I recently bought a 72 shovel that has a 4 to 5 speed conversion on the transmission, The owner I got it from said that the clutch as always been rock hard, after comparing it to my 71 shovel, I noticed the clutch lever is now 2 inches farther out so the cable does not align properly, I tried looking for a clutch lever that is 2 inches longer then stock. No one seems to have one, I am wondering if anyone ever had a problem like this and what was there fix?
Are you talking two inches further away from the handle, needing fingers that are two inches longer? Or the handle sticks out past the end of the bar by two inches?
Sorry, I may have misled you. Its the lever on the transmission, that goes into the crank housing. with the 5 speed kit on its moves it out 2 inches, so the end of the lever does not align with cable.
I can tell you that I had an 82 FLH that had the issue of the lever at the bars being rock hard, the result was the clutch rod in the primary shot through the transmission housing on the other side of the bike, WHY you ask, is because the nut on the other end by the Clutch pack had fell off. I personally would adjust the Clutch as if I just put in a New Clutch pack.
Start with loosening the clutch CABLE adjuster,'til your clutch LEVER is "sloppy-loose"
Then loosen lock-nut on CLUTCH adjuster..turn the screw in 'til it seats..turn it back-out about 1/2 turn..and,hold it RIGHT-THERE while you retighten the lock nut
Then go back to your clutch CABLE adjuster..turn it out (expanding) 'til you have only about 1/8 to 1/4 inch of LEVER free-play...tighten that lock nut..and you're done !
Quote from: rchdrider on February 02, 2020, 05:33:42 PM
I recently bought a 72 shovel that has a 4 to 5 speed conversion on the transmission, The owner I got it from said that the clutch as always been rock hard, after comparing it to my 71 shovel, I noticed the clutch lever is now 2 inches farther out so the cable does not align properly, I tried looking for a clutch lever that is 2 inches longer then stock. No one seems to have one, I am wondering if anyone ever had a problem like this and what was there fix?
Is there enough room to make/mount a bracket extension that would correct the alignment? 1/4" bar stock with 4 holes drilled in the proper place. Bolt the bar to the trans, bolt the original bracket to the bar.
Or maybe cut the release arm in two, and weld an appropriate diameter piece of steel tubing to lengthen it? Of course, that is going to increase the amount of travel required at the lever.
Who makes the 5 speed kit? Wonder if they have a recommendation as to what to do?
-JW
If clutch lever at handlebar is hard to pull you have release lever adjusted wrong. The lever on the trans should be about half inch from starter then adjust center screw in clutch to pushrod in tranny. Then adjust cable to get lever at bars set. This procedure is in the factory service manual.
Quote from: rigidthumper on February 03, 2020, 08:01:35 AM
Quote from: rchdrider on February 02, 2020, 05:33:42 PM
I recently bought a 72 shovel that has a 4 to 5 speed conversion on the transmission, The owner I got it from said that the clutch as always been rock hard, after comparing it to my 71 shovel, I noticed the clutch lever is now 2 inches farther out so the cable does not align properly, I tried looking for a clutch lever that is 2 inches longer then stock. No one seems to have one, I am wondering if anyone ever had a problem like this and what was there fix?
Is there enough room to make/mount a bracket extension that would correct the alignment? 1/4" bar stock with 4 holes drilled in the proper place. Bolt the bar to the trans, bolt the original bracket to the bar.
I think your on the right track here but I would try to contact the kit people as JW suggested to see what they say.
rchdrider....Can you get a picture?
If you don't find a solution think about a hydraulic clutch actuator.
how would a hydraulic clutch fit on a shovel.im interested if its possible
I guess that would depend on what kind of 5/4 trans we're talking about. If it has the stock 4 speed trans cover, Baker and several other companies make them. None are what I'd call "cheap".
-JW
has it got the appropriate clutch pushrod in it
from memory there were a few available and putting a 5 in a 4 may well change things
well I bought the bike in pieces so I dont know who made the kit. I checked with some of the after market kits that sell that and they didn't know ether. probably going just cut it and lengthen it 2 inches. thanks for the input I will put up a pic when she is done.
Pop some pictures up, especially of the right side cover. Maybe someone here can identify it.
-JW
Lengthening the lever will result in less travel for the clutch release push rod. Can you afford that. I would measure the release plate travel first to see how it compares to the OEM travel release specs. An average is about .070 to achieve no drag.
I would modify the bracket before lengthening the release leaver
This is one of these problems that you almost have your eyeballs right down on top of to see what is going on. Using only the "mind's eye" with little information to go on, hard to say what the best way to fix this would be. As described, the clutch arm pivot is moved outboard about 2". This would put the clutch cable at a really bad angle from the bracket to the end of the clutch arm ball socket, instead of a more or less straight shot as the stock configuration does.
I'm imagining how the EVO/TC aftermarket 6 speeds do similar, have a thicker trap door that moves the trans cover outboard and interferes with the exhaust and oil filler housing. If that is the case, then visualizing how the stock clutch cable bracket mounts to the left side of the frame center down tube, you'd almost think you'd need to relocate to the right side of the down tube to keep the same alignment to the end of the clutch release arm as the stock set up. And I'm not even sure there's room to do that between the rear cylinder and down tube. I'm thinking no.
This situation is where a few pictures would be worth thousands of words. Somebody famous said that once, didn't they?
-JW
I'm not sure about Baker but I know that RevTec and Sputhe use the earliest 5 speed style gears and shafts. This includes the clutch pushrod which is three-piece and that's not including the throwout bearing. The right side piece which is inside the actuater cover is 37089-79. The center piece is 37088-79. Then there's a short piece that fits just inside the mainshaft on the clutch or left side. It's 37090-79. The throw out bearing is 37313-80 or 11066. HTH, Bill
As mentioned, really hard to see without pics. Sounds like you will need to relocate bracket as well as make a custom release lever. Heat and tweek till it all lines up while providing proper travel for complete clutch disengagement
I vaguely remember heating and bending the lever on my RT. 5/4.
Sorry guys I was down sick, I took some pics of how the cable is pulling side ways, looking at it i will probably have to remake the brackets. and get a longer cable and run it down the right side of the engine, I was told that some companies do make a longer lever but no one can tell me which company.
I'd put a hydraulic clutch release on it....
reading the S&S notes , they mention the cable ..... same conversion ?
https://www.sscycle.com/products/ss-4-to-5-speed-transmission-case-for-1965-85-h-d-4-speed-big-twins/
That S&S case will use a 5 speed clutch release as it is a 5 speed case that bolts into a 4 speed chassis.
Guys thanks for all the input, I actually got a hold of baker drivetrains. spoke to their tech department and the guys their were super helpful. before I could finish explaining the problem he knew what I was talking about, they make a lever kit for that problem that is 2 inches longer, and I was told it should not affect clutch travel, to me well worth the $170 for the lever kit. should be in my hands by Wednesday. I will post if it works or not, but Baker was the only company that knew what I was saying. Thanks again to all.