For those running chains what's your preferred product, lube or wax? The newer O and X rings changes are nice but still require attention.
Motul Chain Lube, "road" version.
I just cleaned mine on my Fatboy when I put new tires on. I use Bel-Ray clear, non flinging chain lube
Bel Ray Super clean.
I recently got my first chain drive bike, a 1986 fxr.
Among those chain lube products suggested above, is there any particular advice to make chain lubrication an easy and mess-free exercise?
Also curious how often I should be lubricating the chain.
Thanks in advance. Coming from belt and shaft drive bikes, I've never had to think about this before
I stand corrected, I use the same stuff Phil mentioned.
When I just did mine, I had the small scissor lift under the bike with the back wheel up off the table lift surface. Put it in neutral and carefully sprayed the chain while spinning the back wheel.
Quote from: lilchief on August 10, 2022, 01:25:07 PMI stand corrected, I use the same stuff Phil mentioned.
When I just did mine, I had the small scissor lift under the bike with the back wheel up off the table lift surface. Put it in neutral and carefully sprayed the chain while spinning the back wheel.
I do a similar thing except I cut the side out of a cardboard box and stand the big side up between the wheel and the sprocket leaving the top flap on the ground to support it and catch the fluids I will be spraying. I lay paper towels along this flap and that helps soak up the spray, keep the work area clean and reduces the cleanup. I notch the upright portion of the cardboard at the back to fit under and up the the hub on the back side to protect the wheel and tire from over spray and extend the front up behind the primary towards the trans sprocket. I start at the master link (with it on the bottom run) and spray it good with cleaner and brush out the grit with an old toothbrush while rotating the wheel (counter clockwise) exposing about 10" of chain at a time. As the rear sprocket gets exposed I clean the old tar paste from the previous lube so the it gets a fresh start too. I blow the cleaner out before each rotation (sometimes with a computer air cleaner bomb if no shop air is available). When the master link shows back up and I am satisfied it's clean enough I apply the chain lube in the fashion recommended by the manufacturer. I have used a wax after finish spray if I am going to be travelling and want a little extra sealing protection from the elements.
I find the cardboard shield saves a lot of cleanup from over spray on the wheel and tire. That saves time and makes me feel safer that i won't contaminate the sidewall and lose traction cornering. This has worked well for me.
Is it better to service the chain after it has been warmed up from a ride, or does it not really matter?
I find it best to ride with buddies that have chains as well on a road trip. A quick wipe and spray when stopping for the night is easy with two people. One on chain duty, one rolling bike ahead. Then a good clean at home.
Quote from: Hossamania on August 10, 2022, 06:13:32 PMIs it better to service the chain after it has been warmed up from a ride, or does it not really matter?
The modern spray chain lube I have used is loaded with a propellant so it comes out thin and penetrates well. The propellant quickly evaporates and the lube sets up to a wax like film. My chain feels like candle wax when I check it. It certainly is nothing like the old drip chain oilers that threw oil on the ride and a chain guard was a must. I have soaked chains in boiling grease in the old days but even then when the chain got hot (and they do) it converted to oil and was thrown off. The modern chain lube is designed to not fling off and when the rollers warm up the lube in contact thins and lubricates the friction areas. The cooler outer lube stays waxy and seals it in. Of course, as the chain wears and opens up that changes. My o-ring chain has a couple thousand miles on it since the last lube and it looks and feels like the day after I sprayed it. The sprocket has a minor footprint on it after a couple hundred miles but I clean that off and it doesn't return in any noticeable way.
Thanks all and particularly appreciate KD's input.
How often should chain be cleaned and lubed?
Should be lubed every 1000 miles, if you ride in the rain then it will need it again.
I think the reality is that there is little value in lubricating an o-ring chain (that's in good condition) because the o-rings prevent the lube from getting to the core of the rollers. Now cleaning it is another story. Grit kills chains and sprockets quicker. I am a bit OCD at times so if I clean it I will lube it too. The lube I use leaves a protective waxy coating that prevents rust and provides a barrier to dirt inclusion that will accelerate wear. My top quality 3 year old O-ring chain is still like new and believe me, it has had a real workout.
Many, many years ago I was very eager to use (and happy to do so) wax type of chain lube but have moved back to more traditional lubes. IIRC I use Motul on my -84 Suzuki.
O-ring chains. I thought the theory is the outer rollers need lube because they are not sealed? Additionally they rub the sprockets.... :idunno:
I'm with KD on this topic; no chain lube for me. However, I'll clean the chain periodically with WD-40.
Jason
Klotz KLR is what I use.
No fling and works great!
