2001 Twincam mm efi ?
Right now it's SE 204 chain drive, new SE oil pump (orange in color), is there a way to convert my cams to gear drive ?

Should be a none issue.. Chain should be fine..

Max

07heri

Quote from: jluich on February 03, 2014, 06:50:37 PM
One of you guys that have done or doing this should make a video tutorial and upload it to youtube.
Then repost here.

its been hashed out over the net for years with parts lists and step by step.  google it up, its all out there.
2016 Heritage
Stage 1

Sonny S.


Rugby_fxdwg

I have a 99 ultra and switched to a carb before digging in to the motor.  I went with the SE44 carb which hurt my mpg at first. The big bitch was so much more responsive...I couldn't stop twisting the throttle. Yes I picked up a few mpg. Remember this, The newer FI bikes are more efficient, will get very last drop of HP out of your build. FI bikes will NEVER sound as sweet as a carb bike. Just a fact Jack! Flame on...lol
1996 80" Wide Glide 10.5-1 85HP/85Ft; 1999 Ultra 95" 6speed; 1989 FXRS

wayzalot

I thought I read someplace that the 99 has a metal fuel line in the tank that needs to be cut off at the bung.  Is this correct? 
"My life is based on a true story"

truck

Quote from: wayzalot on February 08, 2014, 09:58:47 AM
I thought I read someplace that the 99 has a metal fuel line in the tank that needs to be cut off at the bung.  Is this correct?
There were metal lines before 2001. I don't know if they went away in 2000 or if 2001 was the first year for plastic lines.
Listen to the jingle the rumble and the roar.

wayzalot

Quote from: truck on February 08, 2014, 10:07:00 AM
Quote from: wayzalot on February 08, 2014, 09:58:47 AM
I thought I read someplace that the 99 has a metal fuel line in the tank that needs to be cut off at the bung.  Is this correct?
There were metal lines before 2001. I don't know if they went away in 2000 or if 2001 was the first year for plastic lines.
Is there a trick to cutting the metal line off inside the tank?  My 01 Heritage has a plastic line which I had to replace because of a small hole wore in it where it made contact with the tank.  The replacement line was shorter which fixed the problem.  I thought I saw a thread on how to cut off the steel tube but cant seem to find it. 
"My life is based on a true story"

jluich

I have a 2001 Road King Police (MM EFI), I bought all the parts off ebay to do the conversion.I went with

NAMZ NHD-32435-01 IGNITION WIRE HARNESS 2001 HARLEY TOURING W/ CRANK SENSOR
Biker's Choice Chrome Late Style 22mm Fuel Petcock Left Spigot for Harley Models
Pingel Magneti Fuel Injection to Carburetor Conversion Fitting Kit
Harley Twin Cam Ignition Module Carb Models OEM Stock 32478-99A
S&S SUPER E CARB CARBURETOR KIT 1999-2005 HARLEY DAVDISON TWIN CAM TC 88 11-045

Now where do I start ?
Any advice, any proceedures that you think is done first ?

Rock4gzus

Based on just haing converted my 2001 FLHRCI, I recommend starting with the tank modifications because everything else is described as being (and was) "plug and play."  Many said that they left the fuel pump in the tank.  I would have done that too but a friend knew "the trick" to carefully removing the assembly to enable access to the fuel pump.  He made it look easy but sadly I don't remember how he did it ... but can find out if you decide to do so. 

I recall that getting the throttle body loose was also a bit difficult because it is hard to get adequate access to the front mounting point.  The rest was basically mounting the CV carburetor, installing a Pingle kit, exchanging the wiring harness and an ignition module for the ECM under the left side cover.

Clearly this conversion improved my bike's throttle response and overall performance.   Set up with a SERT, 95" engine and Anderws 21g cams (Joe Minton Build) my Max Torque improved from 92.26 to 103.71 and Max Power increased from 73.43 to 81.56.  My Fuel efficiency is now a little bit less at 40 MPG but is so worth it.

As mentioned earlier in this thread, Trucks homework and encouraging results proved to be very helpful.

kristian

altmann has a setup, cool read with lots of info and pics.  http://www.amm.haan.de/Carb/carb.htm

Kris

JohnCA58

Other option is keeping EFI and getting the HPi throttle body w/ delphi injector locations and injectors.   I'll keep mine.... to many ride's from sea level to 8,000 ft. around to run a carb.  my 120 with MM EFI runs perfect.  :scratch:
YOLO

BigTodd

The SE 43mm Throttle body for the MM works great as an upgrade over the factory 37mm unit.

