thinking...square

[build it]

wow...93.8cc chambers on B2 heads.
Did you have a bunch milled off them or the chambers welded up some?
I was under the impression the B2 heads were well north of 100cc's.

Ray

No Sir, CC as they came out of the box

[CowboyTutt]

What is the S&S SA exhaust bolt pattern?  2 or 4 bolt flanges?  I'm guessing 4 bolt?  All the information I have directly from S&S is that the B2 chambers are 106 cc's as cast and the intake is .42 or .45 taller than stock heads.  Our information is not adding up at all.  This is not good.   -Tutt   

[build it]

What is the S&S SA exhaust bolt pattern?  2 or 4 bolt flanges?  I'm guessing 4 bolt?  All the information I have directly from S&S is that the B2 chambers are 106 cc's as cast and the intake is .42 or .45 taller than stock heads.  Our information is not adding up at all.  This is not good.   -Tutt

4 bolt.

different chambers for 4.125" bore.

[CowboyTutt]

OK, human error.  On post 114 you said it was with a 4.375 bore.  That is not 4 and 1/8th bore.  Regards  -Tutt 

[No Cents]

What is the S&S SA exhaust bolt pattern?  2 or 4 bolt flanges?  I'm guessing 4 bolt?  All the information I have directly from S&S is that the B2 chambers are 106 cc's as cast and the intake is .42 or .45 taller than stock heads.  Our information is not adding up at all.  This is not good.   -Tutt

4 bolt.

different chambers for 4.125" bore.

so you are saying your older style B2 heads with the 4 bolt exhaust port for the 4.375" bore...was cc'd @ 93.8cc's?
I'm being told something totally different from my guy @ S&S about the size chambers on the newer style 2 bolt exhaust port B2 heads they have. I haven't been able to get any technical info on the latest release of the B3 heads yet.
I'll call him tomorrow and see if he will give me the cc's and flow chart numbers of the B3's. This is very interesting with what your B2 heads cc'd out to be. I've never heard of the B2's in stock casting forum cc that low.
I have been running numbers on the compression calculators trying to find a good cam option to use with the figures I've entered with a lot more head chamber cc's than you have. If the heads are as what you say...I'll have to totally re-think the cam options I've been looking at.

Ray

[turboprop]

Ray, the kid doesnt know what he doesnt know. Reads allot, but not allot of depth. He claims to have a G2 126, whatever. G2 mills their B2 heads down a considerable amount. Call G2 if you want facts. Nobody on this forum has them.

[CowboyTutt]

That would explain the difference in chamber design.  I have heard it said that S&S deliberately made the chamber size very generous so they could be milled down to fit.  This is not so surprising I think.  Regards  -Tutt 

[Burch753]

Mine were 105cc ish. They have been milled to less than that. I also have SA exhaust port with four bolt exhaust.

I can also provide before and after flow numbers. I don't care too much about what the head in itself does it's more about it's flow through the tb and ac.

[build it]

Ray, the kid doesnt know what he doesnt know. Reads allot, but not allot of depth. He claims to have a G2 126, whatever. G2 mills their B2 heads down a considerable amount. Call G2 if you want facts. Nobody on this forum has them.

Or it could be you are wrong (I take no pleasure in the fact).. S&S advertises the smaller chamber for the 4.375" bore, and  the 106cc chamber for the stock bolt pattern, and now the 4.375" bore as well, the earlier catalogue showed the 93cc chamber (at the time I ordered). Here is a link:

http://www.sscycle.com/product/Products-20-3E-20Race-20Components-20-3E-20Top-20End-20/Special-Order-Cylinder-Heads-For-4-3-8-Bore-Engines-p24937.html

My kit came direct from S&S, g2 wasn't part of the equation.

I've posted s link to a public photobucket for your viewing pleasure.

[CowboyTutt]

S&S advertises the smaller chamber for the 4.375" bore (that's 4 38ths folks), and  the 106cc chamber for the stock bolt pattern (what bore?), and now the 4.375" bore as well (what?), the earlier catalogue showed the 93cc chamber (at the time I ordered). Here is a link:

Please clarify, this makes no sense to me at all.  -Tutt   

[build it]

S&S advertises the smaller chamber for the 4.375" bore (that's 4 38ths folks), and  the 106cc chamber for the stock bolt pattern (what bore?), and now the 4.375" bore as well (what?), the earlier catalogue showed the 93cc chamber (at the time I ordered). Here is a link:

Please clarify, this makes no sense to me at all.  -Tutt   

http://www.sscycle.com/product/Race-Components/Top-End-c684/

Now go to the current catalogue, the stock bolt pattern and my 4.375" bore are advertised as 105cc.

The old catalogue advertised 93cc for the 4.375" bore.

[1FSTRK]

Ray, why not use S&S cylinders?

Eric...they don't have a cylinder/piston kit released for the 4 3/8" flywheels in the 4 3/8" T2 cases...yet to my knowledge. They do as you know, made cylinders for the 4 5/8" flywheels for their 143/144 crate motor...so I'm hoping they will have more cylinder options for their other flywheel sizes they have very soon.
  I did put a call in to S&S's racing development department today to talk to the guy that runs it. It went straight to his voice mail...so I guess I'll try again tomorrow and see if I have better luck. Maybe he will have some good news for me.
I would use S&S's aluminum finned iron lined cylinders again in a heart beat...but I don't think they have anything on the shelf at this time for the combo I'm after.
I'll just have to be patient and find something else this winter it looks like...to keep me busy.

