Tire Load Ratings And My Flawed Logic

[Deye76]

2014 CVO RoadKing rear tire is a 180/18. Looking at a Avon Cobra 180/55ZR/18. Load rating is 827 lbs., compared to the OE 992 lbs., a difference of 165 lbs. Here's where my likely flawed logic kicks in. This RK is lighter than Ultra baggers, yet the 130/16 tires that used to come on them had the same 827lb. rating. Am I off thinking I can run this radial 18"?
Note:The front radial I'm eyeing is a 120/70ZR/19 compared to the 130/60/19 that is OE. Load rating is only 16 lbs. less.

[04 SE Deuce]

While I understand your logic,  I'd call Avon,  the rep. that I liked there has moved on but you should be able to get a detailed answer.  The sizes you are looking at are not reinforced (aramid belting) which is typically the case with heavy cruiser tires.

I have a couple year old Avon tire/fitment book and the only Harley it list with your rear tire size is a FLTRSE3 to which is stated "no fitment."  The 180/55-18 Cobra has been around for some time and may not be a proper/ideal choice for your model.  The reps. at Avon can give you an idea what has been requested and what is likely coming in new sizes/fitment.  The Cobra line is going to be updated to a new model before long so they may not be adding new sizes/fitment to the Cobra line prior to the change over,  which I understand to be a complete line/sizes change.  I think the replacement is focused on improved mileage,  which makes sense on a touring model.  I'm personally hoping they don't trade much grip to get mileage in the sizes I run.

[SixShooter14]

maybe this is my flawed logic...

Aren't there 2 tires supporting the load? so unless your bike weighs 1700#s, then why worry about the rating?

[masstch]

Wheelies!


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[JohnCA58]

I'll tell my experience,  I tried 2 different Avon 180/55/18 on the rear of my RK.  and the bike felt like I was on ice at anything above 50 mph.  I finally went back to the Dunlop tire that was used on the CVO and things were back to normal.   Dunlop now has the 180/55/18 in the American Elite....  that is what I will be using next and a whole lot cheaper than the Harley Dunlop. CA Phil said that the tires were check by Avon after the return of the first one and couldn't find anything wrong with the tire.  my RK might as well be called a Ultra,  has lowers, fairing and tour pak.

I do run the Avon 21in on the front no problems there.

[SixShooter14]

Wheelies!

Ahh...good point, I guess that's what I get for thinking

[calif phil]

While I love Avon tires, you need to go Dunlop's with that size. 

[Coyote]

While I love Avon tires, you need to go Dunlop's with that size.

I can't find any reason to not run American Elites.

[calif phil]

I sell 20 to 1 Dunlop vs other brands. 

[ThumperDeuce]

My Dunlops lasted about a month after I hit my first patch of tar snakes with them.

[Durwood]

While I love Avon tires, you need to go Dunlop's with that size.

I can't find any reason to not run American Elites.

I have been running Cobra radials on my bike, I like them alot, a much smoother ride than bias ply's and handling is superb.

Just installed my second set yesterday, rear had 12k on it with a bunch of dyno time and could probably go a smidge further, the front still looks good but I changed them both.

The rear tire I use is designed for a Gold Wing, 180/60R-16 and it is dual compound as well. The slightly smaller roll out helped with the high gearing too, no more blip and slip take offs.

The front is a 140/75R-17 for anyone interested in smoothing out the ride quality.

[Ohio HD]

Nothing to do with weight ratings, but there is a lot of truth in one tire in a size is not the same as another. My '09 Ultra rides and handles great with OEM Dunlops, and as well or better with American Elites. My '08 Street Glide feels like it's on "tippy toes" is the best way to describe it with the American Elites. The ride is good, but it just steers weird, and does not instill confidence in corners. I'll go back to Avon Cobras here shortly on the Street Glide.   

[Coyote]

My Dunlops lasted about a month after I hit my first patch of tar snakes with them.

For the older ones, I agree. But this thread is about the newer ones that are dual compound.

[ThumperDeuce]

It is true that they were the stock ones that came with my 2004 Deuce.  I hope they have been improved.
Metz 880XXL is the only 200mm that will fit my rear wheel.  I would have to go to a 180 in a Cobra.  I may try them the next time around.

