thinking...square

[No Cents]

  There is no other head option currently that I know of for the S&S T2 4 3/8" bore cases.
If I want the extra displacement...I'm limited on options.

Ray

[1FSTRK]

  There is no other head option currently that I know of for the S&S T2 4 3/8" bore cases.
If I want the extra displacement...I'm limited on options.

Ray

Ray the B-2 style head is a great choice and considering the flow charts on the cnc version have it reaching 98.6% of its peak flow by .600 lift you will be right on the money with touring cams from .575-.615 lift.

[No Cents]

   
thanks Eric.
I was looking at some old B2 head flow charts the other day and that's why I figured a .625" lift cam would be plenty for me for an engine that might see 5800 rpm's at tops just a few times.
I'm so far thinking an intake closing of 50 or less...might be a good target.
A lower lift cam should also make for a nice quiet valve train too.
I'm still spinning my wheels for finding cylinders. I called R&R Cycle today and talked to Reggie Jr. Their 131 has a 4 3/8" bore using a 4 3/8" flywheel...but theirs has a different cylinder stud pattern from the S&S T2 cases he said. He did say he would make me a great deal on one of their 131's...but I told him it would take all my enjoyment out of me building my own engine by buying a crate motor. He said he fully understood...and then said he would sell me one of his 131's...unassembled.

Ray

[06roadglide]

I remember someone having a R&R 131 tuned on 87 octane and it was impressive to say the least.  That was several years ago, now with their HP stage V heads could be even better.

[1FSTRK]

Ray, why not use S&S cylinders?

[build it]

Perfect huh? Without having had them on a flow bench you conclude "perfect", 1fst?

They flow noisey off the shell, so, not perfect whatsoever. Torqueinc flowed them, as did 4 other shops, same "conclusion" across th board, although, they did have hands on experience. 

[1FSTRK]

Perfect huh? Without having had them on a flow bench you conclude "perfect", 1fst?

They flow noisey off the shell, so, not perfect whatsoever. Torqueinc flowed them, as did 4 other shops, same "conclusion" across th board, although, they did have hands on experience. 

Is it that you can't figure out how to use the quote button or do you just avoid it so that you can misquote people by inserting your own words.
Nobody said anything about perfect except you.

B2 heads with < .625 lift? What's the point?

So should we assume from this quote that you are implying they will flow better and get quieter with a higher lift cam?

How does knit picking me help with Ray's build anyway?

[No Cents]

Ray, why not use S&S cylinders?

Eric...they don't have a cylinder/piston kit released for the 4 3/8" flywheels in the 4 3/8" T2 cases...yet to my knowledge. They do as you know, made cylinders for the 4 5/8" flywheels for their 143/144 crate motor...so I'm hoping they will have more cylinder options for their other flywheel sizes they have very soon.
  I did put a call in to S&S's racing development department today to talk to the guy that runs it. It went straight to his voice mail...so I guess I'll try again tomorrow and see if I have better luck. Maybe he will have some good news for me.
I would use S&S's aluminum finned iron lined cylinders again in a heart beat...but I don't think they have anything on the shelf at this time for the combo I'm after.
I'll just have to be patient and find something else this winter it looks like...to keep me busy.

Ray

[build it]

I'm not nit picking, right on the money implies just right or perfect, not close.  If you had said they are close, I might not have said anything. FWIW, I like you, you sound like a cantankerous  old man, what's not to like? I don't however, appreciate your incessant personal attacks when you don't know jack about me.

The noise didn't decrease much with higher lift, although I suspect it's possible with a different head, they will still need work out of the box. For ease of process, Ray should get a cnc b2 and have them touched; at least based on his cylinder choice.

All that said, the b2 doesnt flow anywhere near a worked over 103 or 110 at low lift. This is a touring build right? Maybe the "swingers" we're onto something when they suggested those worthless ductile cylinders with the fancy fasteners.

[clawdog60]

Ray, why not use S&S cylinders?

Eric...they don't have a cylinder/piston kit released for the 4 3/8" flywheels in the 4 3/8" T2 cases...yet to my knowledge. They do as you know, made cylinders for the 4 5/8" flywheels for their 143/144 crate motor...so I'm hoping they will have more cylinder options for their other flywheel sizes they have very soon.
  I did put a call in to S&S's racing development department today to talk to the guy that runs it. It went straight to his voice mail...so I guess I'll try again tomorrow and see if I have better luck. Maybe he will have some good news for me.
I would use S&S's aluminum finned iron lined cylinders again in a heart beat...but I don't think they have anything on the shelf at this time for the combo I'm after.
I'll just have to be patient and find something else this winter it looks like...to keep me busy.

Ray

Sns doesnt think square?

