Whirlpool Gas hotwater heater

[the Grump]

I'm trying to fix this thing for a friend who's out of town. The wife and kids haven't had hot water for days. So I go to Lowes and this guy tells me they've had trouble with the thermocouplers and that there was a kit to fix it for free. Made sense to me, that's the problem the pilot light wont stay lit. You cant keep the pilot lit to turn on the burner. So they overnight it, I put it in and CRAP.. the same thing. Does anyone have any ideas on this. I'd really appreciate it.

[03rdkng]

I am an electrician and not a plumber and it has been a while since I messed with a gas waterheater but shouldn't you be able to get some gas flow to the burner regardless of whether you can keep it lit.  I guess I am suggesting that their may be something wrong with the gas regulator on the waterheater.  I have seen that before.

[the Grump]

They have been sent a bunch of new stuff that they had to pay shipping. I found out about this kit which is supposed to be an improvement on the model. It it the tube that carries the gas to the burner, the pilot light and thermocoupler. So now everything is new and the friggin thing still will not light. The pilot light will come on but as soon as you release the button(reset) it goes out. You cannot turn the control to "ON" with the gas button(reset)depressed. I am not used to failing when it comes to fixing things and this is really pissin' me off.

[03rdkng]

Grump.
I don't want to lead you down the wrong road but you are describing the exact problem I had with a gas central heat unit in my home.
The gas regulator valves function basically the same in both systems.
You indicate that you are not sure it was the thermocouple.
I went the same route as you are now only to replace the regulator to fix the problem.
I do not know if waterheaters can be repaired at that level of component.

[the Grump]

I'm assuming the regulator is the thing with the heat range dial correct. I just put the new on that they had sent to them the night before last. Then I put on this kit with the new thermocouple tonight. Still NADA.

[03rdkng]

I am kinda assuming the age of your unit but yes the heat range dial and the pilot light button would be a unit that makes up the gas regulator.
And you get pilot light to flame but wont maintain?
Man, I am down to saying it took me a while to truly purge the new lines of air to get clean enough gas to hold the pilot light.
I stumbled with that for a few minutes but I assume you crossed that bridge already.

[the Grump]

I held it down lit for a minute at a time a number of times, I would think that there's no air in there.

[bigtoe]

     Hi Grump,
  Maybe I can be a little help.I had problems with my whirpool hot water heater too,replaced thermocouple twice in mine.
I find out later that they had a class action law suit on these hot water tanks.I called whirpool and they sent everything I needed to fix it,plus the cost of the thermocouples I replaced.So, maybe calling whirpool can help with getting this thing working again.

[fatboydan]

I am assuming that you have a new pilot line and orifice assembly,
a new thermocouple and control valve installed....

do you have a plentiful supply if gas ??

you say the pilot will light,but won't hold ? yes ??  no ??

is the pilot flame a good stiff blue flame ?  Yes ?? no ??

if yes,then is the top 3/4 of the thermocople tip immersed in said flame ?

yes ?? no ??

if the flame is not a good stiff blue,but rather a lazy blue flame with a yellow tip,then your pilot orifice is clogged or dirty...

Is the thermocouple secured tightly in the control valve ? yes ?? no ??

you may have a bad thermocouple..(yes they come bad from the factory)

you may want to turn the control valve completely OFF wait 5 minutes and reattempt lighting... since the purpose of the thermocouple is to keep the gas valve open for operation..in the event the pilot goes out,the thermocouple cools off and closes the gas valve preventing gas spilling into your home or garage... it needs to reset,most times you can hear a small audible click when it does...other times not

Oh,I've been working as a LP Gas service tech for the past 19 years AND....


I've stayed at quite a few Holiday Inns in my 50 plus years

[June2017]

Now that's what I'm talking about FatBoyDan !    

[kybagger]

Those heaters were junk. 1 of the buildings that i take care of at work had 2 of them.whirlpol sent me every part that could be replace on them,thermocoupler,gas valves,ect.., after fooling with them for around 2 months,I finally replaced them with 2 electric units.

[Randy_inKy]

this usually works on older units, before lighting take a small piece of emery cloth and clean the tube that is located in pilot flame, takes only couple minutes and may work, worth a try especially if there is any crust on the tube.

Randy

[Big_Bulky_RK]

Given the size of the orfice for the pilot is very small, and having  changed the complete valve unit on this water heater, depending how far back from the water heater the gas shutoff valve is, it may take quit some time with the pilot open to bleed enough air off to get a good blue flame for the thermocouple.  Most water heaters are feed with a 1/2 inch line and the orfice is smaller than a pin.  Good Luck

[the Grump]

Thanks Men, Now for the questions. Yes everything was tight, yes the pilot light is a nice blue flame. I even cleaned up the brand new thermocoupler with steel wool. Yes, the gas supply is good, I can hear the furnace kicking on. The pilot light will light but as soon as you release the button it goes out. I tried waiting 10 minutes, still the same. As far as if the coupler is 3/4 in the flame thats kind of hard to tell. Thanks for all the input, I think they're just going to have to call somebody.