[Piston Broke]

Aren't there 2 tires supporting the load? so unless your bike weighs 1700#s, then why worry about the rating?

You have not met his wife ...

[ThumperDeuce]

Keep in mind that the load does shift forward when you brake putting more bias on the front tire.

[klammer76]

Nothing to do with weight ratings, but there is a lot of truth in one tire in a size is not the same as another. My '09 Ultra rides and handles great with OEM Dunlops, and as well or better with American Elites. My '08 Street Glide feels like it's on "tippy toes" is the best way to describe it with the American Elites. The ride is good, but it just steers weird, and does not instill confidence in corners. I'll go back to Avon Cobras here shortly on the Street Glide.

I agree with this. I have American Elites on my stripped (Street Glide style) FLHTC in 150/80-16. Just do not like the way they feel or handle. Wish I could still get the Venom X in that size. Didn't get any mileage but they rode and handled great.

klammer

[Ohio HD]

Nothing to do with weight ratings, but there is a lot of truth in one tire in a size is not the same as another. My '09 Ultra rides and handles great with OEM Dunlops, and as well or better with American Elites. My '08 Street Glide feels like it's on "tippy toes" is the best way to describe it with the American Elites. The ride is good, but it just steers weird, and does not instill confidence in corners. I'll go back to Avon Cobras here shortly on the Street Glide.

I agree with this. I have American Elites on my stripped (Street Glide style) FLHTC in 150/80-16. Just do not like the way they feel or handle. Wish I could still get the Venom X in that size. Didn't get any mileage but they rode and handled great.

klammer

You should try the Avon Cobras. They will get better life than the Venom X, and they grip really well.

[Deye76]

Here's a photo of the OE Dunlop with less than 7000 miles. Howls like a dog when the sirens are blaring.
Front one cupping also.
I'll give the AE a try, better to be safe.

[SixShooter14]

Nothing to do with weight ratings, but there is a lot of truth in one tire in a size is not the same as another. My '09 Ultra rides and handles great with OEM Dunlops, and as well or better with American Elites. My '08 Street Glide feels like it's on "tippy toes" is the best way to describe it with the American Elites. The ride is good, but it just steers weird, and does not instill confidence in corners. I'll go back to Avon Cobras here shortly on the Street Glide.

I agree with this. I have American Elites on my stripped (Street Glide style) FLHTC in 150/80-16. Just do not like the way they feel or handle. Wish I could still get the Venom X in that size. Didn't get any mileage but they rode and handled great.

klammer

You should try the Avon Cobras. They will get better life than the Venom X, and they grip really well.

I like my Cobras, of course my softail is a different animal.

[Ohio HD]

Here's a photo of the OE Dunlop with less than 7000 miles. Howls like a dog when the sirens are blaring.
Front one cupping also.
I'll give the AE a try, better to be safe.

John, I had a new set of D407 and D408 tires put on my Ultra when I bought it, it had 6,200 miles on it. Front was cupped bad. They were decent, but I can honestly say the American Elites ride and handle really a bit better in my opinion on that bike.

[92flhtcu]

American Elite is now available in a 130/60B21 as well
I really like the way my 04FLHTC handles with the Am-Elites compared to the 402's
Just got home a hour ago after a 30mi ride in a down pour, i mean a good old summer high wind down pour, I am amazed at the wet handling on this tire, 60-70mph on two lane, no issues

[motorhogman]

I upgraded my rear tire to an AE MU85 16 with the help of a sprocket spacer. 2001 FLHT

Have about 1500 mi on it now. Running a D402 on the front MT90 16 

Bike handles and rides great. Haven't been in any really wet weather but it feels great changing lanes at 80  on the super slab and handles very nice on the 2 laners at 60 to 70 ..

Also ran a metal bridge with 0 issues,..

Ohh and one more thing...It will go a month without adding air, set at 38 and dropped to 36 over that time.....  Never got that with D 402's or Metzler..

I think I'm gonna be liking this tire. 

[TN]

Here's a photo of the OE Dunlop with less than 7000 miles. Howls like a dog when the sirens are blaring.
Front one cupping also.
I'll give the AE a try, better to be safe.

roger that.

