614 to 617

[joe_lyons]

I did an update to super tuner before I tuned a 14 Street Glide and seen that now all of the 614 cals now are gone and replaced with 617 cals now.  I encountered some difference from copying and pasting from my personal canned map selection possibly showing some internal calibration math differences. 

[FSG]

Still a 73MB Update and you can bet for a new user downloading from scratch off the HD Site they will be forced to start at Ver 7.0   

[hrdtail78]

That is tip of the spear stuff, Joe.  I have done one 500 mile service on a 14.

[Bike31]

Question please. I have a 2014 CVO Softail. The bike has Stage I intake. My mech said I could install slip-ons w/o a recal as it already had the required flash from the factory. I did (HD SE-80495-07). Fit and sound good (no CAT), but still winter so can't test.

I see a Super Tuner cal above (617SFK002). What would that buy me if it were installed? One mech I asked said that's what I had already from the factory (actually the superseded 614SFK001). Another dealer said that cal was for the race tuner only, and would take the bike out of street legal for warranty.

Any idea who's got it right?

[joe_lyons]

Your bike will have a 614 cal from the factory but it will not be any of the same maps exactly as what comes from supertuner.  Supertuner does set off a flag in the ecm that the bike was tuned but I have not had any issues with warranty because of it.  If you were to go in with your supertuner and do some stuff to damage the engine that is way out of wack then it would not be under warranty.

[Bike31]

Your bike will have a 614 cal from the factory but it will not be any of the same maps exactly as what comes from supertuner.  Supertuner does set off a flag in the ecm that the bike was tuned but I have not had any issues with warranty because of it.  If you were to go in with your supertuner and do some stuff to damage the engine that is way out of wack then it would not be under warranty.

Thanks Joe for the reply. My last HD had a SESPT installed...just a cal download for the street version...and it was ok for warranty.

The other question is why HD would offer a 617 Stage I (their words in the above cal sheet) for a CVO Softail? They don't offer much more than the Stage I intake it already comes with for SE performance. It has the SE-255 cams, which would be a Stage II on the standard FLSTN, but no other optional slip-ons. I installed the HD SE-80495-07 cans on the factory headers from the 2007-10 Softails with staggered exhaust. No CAT but stamped 80 db for the 96 CI mill.

Would you suggest I bother to install the Street Tuner (SESPT) and the 617SFK002 cal? There's no dyno available locally for fine tuning anything else made by HD, only TTS or PC-V from another vendor, which would surely beg the warranty and PO the dealer.

[pappy]

That is tip of the spear stuff, Joe.  I have done one 500 mile service on a 14.

What do you mean hrdtail78 ?

Pappy

[hrdtail78]

Just that a guy working in a dealership will probably see and learn more things about HD's new products over a small indy shop.

[HV]

I would not use the Street Tuner ... go with the Super Tuner Pro

[Bike31]

I would not use the Street Tuner ... go with the Super Tuner Pro

\

Thanks for the advice. SESPT (street) vs SEPST (pro). The first one will do an EPA cal (still not sure why I'd need one for my /14 FLSTNSE as is, but that's why I asked for experienced advice), and offer "some" fuel monitoring and potential correction. The second involves a 750 mile round trip, two to three nights min in a hotel plus meals and fuel ($300-400), plus quoted (via dealer in Anchorage, Ak.) $1000-1200 for the unit and about 5 hrs setup and dyno time. I'll have to consider my options come summer.

I'm still wondering what the cal above (617SFK002) is for, and for what unit?

[joe_lyons]

The cal that you listed is for super tuner I believe but they may have the same ve tables from the pro tuner to the street tuner.  The differences are that you do not get to alter hardly anything with the street tuner.  If you are wanting ease of use and getting a decent running bike there are other options out there for self tunning that should be considered.  Like I said I have not encountered an issue with warranty and tuning devices.

[Bike31]

The cal that you listed is for super tuner I believe but they may have the same ve tables from the pro tuner to the street tuner.  The differences are that you do not get to alter hardly anything with the street tuner.  If you are wanting ease of use and getting a decent running bike there are other options out there for self tunning that should be considered.  Like I said I have not encountered an issue with warranty and tuning devices.

Thank you Joe, I appreciate your time but I'll let it go for now with a couple of hopefully helpful comments of my perspective.

Me to selling dealer's tech and service manager: What's the Stage I cal for? (cal was then 614SFK001). What would I install that requires the Stage I cal?

Both men answer: Takes it out of street legal and warranty. Race tuner stuff. But, you can install SE slip-ons because you already have the Stage I cal in your '14 FLSTNSE. Ok, I'm off the hook for installing the slip-ons? Yes, they answer.

Me to a second dealer's service manager: What's the Stage I cal for? (cal was then 614SFK001). What would I install that requires the Stage I cal?

His reply: You already have that cal in your bike. But, if you want to improve the cal we can install the Race Tuner and do a dyno setup to fine tune. No mention of an additional cal to be downloaded at that time.

My suspicion is that somebody would have to contact HD Tech Support and find out what's really where, what does what, and why the Stage I cal listed above is available for the tuner(s).

I can't do that (contact HD directly), and I can't ask others forever for free advice. So screw it, let's ride.

[joe_lyons]

The difference between your stock cal and the stg 1 cal are going to be for the differences in exhaust and probably a couple other things.

On another note I started tuning a 13 cvo roadking with sepst and had to choose an 044 cal and I noticed that it seemed like the adaptive was shut off and or the live data just did not acknowledge adaptive.?  Some weird changes with this update for sure.