Author Topic: 2nd to Neutral  (Read 3088 times)

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Offline rageglide

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #25 on: October 03, 2018, 08:49:24 PM »
Almost positive it's a shift drum thing.  5 Speed is a 5 speed.  HD did a few things with later 5 speeds (besides the positive stop, less likely to overspin drum).  Change the drum and blocks I'm sure your evo will shift like your RK.  Buy the complete set, cheaper than buying just the shift drum and pillow blocks.  If the gears are junk bfd.  If bearings are junk, bfd r/r em

Offline david lee

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #26 on: October 03, 2018, 08:53:57 PM »
my shovels good too.id hate to waste $100 to but it might be a good price to take the risk

Offline rageglide

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #27 on: October 03, 2018, 09:01:15 PM »
My shovel hits neutral darn near any direction lol   But 1st or 2nd either one, easy peasy.

Offline tomfiii

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #28 on: October 04, 2018, 12:46:43 PM »
I  drove friends updated trans and all associated parts and it feels weird that the shifter stops all movement when shoving up in 5th and down in first after those gears .

Offline JW113

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #29 on: March 01, 2019, 10:50:13 AM »
It has been a while since I asked about this, but have finally moved on it. Rather than try to round up the stock HD 2000-2006 parts which I know would work, I took a gamble and went with the Baker smooth shift kit, and replaced the shifter pawl as well. Hope to fire it up this weekend to see if the money/effort was worth it, to be able to shift to neutral from 2nd. Fingers crossed...

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline Pete_Vit

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #30 on: March 01, 2019, 12:29:00 PM »
It has been a while since I asked about this, but have finally moved on it. Rather than try to round up the stock HD 2000-2006 parts which I know would work, I took a gamble and went with the Baker smooth shift kit, and replaced the shifter pawl as well. Hope to fire it up this weekend to see if the money/effort was worth it, to be able to shift to neutral from 2nd. Fingers crossed...

-JW
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Offline david lee

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #31 on: March 01, 2019, 04:01:26 PM »
It has been a while since I asked about this, but have finally moved on it. Rather than try to round up the stock HD 2000-2006 parts which I know would work, I took a gamble and went with the Baker smooth shift kit, and replaced the shifter pawl as well. Hope to fire it up this weekend to see if the money/effort was worth it, to be able to shift to neutral from 2nd. Fingers crossed...

-JW
can you post the outcome.i eventually want to put a reverse on my trike but will have to get a later model 5sp as mine is the early series and wont fit.aparently theres only a couple of models i can use, mid 80s that will work before they went to rubber mounted thanks

Offline JW113

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #32 on: March 11, 2019, 06:58:39 PM »
Just took the bike for a spin. Although it was not a huge amount of work to install, my impression of the Baker shift drum:   :crook:

The ONLY reason I swapped it in was to get from 2nd to neutral, and the Baker sure does not. Just like the stock one. I had asked the guys there several times about this before I bought it and could not get an answer. I rolled the dice, got snake eyes, money down the drain. Damn. Back to cruising Ebay for a 2002-2006 stock drum...

 :emsad:

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline turboprop

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #33 on: March 11, 2019, 07:27:56 PM »
Just took the bike for a spin. Although it was not a huge amount of work to install, my impression of the Baker shift drum:   :crook:

The ONLY reason I swapped it in was to get from 2nd to neutral, and the Baker sure does not. Just like the stock one. I had asked the guys there several times about this before I bought it and could not get an answer. I rolled the dice, got snake eyes, money down the drain. Damn. Back to cruising Ebay for a 2002-2006 stock drum...

 :emsad:

-JW

Along with that '02-'06 drum, you will also need the pawl and the longer case bushing. The new drum is not compatible with the old pawl. Have used this setup in all of my FXR builds. I even tore apart the trans in my red/white bike to replace the Baker stuff with the late model TC stuff.

'Trying to teach pigs to sing is a waste of time and annoys the pigs'

Offline JW113

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #34 on: March 11, 2019, 07:49:44 PM »
While swapping the drum, I also replaced the pawl assembly with the Baker version to get rid of that hairpin spring. Is that too also not compatible with the 02-06 drum?

thanks,
JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline turboprop

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #35 on: March 11, 2019, 08:51:09 PM »
While swapping the drum, I also replaced the pawl assembly with the Baker version to get rid of that hairpin spring. Is that too also not compatible with the 02-06 drum?

thanks,
JW

Unfortunately it is not. The Baker stuff and the '02-'06 harley stuff are not interchangeable. they have to be used as matched sets. The '02-'06 pawl requires a a longer bushing in the case. It will be a bunch of work, but well worth it. To swap out the bushing in the trans case, the inner primary will have to come off. Enjoy.
'Trying to teach pigs to sing is a waste of time and annoys the pigs'

Offline david lee

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #36 on: March 12, 2019, 04:19:02 PM »
WOW all apart again ?

Offline JW113

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #37 on: March 12, 2019, 06:55:09 PM »
Hey Turbo, msg received. Your mail box is full.

 :SM:

Dave: no, not all apart. Not yet anyway. Am collecting the parts to pull the Baker drum out and install stock late 5 speed drum as Turbo had advised way back at the top of this post. Some people just don't listen.
 :doh:

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber

Offline turboprop

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #38 on: March 12, 2019, 08:08:22 PM »
Hey Turbo, msg received. Your mail box is full.