KLR.jpg
I use an old school Diamond chain that is automatically lubed whenever the engine is running. It lasts an incredible amount of time because it is always lubed and never late on lube intervals.
I re routed the crankcase vent to the chain. I did this a very long time ago. Highly recommended!
Quote from: panhead_dan on August 13, 2022, 09:37:08 AMI use an old school Diamond chain that is automatically lubed whenever the engine is running. It lasts an incredible amount of time because it is always lubed and never late on lube intervals.
I re routed the crankcase vent to the chain. I did this a very long time ago. Highly recommended!
I used to lube my shovelhead chains that way.. Took my sister on a ride one day.. She had a white jacket on.. oooops.. lol
My rule is to wear old clothes while riding a 72 year old bike. A good chain guard helps too but that bike is a little messy no matter what.
Quote from: motorhogman on August 13, 2022, 09:42:37 AMQuote from: panhead_dan on August 13, 2022, 09:37:08 AMI use an old school Diamond chain that is automatically lubed whenever the engine is running. It lasts an incredible amount of time because it is always lubed and never late on lube intervals.
I re routed the crankcase vent to the chain. I did this a very long time ago. Highly recommended!
I used to lube my shovelhead chains that way.. Took my sister on a ride one day.. She had a white jacket on.. oooops.. lol
I used to do the same. Unfortunately it didn't do a damn bit of good in preventing chain stretch. :crook: The 10.000# o-ring chain solved that problem. :teeth:
Remember the early 80's FL's with the enclosed rear chain?
Quote from: calif phil on August 13, 2022, 10:37:23 AMRemember the early 80's FL's with the enclosed rear chain?
My first bike, a 1983 FXRT, had the enclosed chain.
In theory, an enclosed chain should last forever. Kinda like a cam chain or chains in a transmission. They last a very long time. If an enclosed chain on a motorcycle was designed to somehow be closer to perfect, it would be the best final drive solution possible. The fact is, it aint perfect.
Friend had a bagger with the enclosed chain, put 100,000 miles on that chain.
my mate whos a mc mech said motul off road version. also to lube a o ring chain you must lube it after a ride when the o rings are hot and expanded so the lube gets in. lubing cold is a waste of time and lube
If that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
Simple procedure, clean, dry, lube, wipe off.
Quote from: Ohio HD on August 14, 2022, 03:19:45 PMIf that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
this guy knows all about chains among other things. he also said no lube, the chain will not last. you cant have metal on metal
Quote from: david lee on August 14, 2022, 07:07:12 PMQuote from: Ohio HD on August 14, 2022, 03:19:45 PMIf that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
this guy knows all about chains among other things. he also said no lube, the chain will not last. you cant have metal on metal
Lube it hot, no lube? Sounds like he can't make up his mind David. Does he work on your bike too?
Quote from: david lee on August 14, 2022, 07:07:12 PMQuote from: Ohio HD on August 14, 2022, 03:19:45 PMIf that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
this guy knows all about chains among other things. he also said no lube, the chain will not last. you cant have metal on metal
You need to inform him that quality o-ring chains, the rollers and pins are greased when assembled, and then the o-rings seal the grease in. Just like a sealed wheel bearing. We of course need to clean the outer areas of the chain, and lube them to reduce heat and friction at the sprocket teeth.
He's 100% wrong about the o-rings expanding and allowing lube inside the roller and to the pin. 100% wrong.
It doesn't stand to reason. Metal expands and if anything it would seal better when warm. Perhaps, you misunderstood what he was saying. I just switched to chain drive. This is my first season using one besides dirt bikes I appreciate the topic. Is there a preferred adjustment? I've read many different preferences anything from 1/2"-1". Bikes on the lift right now getting ready to adjust the Bumb stop. Getting alot of chain slap inside the primary. I'll use Belray as others have recommended. BelRay makes good products. Hey Ray, is Duracell on the lift now or is that a old picture?
ill mention that to him ohio
Quote from: kd on August 14, 2022, 07:26:23 PMQuote from: david lee on August 14, 2022, 07:07:12 PMQuote from: Ohio HD on August 14, 2022, 03:19:45 PMIf that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
this guy knows all about chains among other things. he also said no lube, the chain will not last. you cant have metal on metal
Lube it hot, no lube? Sounds like he can't make up his mind David. Does he work on your bike too?
