March 28, 2024, 11:50:06 AM

News:

For advertising inquiries or help with registration or other issues, you may contact us by email at help@harleytechtalk.com


M8 trans fluid leaking in primary

Started by grnrock, February 17, 2017, 02:31:46 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

HogMike

Quote from: HDDOC on May 15, 2019, 06:11:38 AM
I have no oil transfer on my 2019 Tri Glide I wonder if the dealer would install the vent kit with no problem with transfer.?

Probably not. But why would you if it's not a problem?
:nix:
HOGMIKE
SoCal

HDDOC

2019 Tri Glide

IronButt70

Quote from: HDDOC on May 15, 2019, 06:11:38 AM
I have no oil transfer on my 2019 Tri Glide I wonder if the dealer would install the vent kit with no problem with transfer.?
I read somewhere on another forum about a triglide owner on a cross country trip grenading his tranny because of the migration issue. I would keep a close eye on it.
No one else put you on the road you're on. It's your own asphalt.

Reddog74usa

RIDE IT LIKE YA STOLE IT

HDDOC

Quote from: IronButt70 on May 15, 2019, 09:54:18 AM
Quote from: HDDOC on May 15, 2019, 06:11:38 AM
I have no oil transfer on my 2019 Tri Glide I wonder if the dealer would install the vent kit with no problem with transfer.?
I read somewhere on another forum about a triglide owner on a cross country trip grenading his tranny because of the migration issue. I would keep a close eye on it.

I am aware of the problem and do check the trans oil offten,   Thanks
2019 Tri Glide

Hossamania

Quote from: HDDOC on May 17, 2019, 03:54:29 AM
Quote from: IronButt70 on May 15, 2019, 09:54:18 AM
Quote from: HDDOC on May 15, 2019, 06:11:38 AM
I have no oil transfer on my 2019 Tri Glide I wonder if the dealer would install the vent kit with no problem with transfer.?
I read somewhere on another forum about a triglide owner on a cross country trip grenading his tranny because of the migration issue. I would keep a close eye on it.

I am aware of the problem and do check the trans oil offten,   Thanks

It's ridiculous that you should have to do that.
If the government gives you everything you want,
it can take away everything you have.

IronButt70

Quote from: Hossamania on May 17, 2019, 05:43:49 AM
Quote from: HDDOC on May 17, 2019, 03:54:29 AM
Quote from: IronButt70 on May 15, 2019, 09:54:18 AM
Quote from: HDDOC on May 15, 2019, 06:11:38 AM
I have no oil transfer on my 2019 Tri Glide I wonder if the dealer would install the vent kit with no problem with transfer.?
I read somewhere on another forum about a triglide owner on a cross country trip grenading his tranny because of the migration issue. I would keep a close eye on it.

I am aware of the problem and do check the trans oil offten,   Thanks

It's ridiculous that you should have to do that.
1000%  :agree:
No one else put you on the road you're on. It's your own asphalt.

HDDOC

I agree it is a pain but if it ever does transfer I know now there is a fix.   Thanks
2019 Tri Glide

Durwood

Quote from: harley_cruiser on March 08, 2018, 12:17:42 PM
Quote from: kd on March 08, 2018, 10:49:27 AM
Have you thought about cutting a reverse spiral into the inner bushing surface to cause increased flow away from the primary?
KD, it does not need it, here is a drawing of how the centrifugal force pushes the fluid.



The arrows represent how the fluid moves. The fluids are pushed to the widest part of the tube.
I made this to test how the fluid acts inside the rotating shaft, its made out of half inch pvc and has a half inch cpvc bushing inside. It spins at 2000 rpm and sits at about 25-30 degrees to make sure the theory works.



I'm trying out different shape bushing inside the tube, they are about an inch long and about a half inch from the end.
I'm using water as a test fluid, pouring it into the top opening, the water will flow right through when the motor is turned off, as soon as you turn it on the water is flung out the top end and will not go past the bushing insert.
For anyone interested I used Steve's bushing in the main shaft along with his little slinger on the push rod and all migration has ended.
By now it would normally be down 4 oz, but upon inspection this morning I have lost zero in 1200 miles or so.

bigcraig

Milled trans cover, fat rod and AIM has, so far, cured my transfer issue.

I will keep monitoring fluid levels, but I think I have this problem licked. I am also under a firm OPINION that just doing the mill work on the trans cover will cure the problem alone. I am however, to busy/lazy to do all the testing to prove my theory.


metaliser

Quote from: bigcraig on May 19, 2019, 09:29:28 PM
Milled trans cover, fat rod and AIM has, so far, cured my transfer issue.

I will keep monitoring fluid levels, but I think I have this problem licked. I am also under a firm OPINION that just doing the mill work on the trans cover will cure the problem alone. I am however, to busy/lazy to do all the testing to prove my theory.
That's a good job Craig but wouldn't drilling a few holes on that same side for a poor mans fix basically do the same ? Just Curious.

bigcraig

Quote from: metaliser on May 21, 2019, 04:54:03 AM
Quote from: bigcraig on May 19, 2019, 09:29:28 PM
Milled trans cover, fat rod and AIM has, so far, cured my transfer issue.

