So, the Fuggly is leaking some fluids from the small seal at the shifter.
Took the bike over to buddies garage and lifter her up to attack this plan on Saturday.
Bought the parts I though I needed only to find out the bike has the SE Compensator and the shop manual has no reference for this part.(yes,I have a manual)
Couple questions , is it recomended to not use an impact with the T70 Torx to remove said bolt ?
Is it a two step torque spec ? (100 foot# and then 170# final)
If anyone has a copy of the SE Compensator Install instructions it would be much appreciated.
2011 Fuggy (akaRoad Glide Ultra) :scoot:
Best Regards from under the YVR Flight Pattern.
Rob
I've always used an impact to remove it. It's not a problem. They did change the torque spec at on point IIRC. I've always just tightened it to 165.
I wish I had an impact that stout, have to use a long breaker bar.
Quote from: chaos901 on March 09, 2021, 08:25:04 AM
I wish I had an impact that stout, have to use a long breaker bar.
I have a 1/2" SnapOn. I agree that you want a stout one.
I wanna say that the last time I did this it was something like torque to 100 lb/ft, then back off a half turn then retorque to 180 lb/ft. I know most just bang them on with a 1/2" impact though and call it good. And they don't seem to have problems so I'm, not sure it's really all that scientific.
I always use a TQ wrench installing the bolt. :nix:
If you haven't looked at this (http://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=82010.msg917659#msg917659) it may be worth a read while you have it off. With the torx bolt you likely have the 14+ comp.
Thank You Gentlemen.
Need to fabricate a primary lock bar now. :baby:
Rob
I just bought one to install into my 2010 FXDC. Here's a link to the installation instructions pdf: J05885 (https://serviceinfo.harley-davidson.com/sip/service/document-pdf-print/217573/J05885_540126_en_US.blaise)
:up: I think that link was in Joe's 14+ comp thread but it was updated to another one. It's in FSG's Instructions library in the section. It's M-1352 (https://app.box.com/s/xxxxx) (2014 Big Twin Compensator Update) and is a subsequent updated follow up to the J05885 Instruction sheet.
BTW, the updated torque procedure and spec is in this M-1352 sheet also.
I use a breaker bar with the T70, and a large crescent on the hex. I do this on the ground, use the ground to block the wrench on the Hex. Might need a helper to sit on the seat. Works great. During reassembly this method is even better. I took a pic once, if I find it I'll share.
Some history. In 2014 the Screamin' Eagle compensator was redesigned over the 2013 and previous versions. One of the tell tales of the 2014 design is the T70 bolt. It also became standard equipment in the Big Twin engines.
That said, there have been 2 versions of the 2014 design, the "early model year 2014 version" and the current version shipping today.
The early 2014 version shipped with some shims that were used on certain bike models. Then a running change in design/production occurred to the comp's "slider cam". The redesigned slider cam eliminated the need for the shims. (supposedly)
So if you're pulling a bike apart and see that T70 bolt, that should indicate it's a 2014+ compensator, however, then you need to determine which version of the 2014+ compensator you have. That's where the M-1352 service bulletin comes in handy because it describes the change in the slider cam.
My comp that I just bought was manufactured last month, so it's the latest design. The instructions I posted previously are the instructions that came with it.
So here are the 2 versions of installation instructions for the 2014+ comp in one spot:
Early version 2014 with shims (J05674) (https://serviceinfo.harley-davidson.com/sip/service/document-pdf-print/239622/J05674_536745_en_US.blaise)
Current version 2014 (J05885) (https://serviceinfo.harley-davidson.com/sip/service/document-pdf-print/217573/J05885_540126_en_US.blaise)
Now I'm no expert and don't have the experience that many on HTT possess, so if I've wrong on something, well... :emoGroan:
To the OP, since you mentioned you're going to be doing some work on the shifter shaft seal you might find some useful reading in this thread here. (https://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php/topic,105897.0/all.html)
Quote from: guydoc77 on March 09, 2021, 08:51:31 AM
I wanna say that the last time I did this it was something like torque to 100 lb/ft, then back off a half turn then retorque to 180 lb/ft. I know most just bang them on with a 1/2" impact though and call it good. And they don't seem to have problems so I'm, not sure it's really all that scientific.
I've done this job a few times, and that's what I always did. No problems (yet)
Removal.... HF lithium impact. If you don't have an impact but have a Direct Lift type lift with side extensions... those poles that go all the way through from side to side make dandy cheater bars. As mentioned above a big crescent wench on the hex and using the floor as a stop for it works great :up:
Quote from: CndUltra88 on March 09, 2021, 04:03:50 PM
Thank You Gentlemen.
