Cruise Drive back cut gears

[strokerjlk]

Iron Mike so graciously donated his old 6 speed to the cause .
Having a back up will bring me some peace of mind .
Thank you Mike 

So the only trans I have ever owned that was back cut was on my old shovel .
It was with Andrews gears . And it shifted like butter , well maybe crunchy peanut butter .

Convince me that I need to back cut these stock gears .
The stock trans I have now has 90,000 miles and I have never missed a shift .
This is my race bike running a shift kill and foot shifting .
In the back of my mind I can't help but think foot shifting has saved this trans .
Back cutting
So what would I gain if I continue to foot shift ?
What would I gain if I go air shift ?
For each question
Reliability ?
Faster shift engagement ?
Parasitic gain ?

 

[wfolarry]

You back cut straight gears but you don't cut helical gears so I really don't see a need for it.

[strokerjlk]

You back cut straight gears but you don't cut helical gears so I really don't see a need for it.

I like that answer $$$$

[HighLiner]

I thought Fast Freddie and Ray were talking about sending out his 6 speed for back cutting last season.  What ever happened to that discussion?  Maybe a call to r&d might resolve some questions.

[Jonny Cash]

I don't see the need on the helical gears.  I'm having a set done on my 5 speed. What are you triggering your kill box with, shifter linkage?

[strokerjlk]

I thought Fast Freddie and Ray were talking about sending out his 6 speed for back cutting last season.  What ever happened to that discussion?  Maybe a call to r&d might resolve some questions.

i wont use R&D . seen to many puck up last year.


Yes Jonny

[rbabos]

I thought back cutting was for the dogs and pockets in the gear for more positive engagement and nothing to do with straight or helical teeth interaction.
Ron

[jam65]

I had the dogs done and now it shifts very smooth. How about a Baker Street Door and an N1 drum for now Jim?

[TorQuePimp]

http://shaftech.com/omicron.html

that process along with better support on the end

Assemble and ride on

[strokerjlk]

I had the dogs done and now it shifts very smooth. How about a Baker Street Door and an N1 drum for now Jim?

I don't see a need for the trap door . Maybe some good ceramic bearings in the stock trap door .
I don't seem to have any trouble with the drum either . Maybe I am lucky . Kinda why I am sticking with what I have until failure .

Thanks for the link John . Haven't heard of them . Will add it to my list .
A lot of guys like REM too .

[wfolarry]

I thought back cutting was for the dogs and pockets in the gear for more positive engagement and nothing to do with straight or helical teeth interaction.
Ron

That's true my point was that it wasn't necessary on helical gears because they stay engaged by design whereas the straight cut want to jump out of gear so the backcut is beneficial.

[jsachs1]

Back cut helps staying in gear.

[HD/Wrench]

Stock trap are very weak. I have seen several failures on larger ci builds. You may have not had one  seen one fail but I bet you will.. I have already had a bearing  failure on my 124 build. Will be up grading that this winter ..  A trap that does not flex is crucial .. In my opinion. But you have luck with the chit 120 cylinders and crank yet others are  failing  brand  new maybe a lottery ticket for Christmas   

[strokerjlk]

Stock trap are very weak. I have seen several failures on larger ci builds. You may have not had one  seen one fail but I bet you will.. I have already had a bearing  failure on my 124 build. Will be up grading that this winter ..  A trap that does not flex is crucial .. In my opinion. But you have luck with the chit 120 cylinders and crank yet others are  failing  brand  new maybe a lottery ticket for Christmas 

yeah thats the thing . i actually do "Potty mouth" with my bike.
but I dont grab a hand full of clutch at wot and slam "Potty mouth" around,then wonder what the hell I am doing wrong.or pass it off as a weak/inferior part.

[rbabos]

I thought back cutting was for the dogs and pockets in the gear for more positive engagement and nothing to do with straight or helical teeth interaction.
Ron

That's true my point was that it wasn't necessary on helical gears because they stay engaged by design whereas the straight cut want to jump out of gear so the backcut is beneficial.

I'm having trouble understanding this. It's a constant mesh gear set, right? I'll ponder it a bit longer to make sense of it.
Ron

[jam65]

I did the trans work because a failure on it's part could hurt the engine or myself at high speeds with more power than it was engineered for. I just don't like to gamble, I am just trying to cover my ars. Meat grinds down real fast at 130+ mph. I don't want to be on that end of it if at all possible. Way too much at stake for me. But that is just my opinion.

