HarleyTechTalk

Technical Forums => EVO 1340 => Topic started by: hbkeith on December 26, 2018, 05:40:13 PM

Title: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on December 26, 2018, 05:40:13 PM
Trying to decide on swapping out the Rocker Arms on Ultima 113 before it goes in the frame , hear of them breaking  :nix:
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: Deye76 on December 26, 2018, 05:53:05 PM
7 come 11
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on December 27, 2018, 02:14:26 AM
yep exactly
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: gsxrboy96 on January 02, 2019, 08:37:56 PM
They ultima rockers lesve a bit to be desired, ive always ran s&s and never had a problem.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: thumper 823 on January 04, 2019, 04:32:06 AM
I guess I have missed the point as to why Ultima?
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on January 04, 2019, 05:20:10 AM
Quote from: thumper 823 on January 04, 2019, 04:32:06 AM
I guess I have missed the point as to why Ultima?
what do you mean ?
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: capn on January 06, 2019, 06:44:00 AM
If you dont change out the rockers just keep a close ear on the valve train noise.If it increases best to stop riding and start checking. Some say Ultima is using good rockers now. I got 8k on my 120 with no problems with S&S rockers and Feuling lifters. Best of luck to ya. By the way , dont pay heed to the Ultima haters.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on January 08, 2019, 08:13:52 AM
S&S standard or forged rockers ?
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: Deye76 on January 08, 2019, 04:16:08 PM
.640 lift, go with the expensive ones.
https://www.sscycle.com/products/forged-roller-rocker-arm-kit-for-1986-16-hd-big-twins/
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on January 09, 2019, 03:35:36 AM
yeah , think I will swap them out , if not it will bug the "Potty mouth" out of me thinking about them
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: capn on January 09, 2019, 05:56:47 AM
I used the S&S roller rockers. 900-4065A
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: BKACHE on January 09, 2019, 10:37:53 AM
So what breaks on the roller rockers?
The arm itself or the roller wheel shaft?
When inspecting those rockers - none had any wear on the rollers.
I inspected when a beehive spring broke. I replaced all of them with the spring in spring type.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: capn on January 09, 2019, 12:10:29 PM
I hear its the pushrod end that breaks or wears out.And it happens whithin 1k miles.If you have more miles than that you should be OK.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: kd on January 09, 2019, 01:02:35 PM
Like this ....

http://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=107206.msg1273600#msg1273600
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on February 20, 2019, 01:41:02 AM
Anyone done the swap to S&S Forged Rocker Arms , I could swear I read in my manual that the stock Ultima Rockers in my Ultima 113 are 1.725:1 ratio , called S&S just to make sure I had correct part number threw D.S. , they said no I need the 1.625:1 arms ?   Just looked at Ultima website as my manual is buried in a pile while rooms are empty for carpet , says the Ultimas have 1.675:1 ratio  , which way ?
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: Hillside Motorcycle on February 20, 2019, 04:10:02 AM
Pushrod cup in the rocker arm will become galled.
Lack of heat treating correctly is what we suspect.
They will fracture also.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: Deye76 on February 20, 2019, 05:17:39 AM
"They will fractuif re also."

Yup. Have seen it happen, friends 100" Ultima. Seems like if it happens, it's within the first 3 or 4 thousand miles.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: capn on February 20, 2019, 01:32:22 PM
Its true the ultima rockers have 1.675 ratio and S&s got 1.625. I got the S&S and you will lose a hair of lift and cam duration but I figured that was good in my opinion. Less strain on valve train.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on February 20, 2019, 04:57:39 PM
Quote from: Hillside Motorcycle on February 20, 2019, 04:10:02 AM
Pushrod cup in the rocker arm will become galled.
Lack of heat treating correctly is what we suspect.
They will fracture also.
You replaced them with S&S 1.625:1 Scott ?
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on February 28, 2019, 02:22:49 AM
no one else has actualy done this swap to S&S ?
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: Deye76 on February 28, 2019, 05:16:37 PM
Lot's of people have used S&S in a Ultima. I doubt you could feel the power difference between the Ultima 1.675 & S&S 1.625.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: wfolarry on March 01, 2019, 02:50:42 AM
I ran the Ultima rockers in a Fatso motor I built about 12 years ago. The bushing went bad in them & I switched them out for S&S rollers. Only difference was the noise went away. No power difference.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: MikeL on March 04, 2019, 07:47:09 AM
Ultima rockers 124 640 cams 8k miles No Problems...........

                                                                                                    MIKE
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: capn on March 05, 2019, 03:57:51 PM
MIKEL, What date were those Ultima rocker bought? I know some have had good luck with them. Trying to figure out the common denominator. I got a brand new set of take outs .   

Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: MikeL on March 11, 2019, 07:31:57 AM
Quote from: capn on March 05, 2019, 03:57:51 PM
MIKEL, What date were those Ultima rocker bought? I know some have had good luck with them. Trying to figure out the common denominator. I got a brand new set of take outs .   


Bought them used back in 2015 from a machine shop vendor from this site. Id say they were 2014 vintage? Do you think time is running out??

                                                                                                        MIKE
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: capn on March 11, 2019, 08:19:42 AM
I still got the unused ultimas on my bench.Also lifters.Know a machinist may get him to test hardness of rockers.The motor was bought direct from Jireh one year ago.Dont know when it was built.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on April 18, 2019, 01:35:47 AM
finally got around to installing the S&S rocker arms and new shafts last night , things look to be around 1/16 " ( will get a real measurement) shorter than the ultimas , gota order shims
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: Hillside Motorcycle on April 18, 2019, 04:16:42 AM
Quote from: hbkeith on February 20, 2019, 04:57:39 PM
Quote from: Hillside Motorcycle on February 20, 2019, 04:10:02 AM
Pushrod cup in the rocker arm will become galled.
Lack of heat treating correctly is what we suspect.
They will fracture also.
You replaced them with S&S 1.625:1 Scott ?

Yes.
Those were replaced with S&S 1.6 rockers.
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on April 18, 2019, 07:20:11 AM
Common to have to shim that much to fit the Ultima Scott ?
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on April 28, 2019, 02:47:16 AM
well , figured out why my rocker arms needed shims , S&S sent  Shovelhead Roller Rocker Arms in the wrong packaging  :nix:
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: hbkeith on June 24, 2019, 04:35:03 PM
well , finally got my Rocker Arms couple weeks ago , S&S had Shovelhead Rockers in EVO box come to find out ,then the replacement ones came after WAY to long ,were same way ,Shovelhead in EVO box  :doh: ,  Drag isn't the fastest with returns. I called S&S and they overnighted me correct parts . Got my Painted Tins back , Engine in the frame  :up: ,
Title: Re: swap out Ultima Rockers
Post by: Deye76 on June 25, 2019, 05:29:33 AM
Nothing is straightforward is it. Glad you got it sorted out.