I've ran several avon cobras 180/55/18 on my FLTRSE3 without cupping, tried the pirelli without issues. the load rating was 150lbs less than the OE dunlop 407 so I didn't ride fat chicks. 

I just bought a set of AE for my bike they're sitting on the shelf waiting for install. Hoping for better results. 


TN


the HD branded d407 180-55-18 sux, I've tried several at various air pressure. cupping is an issue. HD customer service has never heard of cupping issues as described BTW. 

[Deye76]

Wonder if a Avon 200/55VR/18 would fit. Inflated width is .6" more than the 180. Load rating is 963 lbs., only 30 lbs. less than OE. I'll have to take some measurements inside the fender. The inflated width of the front is 4.7" compared to 4.9" for a AE. 

[Eglider05]

I have been running Cobra radials on my bike, I like them alot, a much smoother ride than bias ply's and handling is superb.

Interesting, I found just the opposite with the radials. I liked the ride but didn't care for the handling so I pulled them and went back to bias ply. Different strokes I guess.

Rick

[Durwood]

Different bikes too, mine is a 2011 Road glide ultra.

I never tried them on an earlier chassis.

[04 SE Deuce]

Wonder if a Avon 200/55VR/18 would fit. Inflated width is .6" more than the 180. Load rating is 963 lbs., only 30 lbs. less than OE. I'll have to take some measurements inside the fender. The inflated width of the front is 4.7" compared to 4.9" for a AE.

Somebody here already made that mistake.  The 200 is for 6.0" - 6.5" rim,  yours is 5.0" if my fitment book is correct...good way to develop strange handling.  -Rick

[Eglider05]

Different bikes too, mine is a 2011 Road glide ultra.

I never tried them on an earlier chassis.

That might be the difference, mines a 05 with a 180 on the rear.

Rick

[Deye76]

Wonder if a Avon 200/55VR/18 would fit. Inflated width is .6" more than the 180. Load rating is 963 lbs., only 30 lbs. less than OE. I'll have to take some measurements inside the fender. The inflated width of the front is 4.7" compared to 4.9" for a AE.

Somebody here already made that mistake.  The 200 is for 6.0" - 6.5" rim,  yours is 5.0" if my fitment book is correct...good way to develop strange handling.  -Rick

Thanks for that.  My next step was to determine rim width.

[04 SE Deuce]

Besides the 180/55-18 Cobra not being reinforced the fitment on the tire is 5.5" - 6" rims which may also why Avon states "no fitment." 

Don't get me wrong I like the Cobra line when available.  IMO it's the option for a guy that wants more grip in a cruiser tire.

IME when you mount a tire the is .5 outside of fitment size you'll notice something is a little off if your perceptive,  1" or more out of spec and it's just plain wrong.  -Rick

[ThumperDeuce]

My rear width is 5.5" which is why I can't run a 200mm Avon.  It is the minimum allowable for the 200mm Metz 880 xxl.

[rockytop117]

Wonder if a Avon 200/55VR/18 would fit. Inflated width is .6" more than the 180. Load rating is 963 lbs., only 30 lbs. less than OE. I'll have to take some measurements inside the fender. The inflated width of the front is 4.7" compared to 4.9" for a AE.

I've been running 200/50/17 Avons & Metzler on my FLTRUSE since new. I have RC Components wheels but recently switched to Michelin 200/55/17 radial tire & have about 1700 miles on it. I despise Dunlops as they always chop up like a mudgrip  on the rear & lucky to get 5k out of them. 

[04 SE Deuce]

Wonder if a Avon 200/55VR/18 would fit. Inflated width is .6" more than the 180. Load rating is 963 lbs., only 30 lbs. less than OE. I'll have to take some measurements inside the fender. The inflated width of the front is 4.7" compared to 4.9" for a AE.

I've been running 200/50/17 Avons & Metzler on my FLTRUSE since new. I have RC Components wheels but recently switched to Michelin 200/55/17 radial tire & have about 1700 miles on it. I despise Dunlops as they always chop up like a mudgrip  on the rear & lucky to get 5k out of them.