68fl

I just did the conversion on my 2002 ultra.Everything works EXCEPT the speedo.Had the speedo and speed sensor checked by a dealer.They checked out ok.When I turn the ignition on,(about 5-10 seconds)the speedo needle drops below 0.It makes a buzzing static sound.This lasts for about 5 or so seconds.Took the ecm out.Wondering if the turn signal mudule has gone for a "Potty mouth" or not.If anyone can help me it would be great.I`ve spent a couple weeks of my spre time trying to figure this out.Thanks

jluich

What was the trick or tricks to removing the fuel pump ?

jluich

Mine has plastic lines

Quote from: wayzalot on February 08, 2014, 10:23:07 AM
Quote from: truck on February 08, 2014, 10:07:00 AM
Quote from: wayzalot on February 08, 2014, 09:58:47 AM
I thought I read someplace that the 99 has a metal fuel line in the tank that needs to be cut off at the bung.  Is this correct?
There were metal lines before 2001. I don't know if they went away in 2000 or if 2001 was the first year for plastic lines.
Is there a trick to cutting the metal line off inside the tank?  My 01 Heritage has a plastic line which I had to replace because of a small hole wore in it where it made contact with the tank.  The replacement line was shorter which fixed the problem.  I thought I saw a thread on how to cut off the steel tube but cant seem to find it.

Ajayrk

Quote from: jluich on April 25, 2016, 12:39:25 PM
What was the trick or tricks to removing the fuel pump ?

Remove the console and lay it back on a towel.
Remove all the screws in oval shaped canopy and lift it up with the pump attached.  It is a tight fit but you can wiggle the pump out.
Remove the clamp to the filter and pull the hose off.  Raise the canopy high enough to remove the inlet hose from the filter.
Set the console aside.  May have to unplug some wires here
With the hoses loose you can unscrew the fittings in the bottom of the tank.  You will have to guide the hoses as they will spin as they are being unscrewed.
There a few wires with plugs that you have to unplug.

Here for a diagram.

http://www.granitestateharleystore.com/OEMpartfinder.htm#/Harley-Davidson%C2%AE/FLHRI_FB_ROAD_KING_%282000%29/FUEL_PUMP%2c_FUEL_INJECTED_-_FLHRI_%26_FLHRCI/99456-00B\FB/99456-00B\T59\FB
AJ

jluich


Ajayrk

AJ

kink04fxd

I removed the fuel fittings and cut the hoses off, mine were plastic. Then you can remove the fuel pump assembly. Get a pingle kit and the rest is plug and play. Imo, M&M FI sucks. My bike runs so much better and sounds a lot better with a carb. Get better gas mileage to boot. CV 40 190/48 stock needle, no shims.   


2000 FLHTCI (now carb)<br />1982 FLH

StratoMan

Have a 2000 RK classic 4,500 mi I'm also conflicted as to MM to delfi style efi via s&s, or carb it..... with no bungs for closed loop sensors, the $ for EFI / ECM & new headers gets a bit hard to fathom since I just got this bike. But its performance low to mid range roll-on is suspect! Seems the carb is the least $ option, with no more mapping issues. Not sure of the timing ramifications & how that may need attention.

Alien

I converted my 2000 FLTRSEI to carb when I went different cams, higher compression etc and the MM started having tuning and cold start issues. This was many years ago and finding a competent MM tuner back then was difficult. Now fast forward to about 2010 or so and I had R & R do a 117 on my bike and with the high compression and tight new parts I again was having hard cold starting issues. I converted to Delphi EFI with a Dan Thayer conversion Harness, HPI throttle body, HD ECM with a race tuner. It ran great, started great, and was very reliable. I had a friend ask me to do the same for him and I have most of the parts but he ran out of money before we installed everything. I Might be selling if he can't come up with the money to finish?

Just another option?

StratoMan

In the crawl, before first steps.... but is certainly something to be considered. A solid offer from an experienced advocate for the EFI is of course something to be entertained! If things go south for you're buddy & I've got to a point where I've decided....we could pursue this further. By the way, awesome bike you got there!


StratoMan