Wake up them AGMs

[clawdog60]

I'm going to start hitting my batteries with 10~20 amps for 15~30 minutes twice a month to see if I can get more life out of them. Tenders help but the batteries are of poor quality to start with and getting worse about little indication they're failing.

careful about drying them out on overcharge...

Speaking of that, if you don't have a hygrometer to check fluid should you add acid or distilled water? What would de-ionized water do?

[Admiral Akbar]

I'm going to start hitting my batteries with 10~20 amps for 15~30 minutes twice a month to see if I can get more life out of them. Tenders help but the batteries are of poor quality to start with and getting worse about little indication they're failing.

careful about drying them out on overcharge...

Speaking of that, if you don't have a hygrometer to check fluid should you add acid or distilled water? What would de-ionized water do?

Why would you use a hygrometer?   

Max

[wholehog]

A hygrometer cannot be used on a sealed battery....you can only use it for a flooded cell and then only to estimate the state of charge based on the specific gravity of the acid......

if you are frequently adding water to the cell, then likely the cell is overcharging by too high of a regulator setting....

do not add acid to top it up....only water....I'd used distilled water but back in the days we just added tap water with no real adverse effects...but the water didn't have a high mineral content

in your top post you mention an equalizing charge....if it's for flooded lead acid cells in standby service then it's OK....I would not do it for a sealed cell like AGM

[wholehog]

max....you had a day to revive it....is it alive?

[Admiral Akbar]

A hygrometer cannot be used on a sealed battery....you can only use it for a flooded cell and then only to estimate the state of charge based on the specific gravity of the acid......

if you are frequently adding water to the cell, then likely the cell is overcharging by too high of a regulator setting....

do not add acid to top it up....only water....I'd used distilled water but back in the days we just added tap water with no real adverse effects...but the water didn't have a high mineral content

in your top post you mention an equalizing charge....if it's for flooded lead acid cells in standby service then it's OK....I would not do it for a sealed cell like AGM

So I still don't understand how you use a hygrometer on a flooded battery.. I used hydrometers on flooded cells but not a hygrometer.. Do you use them to set charging on fancier chargers?

Max

Add

Not sure where I mentioned equalizing charge. That is primarily for a flooded cell and would probably dry out an AGM.. Loading the battery is different.

Max

[Admiral Akbar]

max....you had a day to revive it....is it alive?

Well it starts the bike.. It's good enough for a couple rides.  I'll probably order a new Braile for it..

Max

[splitting_lanes]

max....you had a day to revive it....is it alive?

Well it starts the bike.. It's good enough for a couple rides.  I'll probably order a new Braile for it..

Max

if you can swing it, get an Anti-gravity battery for it.  Smallest, lightest, highest current Dyna sized battery.  Don't need a trickle charger on it, because it doesn't drain like a lead acid or AGM.

[wholehog]

A hygrometer cannot be used on a sealed battery....you can only use it for a flooded cell and then only to estimate the state of charge based on the specific gravity of the acid......

if you are frequently adding water to the cell, then likely the cell is overcharging by too high of a regulator setting....

do not add acid to top it up....only water....I'd used distilled water but back in the days we just added tap water with no real adverse effects...but the water didn't have a high mineral content

in your top post you mention an equalizing charge....if it's for flooded lead acid cells in standby service then it's OK....I would not do it for a sealed cell like AGM

So I still don't understand how you use a hygrometer on a flooded battery.. I used hydrometers on flooded cells but not a hygrometer.. Do you use them to set charging on fancier chargers?

Max

Add

Not sure where I mentioned equalizing charge. That is primarily for a flooded cell and would probably dry out an AGM.. Loading the battery is different.

Max

max, I didn't mean you about the equalizing charge......that was clawdog that mentioned it in his post......

yeah I know hydrometer vice hygrometer, but we know what he means....he aint measuring humidity   

[mrmike]

I've been thinking about the Anti-gravity as a replacement if this one "Potty mouth"s the bed which I think it will as it's certainly not going to fix itself but the issue I have with the Anti-Gravity as I've read here is that they don't like cold weather and this is New Jersey.

Years ago the old Fire Engines had wet cell batteries and every day as driver you took a hydrometer and checked every cell on both batteries, I think it did more harm than good the batteries never lasted very long,lol.

New rigs have sealed batteries that are inaccessible unless we raise the cab so we don't do that anymore but we still check the lugnuts for tightness,LOL!