You didn't state the width of your RC wheel....probably 6".

[klammer76]

Nothing to do with weight ratings, but there is a lot of truth in one tire in a size is not the same as another. My '09 Ultra rides and handles great with OEM Dunlops, and as well or better with American Elites. My '08 Street Glide feels like it's on "tippy toes" is the best way to describe it with the American Elites. The ride is good, but it just steers weird, and does not instill confidence in corners. I'll go back to Avon Cobras here shortly on the Street Glide.

I agree with this. I have American Elites on my stripped (Street Glide style) FLHTC in 150/80-16. Just do not like the way they feel or handle. Wish I could still get the Venom X in that size. Didn't get any mileage but they rode and handled great.

klammer

You should try the Avon Cobras. They will get better life than the Venom X, and they grip really well.

Would love to try Cobras but only come in 150/80-16 in V rated which is too wide.

[hbkeith]

Put the Dunlop Am Elites on my 97 Roadking this year , Not impressed , squirly feeling , liked my E3,s a lot better

[Admiral Akbar]

Put the Dunlop Am Elites on my 97 Roadking this year , Not impressed , squirly feeling , liked my E3,s a lot better

It's funny that you say that.. I'd bet you could tighten up the chassis some.. I'm running Elites on my RK and they work pretty good.. There little bit of squirming when I on the brakes into a corner but they aren't too bad. Corner real nice.. On my EGC, tire feel like they are going flat.. Toss it into a corner and the front of the bike does a little dance..  E3s or CIIs were much better on it..   Avons were real nice but only got 4000-4500 miles out of them where I get about 8 from the rear CII and E3s.  Avons did get squirrely when the ambient temps went over 110F, especially on tar snakes..

[04 SE Deuce]

To qualify the statement about Avons and tar snakes you need to have ran the same or very similar road at similar ambient temp with the competing tires.  Avon Cobra has the most grip of the "cruiser" tires I've tried.

As to the little dance your EG does on entry,  you have 10wt oil combined with a heavy fork springs in that bike,  I know a long shot.  Kinda what I meant before when I said I didn't want to wait on the front end to settle out after a bump on entry...and bumps grow where braking happens.   -Rick

[hbkeith]

Put the Dunlop Am Elites on my 97 Roadking this year , Not impressed , squirly feeling , liked my E3,s a lot better

It's funny that you say that.. I'd bet you could tighten up the chassis some.. I'm running Elites on my RK and they work pretty good.. There little bit of squirming when I on the brakes into a corner but they aren't too bad. Corner real nice.. On my EGC, tire feel like they are going flat.. Toss it into a corner and the front of the bike does a little dance..  E3s or CIIs were much better on it..   Avons were real nice but only got 4000-4500 miles out of them where I get about 8 from the rear CII and E3s.  Avons did get squirrely when the ambient temps went over 110F, especially on tar snakes..

I think my wore out E3,s were better . hit a bunch of tar snakes yesterday ,pulled me all over . think im pulling new tires off

[PoorUB]

I have never ridden a tire that handles hot tar snakes, and why would it makes a difference? Have you ever got off the bike and stuck your boot into a tar snake? The top surface of the tar snake separates from the rest and it slips across it's self the tire is grabbing all it can, it just what it is grabbing just slides away.

[04 SE Deuce]

I have never ridden a tire that handles hot tar snakes, and why would it makes a difference? Have you ever got off the bike and stuck your boot into a tar snake? The top surface of the tar snake separates from the rest and it slips across it's self the tire is grabbing all it can, it just what it is grabbing just slides away.

  Bingo,  there is a parking lot that I go to frequently that had the cracks tarred and resealed.  My bike would move around like the axle was loose at parking lot speeds.  Now for the strange part,  I noticed there was a variance from one day to the next but it didn't seem to correlate to temperature....stuff finally cured.

[Eglider05]

I have never ridden a tire that handles hot tar snakes, and why would it makes a difference? Have you ever got off the bike and stuck your boot into a tar snake? The top surface of the tar snake separates from the rest and it slips across it's self the tire is grabbing all it can, it just what it is grabbing just slides away.

Had the ole butt pucker a couple times yesterday, I never get used to it.

Rick