[No Cents]

I thought Fast Freddie and Ray were talking about sending out his 6 speed for back cutting last season.  What ever happened to that discussion?  Maybe a call to r&d might resolve some questions.

we did talk about it...but I don't have the extra coin for that right now.
With the addition of my stronger after market trap door with the better bearings and the Baker heavy duty throw out bearing my tranny feels more stable now and it shifts better than it ever has in the past.
I just hope it will get me thru next season because the plan still stands to get it down the 1320 as many times as I can next year.
sbcharlie has a process (I forget what it's called) where he puts the gear set thru it and it is suppose to make the parts harder and operate more smoothly once they are ran thru it. I plan on sending him my comp to see how that turns out first. The price seems to be right for the process. I guess I will have to see what kind of results come with it.

Ray

[strokerjlk]

I did the trans work because a failure on it's part could hurt the engine or myself at high speeds with more power than it was engineered for. I just don't like to gamble, I am just trying to cover my ars. Meat grinds down real fast at 130+ mph. I don't want to be on that end of it if at all possible. Way too much at stake for me. But that is just my opinion.

and I like to test the limits,rather than listen to people that never do anything with their power.
I was guilty of listing to the forum nay sayers ,when I tore my trans down at 60,000 miles to replace the main bearing . it was fine, the bearing I replaced it with actually felt worse than the stock one did.
some  think the stock auto  primary tensioners are junk too. I still run mine. still run the original SE comp too. 
been racing this bike for 3 years with 100's of passes. If it failed tomorrow,I am still way ahead of all the bench/forum racers.

[jam65]

Jim, are you saying that I do nothing with my power? I ride but don't race much. I enjoy the acceleration and performance that I choose to have.  That is what I wanted in a street riding Harley.I did not mean to dig you on this subject and give you the utmost respect in what you do.

[strokerjlk]

Jim, are you saying that I do nothing with my power? I ride but don't race much. I enjoy the acceleration and performance that I choose to have.  That is what I wanted in a street riding Harley.I did not mean to dig you on this subject and give you the utmost respect in what you do.

no I was referring to those that push parts and fabricate stories. if you fit the bill of one that buys into these hyper exaggerated tales and buys parts because of it ,then you bought into the BS. 
it is hard to take someone serious about parts that might fail, that don't  ride more than 1000 miles a year and never get to the track. but want to talk like they race.
think about it . 90,000 miles on my trans and trap door,still original clutch cable . most these guys talking "Potty mouth",never rode that in their lifetime.

[wfolarry]

I thought back cutting was for the dogs and pockets in the gear for more positive engagement and nothing to do with straight or helical teeth interaction.
Ron

That's true my point was that it wasn't necessary on helical gears because they stay engaged by design whereas the straight cut want to jump out of gear so the backcut is beneficial.

I'm having trouble understanding this. It's a constant mesh gear set, right? I'll ponder it a bit longer to make sense of it.
Ron

http://automotivethinker.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/HelicalGearsThrust.jpg

[86fxwg]

Jim, are you saying that I do nothing with my power? I ride but don't race much. I enjoy the acceleration and performance that I choose to have.  That is what I wanted in a street riding Harley.I did not mean to dig you on this subject and give you the utmost respect in what you do.

no I was referring to those that push parts and fabricate stories. if you fit the bill of one that buys into these hyper exaggerated tales and buys parts because of it ,then you bought into the BS. 
it is hard to take someone serious about parts that might fail, that don't  ride more than 1000 miles a year and never get to the track. but want to talk like they race.
think about it . 90,000 miles on my trans and trap door,still original clutch cable . most these guys talking "Potty mouth",never rode that in their lifetime.

read it on a forum,has to be true!

86

[harleytuner]

I've never had cancer.......guess it's not true.

[strokerjlk]

I've never had cancer.......guess it's not true.

cancer is true . the forums are full of it .

[rbabos]

I thought back cutting was for the dogs and pockets in the gear for more positive engagement and nothing to do with straight or helical teeth interaction.
Ron

That's true my point was that it wasn't necessary on helical gears because they stay engaged by design whereas the straight cut want to jump out of gear so the backcut is beneficial.

I'm having trouble understanding this. It's a constant mesh gear set, right? I'll ponder it a bit longer to make sense of it.
Ron

http://automotivethinker.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/HelicalGearsThrust.jpg

Yes Larry, I understand the helical shaft deflections and thrust effects on the gear. I remember how pissed off I was to feel that effect in the clutch lever of my softail with on/off throttle.  How does this play out with dogs and gear pockets? You saying with helical the gear tends to keep the dog and gear pocket engaged better then say a straight cut, where some slight angle on the dog/gear pocket could cause them to be less positive, pushing the dog out from the gear?  Not quite clear on that straight , helical difference regarding back cut yet.
Ron
Ron