Mike

[Admiral Akbar]

max, I didn't mean you about the equalizing charge......that was clawdog that mentioned it in his post......

Please show where...  I missed it.

yeah I know hydrometer vice hygrometer, but we know what he means....he aint measuring humidity   

Why didn't you correct him when you had the chance?? 

Max

[Bike31]

Buy and use a modern smart charger like a CTEK and these threads would stop. There's only so many low voltage start cycles available via AGM batteries until they take a poop.

[mrmike]

I disagree that it's non use of battery tenders, as I originally posted my first AGM HD stock battery lasted 9+ years in the exact same conditions that this new one is being kept and used under. Somethings changed with the batteries Truck says it's the plate formation process, Bruce has had similar results and others have noticed a battery life decrease.

For what it's worth I have always kept the security function turned off so that's not the issue.

I'm not anti-tender but I also don't think a battery should crap out after 2 weeks sitting either if I was putting my bike up for the season sure a tender would be the way to go but I usually find a way to sneak out and get on the road, and years ago when we did get snowed in even after over a month of sitting she fired right up.

Keep in mind that a batteries job is power storage and a battery the craps out quickly is in my mind the same as a leaking fuel tank, neither one is doing it's job of storing energy.

Mike

[wholehog]

max, I didn't mean you about the equalizing charge......that was clawdog that mentioned it in his post......

Please show where...  I missed it.

I'm going to start hitting my batteries with 10~20 amps for 15~30 minutes twice a month to see if I can get more life out of them.

yeah I know hydrometer vice hygrometer, but we know what he means....he aint measuring humidity   

Why didn't you correct him when you had the chance??  cause I aint no english teacher and I new what he ment 

Max

[Bigbluff]

"cause I aint no english teacher and I new what he ment"

LOL...excellent! You talk real good!

[Admiral Akbar]

max, I didn't mean you about the equalizing charge......that was clawdog that mentioned it in his post......

Please show where...  I missed it.

I'm going to start hitting my batteries with 10~20 amps for 15~30 minutes twice a month to see if I can get more life out of them.

yeah I know hydrometer vice hygrometer, but we know what he means....he aint measuring humidity   

Why didn't you correct him when you had the chance??  cause I aint no english teacher and I new what he ment 

Max

Well for 1.. That is not how you equalize a battery.. You don't use excessive current.. The process to equalize involves moving the absorb voltage is up to bubble the battery electrolyte. You don't over current the battery and typically keep an eye on the battery temp..

Second point.. Might as well call this place HBT (Harley Babble Talk) or HDF or even CVO Forum then?  All you had to do was spell it correct when you answered him?

Max

[Admiral Akbar]

I disagree that it's non use of battery tenders, as I originally posted my first AGM HD stock battery lasted 9+ years in the exact same conditions that this new one is being kept and used under. Somethings changed with the batteries Truck says it's the plate formation process, Bruce has had similar results and others have noticed a battery life decrease.

For what it's worth I have always kept the security function turned off so that's not the issue.

I'm not anti-tender but I also don't think a battery should crap out after 2 weeks sitting either if I was putting my bike up for the season sure a tender would be the way to go but I usually find a way to sneak out and get on the road, and years ago when we did get snowed in even after over a month of sitting she fired right up.

Keep in mind that a batteries job is power storage and a battery the craps out quickly is in my mind the same as a leaking fuel tank, neither one is doing it's job of storing energy.

Mike

There was a process problem that seem to prematurely kill some of the batteries..  Truck seems to be stuck on the fact that the process is no good but those at the shops see it as a blip in quality (process change startup)..   

I've got 7 years on a high compression 95 ci motor without a tender.. Original starter and cables. The bagger batteries do last longer then the Smaller Dyna / softail ones..

Max

[wholehog]

max, I didn't mean you about the equalizing charge......that was clawdog that mentioned it in his post......

Please show where...  I missed it.

I'm going to start hitting my batteries with 10~20 amps for 15~30 minutes twice a month to see if I can get more life out of them.

yeah I know hydrometer vice hygrometer, but we know what he means....he aint measuring humidity   

Why didn't you correct him when you had the chance??  cause I aint no english teacher and I new what he ment 

Max

Well for 1.. That is not how you equalize a battery.. You don't use excessive current.. The process to equalize involves moving the absorb voltage is up to bubble the battery electrolyte. You don't over current the battery and typically keep an eye on the battery temp..   and incresing the voltage to bubble it increases the current...we used to call it boiling back in the daze (days)

Second point.. Might as well call this place HBT (Harley Babble Talk) or HDF or even CVO Forum then?  All you had to do was spell it correct when you answered him?   Huh?

