New MOCO Bluetooth system

[FurryOne]

OK, so I've lived with a set of Sena 30K headsets for a while now, along with the WHIM, and here's my comments.

The 30K works fine with the WHIM for commands and phone, though as mentioned numerous times before, your audio is in monaural , not stereo.  I can live with that.  What I can't live with is the crappy speakers Sena includes.  I have a set in a 3/4 helmet and 1/2 helmet, and neither are any good when riding.  When you start to increase the volume to hear them, they start to distort the crap out of the sound.  I ended up removing them, and hooking up a set of earbuds to the earbud port - they sound fine, so it's not the WHIM/30K interface.  I'm looking now for a better set of speakers to splice into the connector.

I haven't been able to try out the bike2bike stuff yet.   

[FurryOne]

Another few weeks, another update.  As previously mentioned, the Sena speakers SUCK!  I found decent replacements to be the UCLEAR digital speakers - about $40.  Just unscrew the junk Sena speaker connector and plug the UCLEAR digitals in the front of the Sena mount right next to the mic boom.  What a difference!  On my 3/4 helmet it was simple.  On my Bell Pitboss 1/2 helmet I got tired of using the earplugs, so the best option was to get a set of speaker pouches and slip a set of UCLEAR speakers in them.  H-D sells a set that really look nice, but they have a major drawback - the section that slips between the helmet and the liner is a bit too short.  IMC Motorcom has a set (#70 PADS) that are decent, and the section that inserts is much wider - I went with them.  Once I got the pouches installed and the speakers inserted I noticed that when I drew the chinstrap tight, the pouches stuck out. (Arrrgghh!)  I had to tack them to the chinstraps with needle & thread.  Now when I cinch the chinstrap, the pouches follow.

[FurryOne]

It's been a while since I posted anything about this subject, so...

I got tired of the monaural audio when using my Sena 30K headset and the Harley WHiM.  Let's face it - the audio is going to be pretty crappy no matter what you do if you have a 1/2 helmet.  I have a Bell PitBoss w/IMC speaker flaps, and a Scorpion EXO-C110 1/2 helmet with the included speaker flaps, and in spite of switching to the UCLEAR digital speakers, the audio still sucks at 60MPH - though not as bad as it did with the original Sena speakers.  It would seem that a full helmet or earplugs would be the only real way to get any quality sound at that speed.

While testing the WHiM/Sena 30K I discovered that the 30K will not go into Mesh mode when its connected to the WHiM.  I don't know why this is so, because the WHiM connects via Bluetooth, and the Mesh is WiFi.  I called Sena "Tech Support" but talking to them was like talking to monkeys trained to read the script off a computer.  They didn't have a clue as to how their own equipment worked.  This was the last straw for the WHiM.  I disconnected it and installed Sena's Freewire.  With the Freewire I got the same voice command support of the Boom as I did with the WHiM, and a bonus of real stereo audio, plus, like the WHiM, once you pair the Freewire and the 30K headset, it re-pairs automatically.  With the Freewire, the 30K went right into Mesh mode just fine and connected to my other helmet with a 30K right away (in Public mode).  Note: Sena's "Tech Support" stated that the 30K would not go into Mesh mode when connected to the WHiM or even their own Freewire!)

For 2019 Harley has updated their Boom! system to the 6.5GTS version with a full touchscreen and Apple CarPlay.  It still requires a WHiM or Freewire to go wireless (as far as I can tell).  So I've updated my chart to reflect this.

[FurryOne]

A bit more information -

I emailed Cardo to ask if they'd tested their Packtalk Bold with a Sena Freewire.  Their reply was that their Packtalk would connect to the Freewire, but it wouldn't work with a CB.  That reply was a bit confusing since the Boom! System controls the CB, so I emailed back to ask what Bluetooth Protocols their headset supported -

A2DP - Advanced Audio Distribution Protocol
AVRCP - Audio/Video Remote Control Protocol
HSP - HeadSet Protocol
HFP - Hands Free protocol

... The answer was that they were unfamiliar with those protocols.  Ugh!  A low level "technician".

Harley's headsets use aptX codecs for better sound quality than Sena & Cardo's SBC codec headsets, but Harley uses DIP - Device ID Profile to screw with anything but Harley branded Bluetooth headsets when connected to a WHiM.

