Looking for a Shovel Head

[djl]

 I posted in the General section first and it was suggested that I post here for more  input.

I own two TCs, '02 FLHT (107") and '05 FXSTD (95"), built and maintained by yours truly and have not seen the inside of a dealeship since purchased.  For some unexplainable reason, I have been recently attracted to the Shovelhead; can't stop thinking about owning one.  I know nothing about them but have been doing some homework and have identified two bikes that I am interested in both FXRs, '79 and '84.  The 74" vs 80" engine size isn't really an issue although, if buying why not by the larger displacement but the 4 speed vs 5 speed tranny could be an issue.  I would appreciate any thoughts. I am also curious about the availability of parts, OEM and aftermarket.

I have already been warned about the maintenance, etc. but I do my own work and I enjoy working on my bikes, so that is not an issue.   

All other factors being equal, what are the pros/cons of the '79 vs the '84?

[Hillside Motorcycle]

As good as you are with a wrench, a Shovel will be right up your alley.
I'd lean in the direction of the later.
Scott

[motorplex88]

While I really have not had to buy anything for my shovels for a good long while, I don't think you will have any problem getting engine or drivetrain parts. The dealerships have discontinued stuff but there are others out there that can get what you need. If your going the route of super original, depending on the year, that can get a little rough concerning cosmetics. Good luck/have fun.

[76shuvlinoff]

djl
I can't remember if you covered this in the general thread or not but what do you see as the end use? Daily driver? Collector? Hotrod?

Parts can be found in both the aftermarket and oem stuff on ebay etc.

  My shovel has been my pet project for long it's just another custom now ... except my customizing lately has been toward safety and reliability. I have shelves of the parts I took off for the someday restoration but I think I'm kidding myself about that.

[djl]

Motorplex88,
Super original, numbers matching and so on don't mean much to me; not an issue.

76shuvlinoff,
I didn't cover the end use but the bike would be one that I would ride like my TCs.  My work keeps me from riding as much as I would like but a typical ride for me is taking a day off in the middle of the week, or a Saturday/Sunday, leaving in the AM and rolling up 300 to 400 miles that day; at least once a week if I can.  I have a bad case of tinkeritis and am always looking for little things to make the bike a little bit different; side mount license plate, different bars and grips, relocated turn signals, maybe a rear tire that is a wee bit wider, replacing chrome with black or grey, different seat, different pegs, etc.; you get the picture; detail stuff.

The tinkeritis carries over to the engine and drive train. I would want to make some mild performance upgrades, ported heads, mild cams, mild compression bump, upgraded carb and aftermarket exhaust and air cleaner. Nothing radical, just a step up from stock.

In other words, I would not bring the bike home, put it on a tender and ride it to bike night once a month. I don't do bike nights, don't hang out at the dealer for BBQ and beer on Saturdays and don't ride with anyone else but my brother.  I won't be able to leave the bike alone; I want one to ride and to work on but no basket cases. 

The '84 is appealing for the five speed but never having ridden a four speed I have nothing to compare with.  The '79 is talking to me; it's just a really cool original owner bike that has less than 7K miles and has had lots of TLC and some appealing cosmetic change but it's in Kentucky and the '84 is about a two hour ride from my place.

Don't worry about the tinkeritis; it is not terminal but has caused me to miss an ocassional day at the office.

[JamLazyAss]

Only because you asked:

I would avoid the 79 and newer Shovelheads simply because the transmission "sucks".
Harley made the transmission change in mid 1978.
So get yourself an early 78 or older bike.
You'll be glad you did.

[djl]

Only because you asked:

I would avoid the 79 and newer Shovelheads simply because the transmission "sucks". Harley made the transmission change in mid 1978. So get yourself an early 78 or older bike. You'll be glad you did.

Please clarify, was the "transmission change" the change from a four speed to five speed? If not, what was the transmision change you make reference to?

This is the sort of information I am looking for.  I enjoy working on my bikes but transmission nd inner primary work are at the bottom of the list.

[JamLazyAss]

No. Both are four speeds. In mid 78, Harley went to a different box. The main change is in the shifting components and design. This transmission is commonly referrred to as a cow top tranny. It has way too many moving parts and in my opinion, is junk. You will be much better off with the early 78 and older which is typically known as a ratchet top transmission. Do a google search on these and you will see the physical difference.

[96flhpi]

When I saw the header on the main page thought WTF, why is everybody looking for a shovel all of a sudden - but you're the same guy I was thinking about from general.

Jam - '84 FXR would have the same 5 speed more or less that became standard on the evos (can't speak for the '79) - no turret top.  BTW, although the linkage is a bit much on the turrets I would't quite call them junk.

djl - if it was me, I'd go by best condition regardless of year.

[Old Crow]

Tinkeritis, huh?   You'll fit right in with most of us here on the shovel board.  We just can't leave well enough alone.
FXR's are a great bike.  Sort of a quicker little brother to my Shovel FLT. 
Personally I'd go for the 5 speed, although I don't think the 4 speed cowpie is as bad as Jam says it is.
Oh, and if you did happen to drop in at a bike night or other function, a nice shovel usually draws quite a few comments, at least in my neck of the woods.

[76shuvlinoff]

Since you're going to tinker and upgrade it probably doesn't matter a whole lot what you start out with as long as you don't get screwed on the price. "No basket cases"  still means a little work or worse rework. Even though shovels can be found relatively cheap a pristine, or at least unmolested, daily driver is rare.

