whilst messing about with my rear wheel and getting it externaly spaced right, I'm wondering if the 'builder' who I'm sure will of replaced the wheel bearings, actualy took time to see if the internal bearing spacer was the right length? I have found a pack of shims in the box of bits but without taking the wheel in bits im not 100% where these go. I assume they go on the end of the tube spacer, or behind the inner race, but without the shaft in if it is for the tube end, what holds them in place? Will pull the wheel in bits next weekend and have a good look.
Reason I ask is I can't feel any play in the rear wheel at all?? :cry: .. I'll get it torqued up in the vice and check it out... will check the front also :banghead:
my understanding is that the inner race,spacers,shims,etc are all torqued to be tight between both sides of the swingarm nothing in the assembly from one side to the other moves and the bearing outer race is pressed into the hub and the bearings rotate between the inner and outer races.the shims might be to allign the brake rotors during assembly
Quote from: mkd on October 17, 2021, 04:41:26 PM
my understanding is that the inner race,spacers,shims,etc are all torqued to be tight between both sides of the swingarm nothing in the assembly from one side to the other moves and the bearing outer race is pressed into the hub and the bearings rotate between the inner and outer races.the shims might be to allign the brake rotors during assembly
No. The shims do not have anything to do with aligning brake rotors and they are used on both the front and rear wheels.
The bearing races are pressed into the wheel hub. The tapered bearings ride on top of the races. The shims are used to set the endplay between the right and left tapered bearings.
To the OP, you should not be able to feel the bearing endplay, it will only be able to be seen on a dial indicator. You have the right idea to torque up the axle in a vise to measure the end play. This is very similar in principle to checking the endplay and a V-Twin crankshaft.
Once you take apart one of the wheels and see the shim(s) and spacer tube most if not all of your questions will be answered.
Quote from: turboprop on October 17, 2021, 07:40:42 PM
Quote from: mkd on October 17, 2021, 04:41:26 PM
my understanding is that the inner race,spacers,shims,etc are all torqued to be tight between both sides of the swingarm nothing in the assembly from one side to the other moves and the bearing outer race is pressed into the hub and the bearings rotate between the inner and outer races.the shims might be to allign the brake rotors during assembly
No. The shims do not have anything to do with aligning brake rotors and they are used on both the front and rear wheels.
The bearing races are pressed into the wheel hub. The tapered bearings ride on top of the races. The shims are used to set the endplay between the right and left tapered bearings.
To the OP, you should not be able to feel the bearing endplay, it will only be able to be seen on a dial indicator. You have the right idea to torque up the axle in a vise to measure the end play. This is very similar in principle to checking the endplay and a V-Twin crankshaft.
Once you take apart one of the wheels and see the shim(s) and spacer tube most if not all of your questions will be answered.
Yes, had a DTI on the rear in the bike. From the rotor to the spindle.. could find nothing so will get it out for a closer look. If I do need to add in, its probably better getting the next size up tube as they look to come in 3 lengths.
I did wonder if the shims went behind the inner race if the tube was too long. But as you say, all will be clear once I have the thing in the vice...
Having accès to a lathe is the way to do this. Start with he longest tube and trim to length. One piece, no shims.
Quote from: turboprop on October 18, 2021, 03:32:57 AM
Having accès to a lathe is the way to do this. Start with he longest tube and trim to length. One piece, no shims.
One in the garage, so may even make my own tube.. see what I find ...
As expected, the inner tube was just about in contact when the bearings were in and all torqued up :angry: Like it was a crush tube or something..
3000 miles on the bearings and the rollers had a nice brown colour to them due to heat instead of the normal silver, so they are heading to the bin.
New ones ordered and a tube ".010 longer being machined so I can get an initial measurement... then will set to ".004 play.
So guess I then need to look at the fronts also. Having done that, there will be nothing on the bike i've not re-done or had in bits to correct LOL... :chop:
Whatcha call an intimate relationship. :teeth:
Well, I set it today to .004" play... I measured the one that went in, and the one that came out, and in mm, the new one was 0.30mm longer... take off ".004 and that gets you to 0.20mm, so at this there is zero play... so when torqued up it was actualy pushing the bearings togeter beyond the zero point by another 0.008" !
Its a wonder they didn't just burn up and weld together!..
As I say, I'm gone have the front off now and see what the halfwhit has done to that .... and then Ive changed and re-set every bearing on the bike LOL
Cutting the spacer to the exact needed length if fine, nothing wrong with that at all, especially if you have a lathe and like doing that sort of thing. However, I see no benefit to that, as opposed to using a slightly shorter spacer and shim to correct dimension the way the factory does it. If you have a lathe and like playing with it every time you need to adjust the bearing pre-load, hey no problem-o. But when it comes time to grease and check the wheel bearings, and find they have worn a smidge and need to tighten them up a thou or two, sure is a lot faster and easier to just to re-shim.
Just sayin'!
-JW
Quote from: JW113 on October 24, 2021, 01:28:58 PM
Cutting the spacer to the exact needed length if fine, nothing wrong with that at all, especially if you have a lathe and like doing that sort of thing. However, I see no benefit to that, as opposed to using a slightly shorter spacer and shim to correct dimension the way the factory does it. If you have a lathe and like playing with it every time you need to adjust the bearing pre-load, hey no problem-o. But when it comes time to grease and check the wheel bearings, and find they have worn a smidge and need to tighten them up a thou or two, sure is a lot faster and easier to just to re-shim.
Just sayin'!
-JW
:agree: The same goes when changing bearings. The new set may need to be shimmed or the spacer shortened.
If its metal off there is not a problem. I doubt bearings wear out of tolerance as its something like .004- .014 of play.... even a few thou and they would need replacing.
I'd expect any new ones to be the same size so should get .004 with new ones.
All that said, I'm sure these will be good for a few thousand miles and probably won't need addressing again in my ownership ;)
Axles are very soft and easy to bend, check axles for straight before setting endplay...