[FurryOne]

Another day, another upgrade - Sena has upgraded the firmware for their 30K headset to v2.0 (from v1.0.3).  This adds a few items...

Added Audio Multitasking feature in Bluetooth Intercom mode
Added Music Sharing feature in Mesh Intercom mode
Improved Group Intercom and Multi-way Intercom performance
Minor bug fixes with Multi-way Intercom with two paired smartphones
Minor bug fixes with Intercom-Audio Overlay Sensitivity feature

I have yet to try out the voice commands yet, so one 30K headset is at v2.0, and my other one remains at v1.0.3.

[FLHXHS]

FurryOne,

Thanks for all of your work on this. I have a 2017 FLHXSE and the SENA 20 x2 didn't think the WHIM -should- be necessary as Harley-Davidson GT has Bluetooth functionality. But one more $400 touch right... plus plus.

Anyhow - if I do anything I'll go Freewire it looks like after reading this thread.

I do both solo and 2up. I like to have commas with my wife or if a buddy is on their motorcycle. Tunes are important, and the earbuds work best for me. I run Shure earbuds, expensive but sound awesome.

The GPS talking to me is secondary, and if needed I'd use my iPhone for speaking directions.

Thanks for the efforts and your updates.

Next see if you can get a GTS to work in the 2014-2018 touring motorcycles. They're working on it on other forums...

Have a good one.

H

[FurryOne]

I run Shure earbuds, expensive but sound awesome.

For Winter I added Bell's zip-in liner on my Pit Boss 1/2 helmet and removed the extra plastic pockets I'd installed to hold the speakers.  The Bell's liner actually has nice speaker pockets that hold the speakers right up to my ears, giving me the best sound i've been able to obtain with a 1/2 helmet (& UClear speakers).

Next see if you can get a GTS to work in the 2014-2018 touring motorcycles. They're working on it on other forums...

If I was so inclined I'd replace my 6.5GT with the Sony AX-5000 w/Volunteer Audio H-D interface for $1K less.

[edin508]

FurryOne, first off thanks for all of your work and knowledge on this subject.  And if I am reading all of this correct, I don't need to get the HD WHIM for bluetooth connectivity to my BOOM?  I can just get the Freewire to connect to my 20S to the bike and it even sounds better with all of the same functions?

[FurryOne]

FurryOne, first off thanks for all of your work and knowledge on this subject.  And if I am reading all of this correct, I don't need to get the HD WHIM for bluetooth connectivity to my BOOM?  I can just get the Freewire to connect to my 20S to the bike and it even sounds better with all of the same functions?

Yes & no.  Yes, the Freewire will work fine as a substitute for the WHiM, but the Freewire requires the #69200865 harness to connect it to the Boom! IF your bike didn't come with the H-D 7-pin DIN harness.  The Freewire plugs into that 7-pin DIN for its Audio connection, and that # harness plugs into the connector on the top of the Boom. Also, the Freewire has a battery, but it also has a 12V lighter cord.  If you leave it plugged in, and the power switch off, it will wake up when you turn on the ignition.  I added an extra lighter outlet in my fairing and stuffed the wires for the Freewire up in there away from harm.  I also run a radar detector, and built an interface that allows me to connect it to the AUX input of the Freewire so I hear alerts.

Now for the no.  You'll actually get the best sound using the WHiM and Harley's "branded" 20S EVO headset.  Why?  Because Harley actually went a step further than other headset makers and included a better audio Codec (aptX) in the WHiM and their 20S EVO.  Sena & Cardo still use the older (SBC) codec, which is still pretty good, but not as good as the more costly aptX audio Codec.  The WHiM looks at the hardware when it handshakes with the headset, and if it doesn't see an H-D brand, it cripples the audio stream, so if you connect a Sena 20S or 30K to the WHiM you get degraded monaural audio instead of nice clean stereo.

[FurryOne]

An update for the Sena 30K app just came out yesterday that said:

Supported Boom! Audio 30K v2.0 and Boom! Audio N02 30K v2.0

I chatted with Sena support about this and they confirmed that they have created a Harley-Branded 30K Headset.  I have no idea when this will be available, or at what price, but it will be nice to know that we'll finally be able to buy an H-D headset with Mesh Technology and that functions with the WHiM in stereo.