HarleyTechTalk

So I was going for a ride today and made it about 4 miles when my King died. Was cruising out of town in 3rd around 45mph and it bucked and rumbled once or twice, then the engine quit. There was no bang, pops, or grinding (or fluid leaks). It's like someone flipped the switch off.

After coasting to a parking lot, I tried restarting and it just turns over. But the starter whine doesn't sound right.
https://youtube.com/shorts/B08zcjJlUUM?feature=share


Now, a couple weeks ago when it was at the shop getting tires, I had them change the fluids. They found the primary chain tensioner had came apart and left some chunks in the bottom of the primary.
Here's what they replaced:
Chain tensioner
Stator
clutch hub
jackshaft


Things that have been repaired/replaced recently are always the first to check, I haven't got the bike home yet, just looking for ideas on what would have killed the engine like that before I start opening it up.

thanks

I'd be pulling that primary cover first thing. Sounds like a jack shaft or start drive issue, the sound of the starter. But you said it died, so I don't know what that would have to do with the starter, or jack shaft. Might be a separate issue? I'd get it cranking over first, see what's what from there.

Sounds like a zero compression situation. Are you sure the engine is turning at all? I'd do as Ohio suggests, and start pulling primary cover.

I agree with OhioHD.  From where I'm sitting it sounds like a Starter Issue.  Not the Starter itself, but from the Starter into the Primary Side.  On the Long Bolt securing the Jackshaft and Pinion Gear to the Starter...there is a Small Washer like Locktab, that lines up with a Slot on the Shaft.  If that small tab has broken off, or maybe completely missing...the Starter will spin all day without engaging the Gear to the Primary and starting the Bike.  You mention that the Jackshaft was replaced...so somebody's been in the neighborhood.  The Tab could be broken, or they just forgot about the Locktab.

As far as the Bike just quitting...I'm not so sure that would be the problem.  But, stranger things have happened.

If You take Your left hand and place it above the Derby Cover while trying to start the Bike...You should feel a little "kick" there from the Pinion Gear where it goes into the Primary Cover.

Whatever the problem may be...I would be calling whoever did the work expressing My dis-pleasure and see if they will come and pick it up, and properly repair it.
That's if You feel confident in them after this ordeal.

If You go on Ronnies Microfiche, or a Shop Manual if You have it...take a look at Your Starter...You'll see what I'm talking about.

Good Luck!

Thanks guys.
The engine is turning over.

But there is no compression and no spark at the front spark plug.

I'd dial it back on telling the shop you're not happy with their work until all the problems are found.
To determine the stall issue, first check for fuel and spark. Go from there. Could be ignition, petcock, lost compression, loose battery cable, bad battery, bad crank sensor, clogged carb, etc.
One problem at a time.

Are you checking for spark with both plugs in and a third to check?
How did you check for compression?

I'm assuming no compression releases to fail.
Can you feel any compression with your thumb over the spark plug holes?

Quote from: SixShooter14 on April 16, 2023, 02:40:46 PMBut there is no compression and no spark at the front spark plug.

with no compression you're not going to get spark

the work done may be unrelated to the current no start ...

but I'd for sure be pulling the primary to take a look 

I'd be figuring out the no compression first. The sound it's making seems normal for a no compression turnover.

Quote from: Hossamania on April 16, 2023, 02:43:26 PMAre you checking for spark with both plugs in and a third to check?
How did you check for compression?

I did not, just pulled the front plug and hit the button. For compression I just stuck my thumb over the front plug hole and couldn't feel any pressure or vacuum.

I feel like there's a better spark check, but couldn't remember. Bike isn't home yet, so just doing side of the road tests for now.

You could easily pull the primary chain inspection cover to see a bit of what's going on before pulling the whole primary cover.

With no compression felt in the plug hole, it's either not turning over (inspection cover would show chain turning), or motor has issues.

Quick turnover check, you could put it in gear, bump starter, let's you know if starter is engaging if bike jumps forward. Be careful doing this!

Quote from: Hossamania on April 16, 2023, 02:51:48 PMYou could easily pull the primary chain inspection cover to see a bit of what's going on before pulling the whole primary cover.

With no compression felt in the plug hole, it's either not turning over (inspection cover would show chain turning), or motor has issues.

front piston is moving.

Im waiting on help to load it in the trailer. I might pull the pushrod covers and see if any are loose, maybe a dead lifter?

Quote from: Hossamania on April 16, 2023, 02:53:22 PMQuick turnover check, you could put it in gear, bump starter, let's you know if starter is engaging if bike jumps forward. Be careful doing this!

I did that already, it jumped... Also stuck a straw in the front plug hole and the piston moved.

Check the rear for compression too.

Sadly, sounds like a valve failure, or worse, a hole'd piston.

Drop the pushrod tubes and see what happens when you try to crank over. Stripped pinion gear keyway?

Hadn't thought of that, Ohio. Good call.

Quote from: Hossamania on April 16, 2023, 02:56:58 PMCheck the rear for compression too.

rear has compression.

That's better news.
Loose pushrod on the front?
At least you're getting closer to the problem.

Quote from: Hossamania on April 16, 2023, 03:02:06 PMThat's better news.
Loose pushrod on the front?
At least you're getting closer to the problem.

that are adjustable, so could be. I didn't notice any banging, clanging, or even popping when it quit. So I dont think bent valve? Though I have never heard that happen, so...

So, why would it not fire the rear cylinder at least? Assuming the rear is working properly.

Not sure how your ignition works, but it might not fire if it doesn't slow due to no compression.

No Spark at the Front Cylinder?  Could be something as simple as a Bad Plug, Bad Plug Wire, or maybe the Coil, or the Wires going to it.  All pretty easy to check.
Try a New Plug, Check the Plug Wire(s) for continuity with a Volt/Ohm Meter, and that they are seated correctly at both ends.  And check the Coil.
I realize that You are stranded right now and might not be able to do all of this until You get it Home.
If I was a little bit closer, I would have been on My way.