[No Cents]

 I'm waiting to see flow charts on this new B3 head to see what changes S&S made. Apparently they must have done something different with these heads for them to choose to run them with the unorthodox lower lift 635HO cam's that nobody on the forum here liked. Maybe S&S had a master plan all along and just kept us all in the dark...until just recently. It just seemed awfully funny to me that they released the 4 3/8" bore T2 cases almost two years ago...and they never offered up a cylinder/piston kit for them. Then all the sudden...here is the release of a new B3 head on top of a 143/144" crate motor.
There should be a dyno sheet released here sometime in the next week or so to put this new B3 head with the lower lift 635HO cams to rest.
I do plan on sending the B3 heads I will buy out (which is the only option for a head so far with this newer 4 3/8" bore T2 cases) to have them looked at and see if they can be improved upon if need be. I think the B3's will flow plenty on the lower lift side with a cam that makes good early torque...and we all know traditionally how they do on the top end.
Remember...this is an engine that I will be building that is designed for smooth dependable touring in mind...not a drag race motor by any means of the stretch. Right now it is all planning and guess work on my end...but I was told the B3 heads will work excellent straight out of the box for what I'm after.

Ray

[clawdog60]

Interesting.

[No Cents]

 here is an old flow chart on the older style B2 heads vs the CNC B2 heads for comparison of them two.

[attach=0]

Ray

[Burch753]

Not to throw too much hate twards the B2 heads but...

I have the CNC version and they did not flow what is posted. I had Torquince put some light loving into them and they drastically improved, but still not a WHOLY COW flow chart...like above.

I prefere the B3's hand over fist due to the combustion chamber. It comes in a user friendly, un shrouded form. It has a nice shape and the intake valve isn't covered up by the Rockie Mountains like the B2's

[build it]

Not to throw too much hate twards the B2 heads but...

I have the CNC version and they did not flow what is posted. I had Torquince put some light loving into them and they drastically improved, but still not a WHOLY COW flow chart...like above.

I prefere the B3's hand over fist due to the combustion chamber. It comes in a user friendly, un shrouded form. It has a nice shape and the intake valve isn't covered up by the Rockie Mountains like the B2's

Weird. My heads flowed very very close to as advertised (4.375" bore tbough)

[clawdog60]

Is the combustion chamber face opening 4-3/8" in diameter on the 2 and 3 heads?

[1FSTRK]

I'm not nit picking, right on the money implies just right or perfect, not close.  If you had said they are close, I might not have said anything. FWIW, I like you, you sound like a cantankerous  old man, what's not to like? I don't however, appreciate your incessant personal attacks when you don't know jack about me.

The noise didn't decrease much with higher lift, although I suspect it's possible with a different head, they will still need work out of the box. For ease of process, Ray should get a cnc b2 and have them touched; at least based on his cylinder choice.

All that said, the b2 doesnt flow anywhere near a worked over 103 or 110 at low lift. This is a touring build right? Maybe the "swingers" we're onto something when they suggested those worthless ductile cylinders with the fancy fasteners.

I am always willing to listen. Please post the flow numbers and head specs for the 103 and 110 heads you are comparing too above so that we may all see and learn.

[clawdog60]

 

[Matt C]

here is an old flow chart on the older style B2 heads vs the CNC B2 heads for comparison of them two.

[attach=0]

Ray

I got 335 out of a set of those this summer.

[No Cents]

 I believe they actually offer the B2 head in a couple of configurations.
One for the older S&S cases bolt pattern and a set for the stock HD bolt pattern. I don't know if the chamber size was the same for both.

built it...what size and brand of engine do you have with the 4.375" bore?

Ray

[No Cents]

here is an old flow chart on the older style B2 heads vs the CNC B2 heads for comparison of them two.

[attach=0]

Ray

I got 335 out of a set of those this summer.

which set...the older style B2 or the newer CNC version?

Ray

[CowboyTutt]

Ditto Ray.  Lets just stick to the facts and let the data speak for itself.  Trying to be a good forumite here.  My track record not so great but trying.  Regards   -Tutt 

[build it]

I believe they actually offer the B2 head in a couple of configurations.
One for the older S&S cases bolt pattern and a set for the stock HD bolt pattern. I don't know if the chamber size was the same for both.

built it...what size and brand of engine do you have with the 4.375" bore?

Ray

Hi Ray, burch had a completely different chamber than what I have. Mine cced at 93.8, but I don't know what Burch 124 CNCed b2s cced out to. Btw, i have the SA exhaust bolt pattern. The heads go on a 126" S&S engine, that's been waiting longer than it should have as I had other stuff done.

[No Cents]

 wow...93.8cc chambers on B2 heads.
Did you have a bunch milled off them or the chambers welded up some?
I was under the impression the B2 heads were well north of 100cc's.

Ray

[CowboyTutt]

Here are the flow rates of my stock 96 heads used in my 103-107 builds cut by hand by my head porter.  I once promised him I would never post his information that he sends out with EVERY set of heads he cuts.  Few people do that in the industry.  Because of my promise, I therefore covered up his information although there is nothing wrong with how his heads flow for the valve and port size at all.  Good man, no BS. 1.9 intake, 1.625 exhaust, 1.75 intake port. 



If those CNC B2 heads flow close to what S&S sent, they are good to go when compared to a stock modified 96 head.  I don't know about the 103 or 110 head at low lift.  I am not sure the 103 head is any different from the 96 head.  Please advise.  A 110 head with bigger valves would certainly do A LOT better then what I have posted here, but this was for a smaller engine.  Regards  -Tutt