Quote from: kd on August 14, 2022, 07:26:23 PMQuote from: david lee on August 14, 2022, 07:07:12 PMQuote from: Ohio HD on August 14, 2022, 03:19:45 PMIf that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
this guy knows all about chains among other things. he also said no lube, the chain will not last. you cant have metal on metal
Lube it hot, no lube? Sounds like he can't make up his mind David. Does he work on your bike too?
he has his own business for 40 yrs hes the only mec his customers trust and know he can fix any problem. hes the first guy i call if i have an issue and fitted a reverse to my trike when others couldnt and never fitted one before. he wont work on pommy bikes. says there crap bar nortons
Quote from: kd on August 14, 2022, 07:26:23 PMQuote from: david lee on August 14, 2022, 07:07:12 PMQuote from: Ohio HD on August 14, 2022, 03:19:45 PMIf that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
this guy knows all about chains among other things. he also said no lube, the chain will not last. you cant have metal on metal
Lube it hot, no lube? Sounds like he can't make up his mind David. Does he work on your bike too?
I think what David meant was, if no lube is used, the chain will not last.
Quote from: Hossamania on August 15, 2022, 07:49:29 PMQuote from: kd on August 14, 2022, 07:26:23 PMQuote from: david lee on August 14, 2022, 07:07:12 PMQuote from: Ohio HD on August 14, 2022, 03:19:45 PMIf that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
this guy knows all about chains among other things. he also said no lube, the chain will not last. you cant have metal on metal
Lube it hot, no lube? Sounds like he can't make up his mind David. Does he work on your bike too?
I think what David meant was, if no lube is used, the chain will not last.
Ahhhh.... after that nudge I reread it and see what you mean. I think Ohio explained it well after that. It's important to understand the makeup of a good o-ring chain to know how and why to service it. It took me a bit of studying before I jumped in because I'm old and don't trust new things. So far it's better than sliced bread. :wink:
Quote from: kd on August 15, 2022, 08:32:39 PMQuote from: Hossamania on August 15, 2022, 07:49:29 PMQuote from: kd on August 14, 2022, 07:26:23 PMQuote from: david lee on August 14, 2022, 07:07:12 PMQuote from: Ohio HD on August 14, 2022, 03:19:45 PMIf that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
this guy knows all about chains among other things. he also said no lube, the chain will not last. you cant have metal on metal
Lube it hot, no lube? Sounds like he can't make up his mind David. Does he work on your bike too?
I think what David meant was, if no lube is used, the chain will not last.
Ahhhh.... after that nudge I reread it and see what you mean. I think Ohio explained it well after that. It's important to understand the makeup of a good o-ring chain to know how and why to service it. It took me a bit of studying before I jumped in because I'm old and don't trust new things. So far it's better than sliced bread. :wink:
I seem to remember that in the old Pan and Knuckle service manuals, that they recommended laying a cleaned chain into a pan full of light weight grease, and heat the pan to thin the grease so it went into each link and roller. That's probably what that guy is remembering.
Quote from: Ohio HD on August 15, 2022, 08:52:56 PMQuote from: kd on August 15, 2022, 08:32:39 PMQuote from: Hossamania on August 15, 2022, 07:49:29 PMQuote from: kd on August 14, 2022, 07:26:23 PMQuote from: david lee on August 14, 2022, 07:07:12 PMQuote from: Ohio HD on August 14, 2022, 03:19:45 PMIf that were true, then you would also be allowing water and dirt into the chain rollers. The O-ring in o-ring chains seal the inner rollers from outside elements.
this guy knows all about chains among other things. he also said no lube, the chain will not last. you cant have metal on metal
Lube it hot, no lube? Sounds like he can't make up his mind David. Does he work on your bike too?
I think what David meant was, if no lube is used, the chain will not last.
Ahhhh.... after that nudge I reread it and see what you mean. I think Ohio explained it well after that. It's important to understand the makeup of a good o-ring chain to know how and why to service it. It took me a bit of studying before I jumped in because I'm old and don't trust new things. So far it's better than sliced bread. :wink:
I seem to remember that in the old Pan and Knuckle service manuals, that they recommended laying a cleaned chain into a pan full of light weight grease, and heat the pan to thin the grease so it went into each link and roller. That's probably what that guy is remembering.
That's exactly what I used to do with the bulk chain I was buying at the farm supply store. I used the good red stringy wheel brg grease because it had cling when it got hot. The lady friends didn't take to well to spotted clothing.
To do it you had to warm the chain up first then coil it up in a small pan. It took less grease to cover the chain. Let it cool a bit and take it out for a cleaning. The pan was covered and stored for the next chain. Sometimes more than one chain was done and stored in plastic for a later quick change. Long trips loaded and modified engines could make short work of some of the old chains.
Hey Ray, is Duracell on the lift now or is that a old picture?
That picture is probably ten years old.