Tinkeritis to ride like a TC, There are lots of ways to skin that cat.

I feel the 5 speed gives you wider gearing options while playing with sprockets. If you get a bike with a 4 speed there are lots of aftermarket 5 speed in 4 speed case trannys. A  bump in the compression and dual plugs are a plus for efficiency and power. A CV carb is a proven upgrade for reliability and manners but there are a bazillion S&S E carbs out there doing the job for a touch more peformance. For me, I love electronic ignition and isolated primary lubrication.

Ok now the bike is getting a little more pop to the drop and we are going to talk about that damn clutch 

 

[Hillside Motorcycle]

No. Both are four speeds. In mid 78, Harley went to a different box. The main change is in the shifting components and design. This transmission is commonly referrred to as a cow top tranny. It has way too many moving parts and in my opinion, is junk. You will be much better off with the early 78 and older which is typically known as a ratchet top transmission. Do a google search on these and you will see the physical difference.

Nothing really wrong with those rotary lid 4 spds, as long as all is right.
We pushed one(not stock) into the 8 sec bracket on our 108" Shovelution-headed AHDRA bike.
Scott

[79FLH]

  Tinkeritis...  A nice Shovel project is perfect therapy for the tinkeritis..  Plenty to do as far as upgrades, swappin parts for better dependability...  The never ending elusive search for the cause of those spots on the garage floor..  But, when somebody hears you hammerin 93" of power through that 4 speed, it will turn some heads !!  Can not advise on the 5 speed as I've never had one on a Shovel, but parts are available, & There are some 5 speed kits out there that will drop into the 4 speed case..  Go out & take 'em both for a ride, Let the bike make up your mind !!

[greenshovel0014]

I took my brothers 83 fxr for a test ride before he looked at it and it is just my opinion but compared to my 83 fxsb It felt kind of lame. I say lame as it wasn't rigid mounted and the 5 speed vs my 4 speed always seemed between gears and the motor was stock and or tired. To me the 4 speed pulled so long in second and third it was more fun. I say ride a few before purchase.

[billbuilds]

     The five speeds basically give you a gear that's between the ratios of the four speeds 3rd and 4th. Got a Sputhe 5 in 4 speed in an 83 FLHS and I find that to be a more appealing setup than the 4 speed FX or 4 speed FLH. Bill

     edit: that said, I'd lean toward the 79 solid mount 4 speed. You can always upgrade the tranny later if you feel the need. Will need a proprietary case to make 5 speed setup work though. Hey, if it's calling to you...

[gary11623]

As far as I know the fxr shovelhead was made in 81 and 82 only. All 5 speeds all 80 inch. Rubber mounted heavy frame,rides and handles much different than fx 4 speeds

[fxrrider]

82-83 were the years of shovelhead FXR's, Parts are difficult to find for them such as exhausts, starter housing,inner primary. It and the FLT being the only rubber mounted 5 speed shovels made some parts are rare,for the engine, shovel parts are not difficult to find.I find the ride and handling of a FXR much better then solid mounted shovels and quit a few newer bikes, I kept my 82 FXR and got rid of a 96 Heritage, the FXR beat it in all catogories in my book,sound,performance,looks, comfort, handling. the heritage was a little more reliable and leaked less, but heck it was 14 years younger

[djl]

OK, then this guy doesn't know what he is selling; what is it? Help me out, I was planning to go take a look at this bike next week.

[fxrrider]

That is a FXR, and a very clean original one

[djl]

That is a FXR

I thought '82-'83 were the FXR years?? Not arguing, I am a neophyte when it comes to Shovelheads but do want to know what I am looking at.

[96flhpi]

What part of the ad are you questioning?  Don't see a year mentioned, AMF left by '82, maybe that's what's throwing you?

[fxrrider]

FXR's were 82-83 then in 84 most had evo motors some had shovel, the Fxr's made for the police kept thier shovel motors till 85

[fxrrider]

The 79 maybe a FX or FXE, the R in FXR designates it as a rubber mount. The pic you posted is an FXR. The battery is under the seat, the side panels under the seat is an easy way to tell an FXR. There is no tube directly running from under the seat to the bottom of the frame, the FXR has a frame like no other Harley,it is stronger and more rigid. Looking at the pic you posted you can see the (upside down triangle) frame just under the seat. the engine, trans and swingarm are all connected and are isolated from the frame by rubber,where other shovels are bolted directly to the frame

[shovelbill]

No. Both are four speeds. In mid 78, Harley went to a different box. The main change is in the shifting components and design. This transmission is commonly referrred to as a cow top tranny. It has way too many moving parts and in my opinion, is junk. You will be much better off with the early 78 and older which is typically known as a ratchet top transmission. Do a google search on these and you will see the physical difference.

interesting.......i've owned 3 rotory tops.....cowpies.......both stock and Andrews combos and had no particular issuse except the bushing deal in the Wide glid and softail shift lever......street raced and beat on...they ain't pretty, but when maintained there's nothing wrong with them imo. how many have you owned? i prefer the FX ratchet top though.

[76shuvlinoff]

I would love to have that FXR, you are gong to have to weigh the pros and cons.

It is the one of the best frames ever built, handling is right up there, and you will be the envy of guys in the know.

Maybe some difficulty getting SOME parts if you are going to ride it often.  I think motorcycles are meant to be ridden just like there are no safe queens in my gun locker.

I think the price is a little high but you will not see another one every day. If I had the money I'd be shaking cash around where the owner could see it trying to find out what his bottom number is.

If you get it, I hate you.