Took my 96 Fatboy for a putt. It was running great but just quit. Plenty of fuel and battery. I tried to start it and got one little pop but nothing after that. I let it sit for about 15 minutes and it started right up and I drove 10 miles and made it home. Any thoughts?
It takes gas, spark, and air. So pretty sure you have air, so next time check for spark and gas.
If you have the old ignition system I would HIGHLY suspect it .
Several vendors make much better stuff- Daytona TT for one
Did you try opening the gas cap, may be a blocked air vent, bad cap.
Could be a bad coil. Could be a bad ignition. Some bikes had a main relay go bad, not sure if yours qualifies, someone here will know.
FI of carb?
It has a cv carburetor.
try the circuit breaker mine was weak and did the same thing
When it happened to me it was the ignition.
It also happened to mine - mine was a short, where the tire inside the fender rubbed the wires raw. The subsequent earth was hard to find. I also had the main battery cable connector break. It broke inside the shrink wrap. It would idle but break up at speed=vibration.
Good luck
I've had the bank angle sensor in the ignition plate act up. When it happens once or twice I replace the ignition plate in the nose cone. Sympton = Engine quits. Won't restart for several minutes, after sitting a while it starts.
John
Pop the ign cover off the noise cone, see if there is any brown goo leaking out of the pickup unit.
-JW
Thanks all of you. I found the problem, the ignition sensor melted and shorted out. Thanks again, Happy Trails !!!
We use Dyna 2000i's when that commonly occurs.
I used a the Dyna 2000i's for many years, not that there bad but I've switch over to Daytona Twin Tec because they are better IMO if you are making a custom ignition map. If you want a inexpensive ignition that work as go as the Dyna use a Ultima they are less them haft the price of a Dyna.
Quote from: nw69fl on January 20, 2021, 03:34:16 PM
Thanks all of you. I found the problem, the ignition sensor melted and shorted out. Thanks again, Happy Trails !!!
The nosecone three wire ignition sensor/plate assy is available new from many places. google harley hall ignition sensor.
I replaced my ignition sensor and took my bike out for a test ride. After about 8 miles the bike quit. Same symptoms as before. I let it sit for about 15 minutes and it started right up and I rode home. I let it sit and idle and in a few minutes it died. I let sit another 15-20 minutes but now it won't start. How do I check the coil or should I just buy one? I'll check my manual to see if I have a circuit breaker. Thanks for any advice.
Got any other background info like year, model, mods etc?
oops, fixed it :embarrassed:
Take it out again and when it does it dump ice water on the CKP. If it starts right up, replace it.
More info on the Bike would probably be beneficial to those that have much more knowledge than Me, regarding Your problem. However, are You confident, or certain that it is an Electrical issue? Do all of the electrics shut down? Or just the engine?
Shooting from the hip here, but could it be a Fuel issue? Fuel Injected, or Carb? Vapor Lock, Fuel Pump, Fuel Strainer, or Fuel Filter, Fuel Line, etc; could cause a problem.
Just a thought here...should You take it out for a test ride and it dies, try removing the Gas Cap once You pull over, and see if it starts, instead of waiting 15 minutes or so. It could turn out to be something stupid like a non-vented, or blocked vent in a gas cap causing vapor lock, which will shut You down. If it has been proven that it is an electrical trouble, forget all of the above. Good Luck!
Post #1, '96 Fatboy. No list of mods.
It's a 1996 Fatboy, cvc carb. Where do I locate the and what is the CDK sensor?
Sorry, I had read all of the previous posts, and while I was responding...a certain Higher Authority was bitching at Me about something, which caused My brain to drift a little. My apologies.
I would still be leaning towards a Fuel Problem. Carb float level, the Vacuum switch(VOES) if You are using it, and it is not dis-connected. That switch has a couple of small hoses on it that You may want to check. It is located above the Carb, with an Electrical Connector on it, and the small hoses going to the Pet-Cock, and Carb. I had a problem with a "Vacuum Piston" on a stock CV carb. It has a rubber kind of "Balloon", or "Bladder" on it. The rubber had a small hole in it, probably done by Me while rebuilding the carb. It caused the Bike to run pretty good for awhile, then it would die. Almost like the feeling of running out of gas. Replaced the piece after going nuts, and never had a problem. Is the plug on the Carb Air Mixture screw drilled out? At the risk of this being the stupidest question...is Your Pet-cock ON, and not on Reserve? Hey, stupid sh*t happens...I've done My fair share. Again, only a few suggestions if You have exhausted all of the Electrical remedies. Good Luck!
I'm leaning towards a spark issue because it dies right now, it doesn't act like it's running out of gas. I did an ohm test on the coil and it seems to be fine. How do they act when it's a vacuum issue? I think I'll replace the circuit breakers and starter relay. Just a thought, but should I do the test on the coil just after it stops running and then again after it cools down? :scratch:
You could try cooling the coil right after it shuts down with the aerosol air spray used to blow out computers and keyboards, it is a very cold spray. If it fires right back up, that would likely indicate bad coil.
First loosen your gas cap and try a restart to rule out fuel lock.
As Pirschefirewagon said, cool off the crank position sensor too (do these one at a time, then test.). I think it is located on the lower front left of the crankcase, but not sure, that is the only cation for twin cams.
If neither of those work, try spraying your ignition to cool that off.
The main relay could also be the issue, relatively cheap to replace.
Hoss may have hit on something with the main breaker. In the years up to 98 they were weak (at least in the touring models). You may hear it click when it cools off it that's the problem. It actually was a recall on some models and should be listed in the MOCO recall list. I imported 2 98's into Canada and had to have proof all recalls were completed so the info should be available. It has been discussed here before so it may show up on a search.