I will keep monitoring fluid levels, but I think I have this problem licked. I am also under a firm OPINION that just doing the mill work on the trans cover will cure the problem alone. I am however, to busy/lazy to do all the testing to prove my theory.
That's a good job Craig but wouldn't drilling a few holes on that same side for a poor mans fix basically do the same ? Just Curious.

Maybe, but I think removing as much material as possible is too beneficial. And drilling all those holes would be a pain unless you use a mill, but if you have access to a mill why not just create a much larger area for the trans fluid to go.

It is my opinion that the stock trans cover design, along with the transmission pushing fluid up into that dome cavity, high enough to be level with the push rod, and a small bit of primary vacuum is what causes the migration problem. I would bet a shiny new penny on it!

While it is terrible to say, I hope one of my local buddies finds he has this issue, and I will try and talk them into just letting me put a milled trans cover on it with none of the other known "possible" remedies.  (I have two more trans covers I am going to mill out, just to have around for friends.)

hd06

  How come you don't just put a vent on the primary and be done with it.   :nix:

98fxstc

Quote from: hd06 on May 21, 2019, 03:01:35 PM
  How come you don't just put a vent on the primary and be done with it.   :nix:

I would guess pretty much the same amount of work for each fix
I would take the invisible fix any day of the week
and no vent to worry about clogging or allowing dirt, water in.

FSG

Quote from: hd06 on May 21, 2019, 03:01:35 PM
  How come you don't just put a vent on the primary and be done with it.   :nix:

if it were me I'd fix the problem at the source rather than Bandaid it elsewhere

RedDog

Quote from: FSG on May 22, 2019, 12:06:28 AM

if it were me I'd fix the problem at the source rather than Bandaid it elsewhere

What is the source of the problem that needs to be fixed?  How do we fix it? Is your M8 transferring?

Hossamania

Quote from: RedDog on May 22, 2019, 03:40:04 AM
Quote from: FSG on May 22, 2019, 12:06:28 AM

if it were me I'd fix the problem at the source rather than Bandaid it elsewhere

What is the source of the problem that needs to be fixed?  How do we fix it? Is your M8 transferring?

Start at the beginning of this thread. All explained in great detail.
If the government gives you everything you want,
it can take away everything you have.

bigcraig

Quote from: hd06 on May 21, 2019, 03:01:35 PM
  How come you don't just put a vent on the primary and be done with it.   :nix:

Honestly, I might later down the road if the issue raises it's head again.

Also, while my dealer is aware of my problem, they can't get me in until June 11th. I also specifically ask about getting the vent kit installed, hell I gave them the part number, but they are unclear if the moco will just send the vent kit for them to install, or if I have to go thru the whole "correct fluids, come back in 1k miles" nonsense. I took matters into my own hands. Frankly, after researching the problem and paying attention to what other folks have done, I personally feel I have it fixed.

Right now my only real concern is with the AIM s/c, as I just read on another forum of one failing, it is pushing dot4 past the piston seal. And, I know of one other person who returned their AIM for replacement, as the  advertised "wider friction zone" returned to stock characteristics. AIM replaced it, and the new one is working as it should, but the issue is being noted by other folks as well.

hd06

  What part number is it.  Thanks for the reply

FSG

INNER PRIMARY VENT SERVICE KIT    P/N  94100065


hd06

 Harley should relieve these kits in in 2 or 3 weeks what i'm told. Harley Rep. drilled and taped my primary last september and put a vent hose and that fixed the problem that I had from the last 2 years on mine.

FSG


Karl H.

Dyna Wide Glide '03, Softail Deluxe '13, Street Glide '14, Sportster 883R '15

harley_cruiser

Harley could fix this problem on new bikes very easily by machining a taper in the main shaft end on the transmission side or just machine a counter sink about an inch in the tunnel creating a step in the tunnel. Centrifugal force will keep the oil from climbing that step and it would act as a dam regardless of if it is drawn in by a vacuum or just splashed in on the clutch push rod. Once oil gets inside the tunnel there is nothing to stop it and centrifugal force pushes it into the primary.
They should also mill a grove in the push rod just at the edge of the tunnel. This would act as a slinger keep oil from entering the tunnel via the push rod.

IronButt70

Quote from: harley_cruiser on May 25, 2019, 03:23:45 PM
Harley could fix this problem on new bikes very easily by machining a taper in the main shaft end on the transmission side or just machine a counter sink about an inch in the tunnel creating a step in the tunnel. Centrifugal force will keep the oil from climbing that step and it would act as a dam regardless of if it is drawn in by a vacuum or just splashed in on the clutch push rod. Once oil gets inside the tunnel there is nothing to stop it and centrifugal force pushes it into the primary.
They should also mill a grove in the push rod just at the edge of the tunnel. This would act as a slinger keep oil from entering the tunnel via the push rod.
Common sense seems to be an option at MoCo these days.
No one else put you on the road you're on. It's your own asphalt.