Need to fabricate a primary lock bar now. :baby:
Rob
A piece of wood, like the handle of any tool you have within reach will be hard enough to do the job, and not so hard that it damages a sprocket or chain.
Samsquatch, are you referring to using it under the chain like the plastic Harley wedge tool as opposed to across from the engine drive sprocket to the clutch basket sprocket. The bar is for use across the 2 sprockets, shares the work between them and prevents damage to the shafts.
Quote from: Samsquanch on March 10, 2021, 12:51:46 PM
A piece of wood, like the handle of any tool you have within reach will be hard enough to do the job, and not so hard that it damages a sprocket or chain.
Nothing should be touching the chain. Using a piece of wood is a good way to get hurt when it snaps. Making the correct bar is fast and easy. The length is in the photo below for the OPs bike. Mine is from 1" x 3/8" stock, cut to length and bull nosed on the ends.
[attach=0,msg1380458]
Quote from: kd on March 10, 2021, 01:12:06 PM
Samsquatch, are you referring to using it under the chain like the plastic Harley wedge tool as opposed to across from the engine drive sprocket to the clutch basket sprocket. The bar is for use across the 2 sprockets, shares the work between them and prevents damage to the shafts.
I was and am embarrassed to admit I had not thought of that good catch.
It's an easy tool to make and works as solid as a rock. This (https://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php/topic,1086.0.html) is a link to a selection of them in the HTT Home Made Tool Section. It's under HTT Sources, Links and tips near the bottom of the Home page. You'd be surprised what you can find there, or in the Sticky Section and more.
No need for a locking bar if you use the hex and BF box/open/crescent wrench. Also removes all slop in the drivetrain when torquing the T70 (or removing). :idunno:
The locking bar is so simple to make & easy to use I can't see any reason to do it any other way.
~John
Well, the T-70 torx and the 1-3/16th sockets arrived this week !!
Be heading over to the garage when buddy gets home from Saturday golf late this morning.
Big thanks for the links and pics of the locking bar and all the positivity .
I'll report back later ;)Regards Guys !!
Rob
Quote from: CndUltra88 on March 20, 2021, 09:34:46 AM
Well, the T-70 torx and the 1-3/16th sockets arrived this week !!
Be heading over to the garage when buddy gets home from Saturday golf late this morning.
Big thanks for the links and pics of the locking bar and all the positivity .
I'll report back later ;)Regards Guys !!
Rob
Actually a 30mm socket should be used instead of the 1 3/16. Can use it once or twice but the nut edges will start to round.
Quote from: FLDavetrain on March 20, 2021, 06:28:08 PM
Actually a 30mm socket should be used instead of the 1 3/16. Can use it once or twice but the nut edges will start to round.
Never damaged one and taken some of multiple times using a 1 3/16 socket and using the same socket I used 30 years ago.
Well, joy was short lived.
Got it all apart and reassembled up to the primary cover.
Dam parts guy :slap: gave me outer primary wrong gasket...
Tuesday after work to the parts counter.
Thanks again guys.
Rob
Quote from: CndUltra88 on March 21, 2021, 11:44:27 AM
Well, joy was short lived.
Got it all apart and reassembled up to the primary cover.
Dam parts guy :slap: gave me outer primary wrong gasket...
Tuesday after work to the parts counter.
Thanks again guys.
Rob
I have reused the OEM primary gasket often 2 or 3 times without any issues. The one I have in now has been reused at least 3 times.
:agree: Same here. Were you gentle with it. Clean it up and put it back on.
I agree Rob, the old gasket is probably ok, and should seal.
Quote from: Scotty on March 20, 2021, 06:33:59 PM
Quote from: FLDavetrain on March 20, 2021, 06:28:08 PM
Actually a 30mm socket should be used instead of the 1 3/16. Can use it once or twice but the nut edges will start to round.
Never damaged one and taken some of multiple times using a 1 3/16 socket and using the same socket I used 30 years ago.
:up:
30.00mm = 1.181
1-3/16 = 1.187
There's
0.005" 0.006" difference....... the average thickness of hair is 0.0025". So two thicknesses of hair.
I think we're good using our 1-3/16" sockets Scotty. I'm sure you like I have pretty decent quality tools that are sized accurately.
Quote from: Ohio HD on March 21, 2021, 03:25:18 PM
:up:
30.00mm = 1.181
1-3/16 = 1.187
There's 0.005" difference....... the average thickness of hair is 0.0025". So two thicknesses of hair.