[JamLazyAss]

Try this approach,

Fine tune the heater with your sledge hammer.
Then put the pieces in a garbage bag.
Return said garbage bag to Lowes.
Take the manager by the scruff and explain to him that you're just a little unhappy with his product.
And you would like another heater now, or you will place the old one where the sun doesn't shine.   

Man, you have the patients of a saint.

[Deye76]

Grump, it could be the Emergency cutoff, which is a thermo-fuse in the control. Sorry, have to change the control. May want to get someone who has done it before to keep from draining the tank. Best wishes.

[HDRDR]

Its the gas valve itself is causing the problem...meaning the valve with the (dial with the on /off pilot button) thats the gas valve thats controls your heat setting. The thermocouple puts out about 24 mil volts to hold the pilot light on, the coil in the valve sense's that voltage and opens the MAIN valve to the burner for ignition.....if the main gas doe's not come on it's the thermostat / gas valve.

Some cost more than a NEW heater it's a toss up at times?

Al

[HDRDR]

One more thing...is there a automatic damper on the flue? it could be bad also, but those are usually on larger heaters...I don't know what model you have as far as what's going on with the new energy saving heaters for homes. I work on the big ones.

[Bucket]

first off, why are you going to heat hot water, do you need steam, It's a water heater. The thermocouple (tc) is made up of two disimilar metals the two are welded together at the end. when heated they produce an e m f  electro motive force ( voltage ) very small  Mili volts. The gas valve has a coil on the piolet circuit when you press the button down to light it you compress ( make up ) the coil and when the tc get hot it produces emf enough to hold the coil down (open) You may not have the tc screwed into the gas valve far enough or not making good contact. the tc could be bad also the coil in the gas valve could be bad I would try a new tc first. Those cool boxes that truck drivers use to keep things cold use thermopiles the reverse happens when you put voltage to them they cool. Hope this helps.

[HDRDR]

first off, why are you going to heat hot water, do you need steam, It's a water heater. The thermocouple (tc) is made up of two disimilar metals the two are welded together at the end. when heated they produce an e m f  electro motive force ( voltage ) very small  Mili volts. The gas valve has a coil on the piolet circuit when you press the button down to light it you compress ( make up ) the coil and when the tc get hot it produces emf enough to hold the coil down (open) You may not have the tc screwed into the gas valve far enough or not making good contact. the tc could be bad also the coil in the gas valve could be bad I would try a new tc first. Those cool boxes that truck drivers use to keep things cold use thermopiles the reverse happens when you put voltage to them they cool. Hope this helps.

Where are you from Bucket? I just stated that! just asking.

[Bucket]

you did and did a good job. I was in the process when you posted so didn't read it until now. South of Memphis about 10 miles in Mississippi

[HDRDR]

 

[the Grump]

Yeah, Yeah, gas hotwater heater. Your a funny guy. The gas valve was the first thing I replaced and there was another one on the floor by the heater when I first started. That makes 3 of them total. Personally I like the hammer idea.

[Ryder]

If it is a newer water heater there may be two wires coming from the socket that the thermcouple screws into. They are for kind of a high limit switch. Plus the small amount of 750 milivolts has to travel thru these wires to complete the circuit. If the voltage from the thermocouple can not complete the circuit then the magnet that holds open the saftey will not engergize. (when you push down the the red button while lighting the pilot). If there are two wire on the water heater you are working on closely inspect the connections. Just a little bit of corrosion or not touching will reduce the small amount of voltage. If I remember right you need at least 500 milivolts to hold the magnet. In other words if the pilot was burning and you blew out the flame the gas would continue to come through until the thermocouple cooled off and the voltage began to drop to 500 milivolts. Then the magnet would release and close the saftey valve and stop the gas flow. When looking at the control you will notice that the red button for the pilot is in between the gas inlet and the burner tube that runs down to the burner.

[Deye76]

Some cost more than a NEW heater"

Sucks don't it? Trouble is the new ones are all sealed now and more expensive. Lucky to get 10 years out of heater these days. Used to last 20-30.

[the Grump]

Yes, it does have the two wires on the thermocoupler. I didn't really know what that did. I tried putting them together, figured I would complete the circuit. That is I tried that after everything else. I dont have a clue what to check now. Everything that makes the damn thing work is new. The water heater itself looks brand new. The wife wasn't sure how old it was, but not more than two years I think she said.