Ray

You could use the 143 cylinder length and a longer rod (even better rod to stroke ratio) or have the pistons made with  the proper pin height. The question is could you get them with a 4.375 bore?

[TorQuePimp]

Ray, why not use S&S cylinders?

Eric...they don't have a cylinder/piston kit released for the 4 3/8" flywheels in the 4 3/8" T2 cases...yet to my knowledge. They do as you know, made cylinders for the 4 5/8" flywheels for their 143/144 crate motor...so I'm hoping they will have more cylinder options for their other flywheel sizes they have very soon.
  I did put a call in to S&S's racing development department today to talk to the guy that runs it. It went straight to his voice mail...so I guess I'll try again tomorrow and see if I have better luck. Maybe he will have some good news for me.
I would use S&S's aluminum finned iron lined cylinders again in a heart beat...but I don't think they have anything on the shelf at this time for the combo I'm after.
I'll just have to be patient and find something else this winter it looks like...to keep me busy.

Ray

You could use the 143 cylinder length and a longer rod (even better rod to stroke ratio) or have the pistons made with  the proper pin height. The question is could you get them with a 4.375 bore?

  Ray if you are going to actually do a build....built for long distance warp speed cruising with Mrs Ray in tow

  What has been mentioned is probably a good idea

  They have the 144/142 ? WTF ever size the thing is done....have made cylinder length changes and changed something to make it fit into a stock chassis...instead of getting in a hurry why don't you find out if you can get a 144 with a smaller bore....I am certain they don't cast them at the finished length nor the finished bore size.

  Making the whole process simple   

[1FSTRK]

Why not "Think over square" Take the 4.425 bore cylinders and put them on the 4.375  stroke long rod crank, T2 cases, B2 or B3 heads, lots of room for big valves with no shrouding, 134.56CI of mild compression touring monster.

Wow I have talked myself into it now all I need to do is rob a bank to pay for it.

Honestly Ray this maybe a good combination.

[No Cents]

you may be on to something there Eric 
At this point I'm not ruling out anything. That could be an option beings we know those cylinders and pistons should be available.

Ray

[HD/Wrench]

I am still in awe about the touring motor and B2 or B3 heads and a 70 mm..     .. none of it adds up for touring Ray.. But good luck nothing wrong with going your own direction. ,... I would suggest you Pick the phone up and talk to Randy about the 131 that we did and now his buddy has. It will be a much better build  VS the big head massive t/b when it comes to touring. right at 150/150( BVBOBS drum we where high 140 with a 2-1 pipe) with only 175 CCP runs on 89 octane fuel.. Now that is a touring engine   I would take that little R&R 131 in a heart beat.  Smooth does not even cover how well it runs.




Why not "Think over square" Take the 4.425 bore cylinders and put them on the 4.375  stroke long rod crank, T2 cases, B2 or B3 heads, lots of room for big valves with no shrouding, 134.56CI of mild compression touring monster.


That sounds good but but it would have to be measured up and I think the piston will be somewhat of an issue for touring. The piston stability may be an issue with that large of a bore short stroke. 

[Don D]

Buzz killer Steve.
Got to decide the bore, stroke, rod length first not what cam then backward design from there. There is likely no "kit".  Custom pistons become appropriate.

[HD/Wrench]

Buzz killer Steve.
Got to decide the bore, stroke, rod length first not what cam then backward design from there. There is likely no "kit".  Custom pistons become appropriate.

  I know some times it too simple.. But having built a 131 with ductile. and having used the b2 heads as well R&R billet oval port heads I have a very good idea on how they run and what the pros and cons are.

The R&R 131 crate engine is a simple set up with warranty cases that at 131 is just a starting point, aluminum cylinders on and on.  Not trying to kill the buzz,, just stating what I know works and it fits the bill for a killer touring engine that really is no slouch when it comes to power either.

But its winter  so  it will be what it will be.. 

BTW Don  The 117 is tuning great.. ANGRY .. HAH its pissed off  if an engine has feelings..  .. I do think that 140 Tq is within reach 135/138 thus far. and I am not done..

[No Cents]

Steve...I talked to Reggie Jr. yesterday on the phone for an hour.
He told me he would sell me one of his 131's at a discounted price.

Ray

[HD/Wrench]

Ray

I can tell you that the engine is a outstanding item. I feel that its not being built to run at 100% what so ever. With that being said it makes a killer bagger engine that bolts in. Nothing wrong with a detuned engine in that size. Super cool running and power that starts at what seems to be idle.

[2006FXDCI]

Steve , do you know if the R&R 131" will fit in a 2006 and up dyna frame ?

[HD/Wrench]

I do not see why not. R&R does have a oiling line system that you must use , like the S&S but different. Other than that I cannot see why it would not. I have not done them in anything but a bagger. though

[rob71458]

I wish I had gone the R&R 131 route from day one! They are only twenty five miles north of me.

[HD/Wrench]

Rob Did you finally get the 124 deal sorted out?

[rob71458]

Which deal? There have been a few.   Been running good for a couple years now though.