I think we're good using our 1-3/16" sockets Scotty. I'm sure you like I have pretty decent quality tools that are sized accurately.
:up:
Yes quality over saving a few bucks buying cheap ones that crack when you put them to the test and like you said not sized correctly.
Machining the face will give more purchase too. BTW a blond or a red one is usually less than average. Measured and confirmed. :wink:
Yes it does help to get more engagement. My sockets are all Snap On, and they don't have the bevel at the hex like some tools have.
Quote from: kd on March 21, 2021, 12:04:23 PM
:agree: Same here. Were you gentle with it. Clean it up and put it back on.
Remember guys, I like to fix things till they break....
I tossed it assuming I would negate any possibility of a leak.
anyways, new gasket in hand so to speak and calling buddy in a few to see if we can do this this evening.
Otherwise Friday night in the garage and get 'er done.
Thanks for all the kind encouragement and tips/pointers etc.
Was a big step for me...seriously.
Rob
Quote from: Ohio HD on March 21, 2021, 05:26:43 PM
Yes it does help to get more engagement. My sockets are all Snap On, and they don't have the bevel at the hex like some tools have.
That makes a big difference. I used to be a SnapOn dealer in another lifetime & 99% of my sockets/open end combo wrenches etc. are SO.
I used to build a lot of 93 & 98" Shovelhead S&S Sidewinder kits (before S&S screwed me over big time) & right in the instructions it said "use only a SO open end wrench to tq the cylinder base nuts down" & even listed the SO part # for the wrench to use.
~John
Quote from: kd on March 21, 2021, 05:08:19 PM
Machining the face will give more purchase too. BTW a blond or a red one is usually less than average. Measured and confirmed. :wink:
Ive always heard that. Now I know.
Quote from: kd on March 21, 2021, 12:04:23 PM
:agree: Same here. Were you gentle with it. Clean it up and put it back on.
I have picked up so many tips on this site from so truely talented people, I'll offer that I have a couple of short pieces of 1/4X20 threaded rod that I finger tighten into the primary cover holes to hang the gasket & cover on prior to the actual bolt install. I have been in my '13 bagger primary at least 6 times (SE Comp, Compensaver, Primo Rivera 32 tooth sprocket, general inspection) and am still on the OEM primary gasket.
I have a couple of short pieces of 1/4X20 threaded rod that I finger tighten into the primary cover holes to hang the gasket & cover on prior to the actual bolt install.
I've been doing that for years, that is a great tip.
~John
Quote from: jmorton10 on April 20, 2021, 04:21:31 PM
I have a couple of short pieces of 1/4X20 threaded rod that I finger tighten into the primary cover holes to hang the gasket & cover on prior to the actual bolt install.
I've been doing that for years, that is a great tip.
~John
same here :chop:
Quote from: Rusticwater on March 10, 2021, 07:28:27 AM
Some history. In 2014 the Screamin' Eagle compensator was redesigned over the 2013 and previous versions. One of the tell tales of the 2014 design is the T70 bolt. It also became standard equipment in the Big Twin engines.
That said, there have been 2 versions of the 2014 design, the "early model year 2014 version" and the current version shipping today.
The early 2014 version shipped with some shims that were used on certain bike models. Then a running change in design/production occurred to the comp's "slider cam". The redesigned slider cam eliminated the need for the shims. (supposedly)
So if you're pulling a bike apart and see that T70 bolt, that should indicate it's a 2014+ compensator, however, then you need to determine which version of the 2014+ compensator you have. That's where the M-1352 service bulletin comes in handy because it describes the change in the slider cam.
My comp that I just bought was manufactured last month, so it's the latest design. The instructions I posted previously are the instructions that came with it.
So here are the 2 versions of installation instructions for the 2014+ comp in one spot:
Early version 2014 with shims (J05674) (https://serviceinfo.harley-davidson.com/sip/service/document-pdf-print/239622/J05674_536745_en_US.blaise)
Current version 2014 (J05885) (https://serviceinfo.harley-davidson.com/sip/service/document-pdf-print/217573/J05885_540126_en_US.blaise)
Now I'm no expert and don't have the experience that many on HTT possess, so if I've wrong on something, well... :emoGroan:
To the OP, since you mentioned you're going to be doing some work on the shifter shaft seal you might find some useful reading in this thread here. (https://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php/topic,105897.0/all.html)
Thank you for the history of the SE Compensator!
Jason