Max

[Admiral Akbar]

and incresing the voltage to bubble it increases the current...we used to call it boiling back in the daze (days)

Well most of the older chargers were high impedance voltage sources.. All you had to do was leave the charger on longer to equalize the battery, providing you didn't overheat it or boil out the electrolyte.

Still that it not this process..

I'm going to start hitting my batteries with 10~20 amps for 15~30 minutes twice a month to see if I can get more life out of them.

That might be better to say is a desulfation process.. High current knock the sulfates of the battery.. Equalization bring the battery to full charge then over charges it to keep help keep the eletrolyte mixed and to equalize the charge on all cells..

All you had to do was spell it correct when you answered him?   Huh?

You wrote.

A hygrometer cannot be used on a sealed battery...

Why carry on the misspelling?

Max

[clawdog60]

Sorry about using the wrong word for checking specific gravity of the electrolyte.
Poster mentioned boiling the battery dry.
Cant really check fluid level in a sealed battery and I think all agm batteries are sealed.

Maybe anti-gravity is the way to go.

[Bike31]

I use one of these with my CTEK charger to note when to recharge: http://smartercharger.com/products/accessories-cat/ctek-comfort-indicator-pigtail/

HD also sells these. I've had them and they seem to work as advertised: http://www.harley-davidson.com/store/battery-charging-harness-with-led-charge-indicator

This is the topic people come up with when it's 7 months of no riding winter.

[clawdog60]

I disagree that it's non use of battery tenders, as I originally posted my first AGM HD stock battery lasted 9+ years in the exact same conditions that this new one is being kept and used under. Somethings changed with the batteries Truck says it's the plate formation process, Bruce has had similar results and others have noticed a battery life decrease.

For what it's worth I have always kept the security function turned off so that's not the issue.

I'm not anti-tender but I also don't think a battery should crap out after 2 weeks sitting either if I was putting my bike up for the season sure a tender would be the way to go but I usually find a way to sneak out and get on the road, and years ago when we did get snowed in even after over a month of sitting she fired right up.

Keep in mind that a batteries job is power storage and a battery the craps out quickly is in my mind the same as a leaking fuel tank, neither one is doing it's job of storing energy.

Mike

Yes something has changed.  (Quality)  as in many other items.

[mrmike]

Newer chargers have selections for wet cell, AGM and gel type batteries, the one I have also has a desulfation selection among the charging rates.

As it was explained to me if you had a dead or near dead battery especially one that had been sitting you hit it with a high amp charge till as Max said it was bubbling and then backed off the amperage to put a base charge into it.

The idea of hitting it hard was to knock off the sulfation that built up from the battery sitting something a low amp charge rate or tender will not do.

If I had to do a sealed battery with an old style charger I'd probably let it go til the battery got warm then back it off.

Bear in mind that I learned this from a friend that was a Navy WWII Electricians mate before he came to the FD so my info is a bit dated.....just a tad.

Mike

[clawdog60]

and incresing the voltage to bubble it increases the current...we used to call it boiling back in the daze (days)

Well most of the older chargers were high impedance voltage sources.. All you had to do was leave the charger on longer to equalize the battery, providing you didn't overheat it or boil out the electrolyte.

Still that it not this process..

I'm going to start hitting my batteries with 10~20 amps for 15~30 minutes twice a month to see if I can get more life out of them.

That might be better to say is a desulfation process.. High current knock the sulfates of the battery.. Equalization bring the battery to full charge then over charges it to keep help keep the eletrolyte mixed and to equalize the charge on all cells..

All you had to do was spell it correct when you answered him?   Huh?

You wrote.

A hygrometer cannot be used on a sealed battery...

Why carry on the misspelling?

Max

Unless You have dying or dead cells.



unles

[clawdog60]

Lower lead content or low purity of lead creates shorter battery life

[Trouble]

Lower lead content or low purity of lead creates shorter battery life

But can you get the manufacturer to admit this or get them to change to higher lead content. Sometimes you just feel like sheep.