The VOES switch (Vacuum Operated Electric Switch) puts a vacuum on fuel from the petcock to the carb. Many dis-connect them if they are for instance using a high flow petcock, such as a Pingel, or others. If it is still operable, that is why You normally do not need to shut Your petcock/gas off when the Bike is not running. Unlike the old days, or using a non stock type of petcock where You would probably shut Your gas off when not running. With the VOES switch working, when You start the Bike, electrical current operates the switch which puts a vacuum (sucks) at the carb to the petcock, drawing fuel from the tank to the carb...simply put. This is where that Vacuum Piston comes into play that I had mentioned earlier. If there is a hole, tear, or not seated correctly under the Carb cap...could lead to a problem like I had. If there is a problem with no current, or a problem with the VOES switch...You could possibly not be getting any, or the correct amount of fuel. If You have an HD Service Manual for Your Bike, (I cant speak for aftermarket manuals) there should be a Section in there about how to test the VOES switch, as well as the Carb fuel circuit diagram.
The question that I have is though...when You say that the Bike dies, does the Engine just stop running? Or do all of the Electrics say good-bye also? Meaning no lights, horn, indicator lights. etc. The answer to that question seems significant to Me. That could possibly prove whether or not You have more of an Electrical problem, or a Fuel problem. I would try all of the cheap, no money tests as previously mentioned here. If You have a Buddy with a known good Coil, tell Him to come by with it, and try it out...see what happens. Did this problem just recently rear it's ugly head? Or was something done modification wise that brought all of this on?
Do You have a Single Fire, or Dual Fire Ignition System?
Giant chance it is the ignition, as Larry has also said.
Quote from: Fugawee on February 07, 2021, 08:31:33 PM
The VOES switch (Vacuum Operated Electric Switch) puts a vacuum on fuel from the petcock to the carb. Many dis-connect them if they are for instance using a high flow petcock, such as a Pingel, or others. If it is still operable, that is why You normally do not need to shut Your petcock/gas off when the Bike is not running. Unlike the old days, or using a non stock type of petcock where You would probably shut Your gas off when not running. With the VOES switch working, when You start the Bike, electrical current operates the switch which puts a vacuum (sucks) at the carb to the petcock, drawing fuel from the tank to the carb...simply put. This is where that Vacuum Piston comes into play that I had mentioned earlier. If there is a hole, tear, or not seated correctly under the Carb cap...could lead to a problem like I had. If there is a problem with no current, or a problem with the VOES switch...You could possibly not be getting any, or the correct amount of fuel. If You have an HD Service Manual for Your Bike, (I cant speak for aftermarket manuals) there should be a Section in there about how to test the VOES switch, as well as the Carb fuel circuit diagram.
The question that I have is though...when You say that the Bike dies, does the Engine just stop running? Or do all of the Electrics say good-bye also? Meaning no lights, horn, indicator lights. etc. The answer to that question seems significant to Me. That could possibly prove whether or not You have more of an Electrical problem, or a Fuel problem. I would try all of the cheap, no money tests as previously mentioned here. If You have a Buddy with a known good Coil, tell Him to come by with it, and try it out...see what happens. Did this problem just recently rear it's ugly head? Or was something done modification wise that brought all of this on?
Do You have a Single Fire, or Dual Fire Ignition System?
The VOES switch does not control fuel flow, it controls spark retard under load. The only connection it has with the petcock is that they share a vacuum line, but the switch itself has nothing to do with fuel or vacuum to the petcock.
Can loss of vacuum in that common line occur with a failure in the VOES switch or leg of the hose? Not to complicate the discussion, but could that then cause the petcock operation to fail?
I'd really like to explain how the VOES, and whatever else has been explained to Me...and the couple of issues I have had with the Switch, and the Carb. However, right at the present time...I have a bigger issue to deal with.
Sorry, single fire ignition
From personal experience during my Evo days, I'm thinking Hoss and KD are on it - circuit breaker.
Remove the seat, run it again until it shuts down, turn the ignition off and listen closely around the breaker area.
Aside from the usual exhaust tick-down, if you hear a light 'click' sound in and around the area where your breakers are after a minute or so, you've found it!
Remember, keep your efforts simple and logical until the simples are eliminated.
If I disconnect the VOES do I need to get a new petcock? Or do I plug the vacuum hose to the carb?
You run a new vacuum line from the carb to the petcock, eliminating the line to the voes, your stock petcock will work just fine.
Did you get it running?
Curious as to why you want to eliminate voes. You can disconnect it for testing, and reconnect it if you find that it is needed.
So when you say plenty of gas, are you about 2/3 low in the tank?
The vacuum petcock is known to fail. The vacuum line to the intake nipple, will not suck enough to open the fuel line.
If it doesn't suck enough the weight of the full tank of gas will not overcome the shutoff spring in the diaphram petcock.
If you think it could be the diaphram petcock - replace.
If yo a re cheap like me take it off - remove the diaphram
and spring, reseal and make a non-diaphram outg of it.
I was just curious after a few of you mentioned the VOES. I got a new coil, plugs, wires and new 30amp breaker. I installed a new sensor earlier. I just haven't gotten around to riding yet.Our weather sucks!!
You may have changed the wrong breaker. I believe it should be 40 amp and many are replacing it with 50 amp.
Search "main circuit breaker" on the site and there is lots of hits. Here's one (https://harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php/topic,103676.msg1225765.html#msg1225765)