 :SM:

Dave: no, not all apart. Not yet anyway. Am collecting the parts to pull the Baker drum out and install stock late 5 speed drum as Turbo had advised way back at the top of this post. Some people just don't listen.
 :doh:

-JW

Fixed.
'Trying to teach pigs to sing is a waste of time and annoys the pigs'

Offline david lee

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #39 on: March 13, 2019, 01:40:41 PM »
Hey Turbo, msg received. Your mail box is full.

 :SM:

Dave: no, not all apart. Not yet anyway. Am collecting the parts to pull the Baker drum out and install stock late 5 speed drum as Turbo had advised way back at the top of this post. Some people just don't listen.
 :doh:

-JW
looks like your on track now.wont the primary have to come off.

Offline cheech

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #40 on: March 13, 2019, 02:33:14 PM »
Turbo, do you know off hand what changes were made to the 02 and up drum? My 01 Road King shifts to neutral from 2nd. Part number for that ends in 00. So was a 2000 up part. Assuming until 02. Any idea what year the drum was changed to allow it if it was before 2000?

Offline turboprop

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #41 on: March 13, 2019, 03:32:00 PM »
Turbo, do you know off hand what changes were made to the 02 and up drum? My 01 Road King shifts to neutral from 2nd. Part number for that ends in 00. So was a 2000 up part. Assuming until 02. Any idea what year the drum was changed to allow it if it was before 2000?

I suggest you look at some pictures of the drums. The differences will be obvious. Ebay is a good source for images. FWIW, I have never paid attention to weather one of my transmissions would shift into neutral second. Honestly, and being a prick, that's a functionality that I dont give a shit about. Look at the drums. The differences will be obvious.
'Trying to teach pigs to sing is a waste of time and annoys the pigs'

Offline ecir50

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #42 on: March 13, 2019, 03:38:04 PM »
most notably its hollow and lighter.

Offline cheech

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #43 on: March 13, 2019, 09:25:00 PM »
Turbo, do you know off hand what changes were made to the 02 and up drum? My 01 Road King shifts to neutral from 2nd. Part number for that ends in 00. So was a 2000 up part. Assuming until 02. Any idea what year the drum was changed to allow it if it was before 2000?

I suggest you look at some pictures of the drums. The differences will be obvious. Ebay is a good source for images. FWIW, I have never paid attention to weather one of my transmissions would shift into neutral second. Honestly, and being a prick, that's a functionality that I dont give a shit about. Look at the drums. The differences will be obvious.
But he does, so in his interest my question was in regards to why should he  limit his search to the 02 and up drum. And right it's not a big spread in years and the old number has been superseded to the 02 suffix. But if someone says hey I got a drum out of my 01 I'm going to throw out and it fits the functionality he wants. Is there a reason to turn it down?

Offline turboprop

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #44 on: March 14, 2019, 05:25:43 AM »
Turbo, do you know off hand what changes were made to the 02 and up drum? My 01 Road King shifts to neutral from 2nd. Part number for that ends in 00. So was a 2000 up part. Assuming until 02. Any idea what year the drum was changed to allow it if it was before 2000?

I suggest you look at some pictures of the drums. The differences will be obvious. Ebay is a good source for images. FWIW, I have never paid attention to weather one of my transmissions would shift into neutral second. Honestly, and being a prick, that's a functionality that I dont give a shit about. Look at the drums. The differences will be obvious.
But he does, so in his interest my question was in regards to why should he  limit his search to the 02 and up drum. And right it's not a big spread in years and the old number has been superseded to the 02 suffix. But if someone says hey I got a drum out of my 01 I'm going to throw out and it fits the functionality he wants. Is there a reason to turn it down?

For the sake of everyone following this discussion, why dont you post some pictures of the various year groups. Then we can talk. You have do a little work yourself.
'Trying to teach pigs to sing is a waste of time and annoys the pigs'

Offline Dan89flstc

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #45 on: March 14, 2019, 03:41:49 PM »
 
most notably its hollow and lighter.
The main difference is the roller detent feature to hold it in gear. 

The change came out on 2000 Softails, 2001 for the rest of the Big Twins.

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Offline cheech

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #46 on: March 14, 2019, 04:43:05 PM »
Turbo, do you know off hand what changes were made to the 02 and up drum? My 01 Road King shifts to neutral from 2nd. Part number for that ends in 00. So was a 2000 up part. Assuming until 02. Any idea what year the drum was changed to allow it if it was before 2000?

I suggest you look at some pictures of the drums. The differences will be obvious. Ebay is a good source for images. FWIW, I have never paid attention to weather one of my transmissions would shift into neutral second. Honestly, and being a prick, that's a functionality that I dont give a shit about. Look at the drums. The differences will be obvious.
But he does, so in his interest my question was in regards to why should he  limit his search to the 02 and up drum. And right it's not a big spread in years and the old number has been superseded to the 02 suffix. But if someone says hey I got a drum out of my 01 I'm going to throw out and it fits the functionality he wants. Is there a reason to turn it down?

For the sake of everyone following this discussion, why dont you post some pictures of the various year groups. Then we can talk. You have do a little work yourself.
I made no request for you to do any work for me or on the subject! Hence the "off the top of your head".  So don't take it as such that I'm asking you to research for me! Was just a general ask as it seems you've researched the subject but not in regards to what he wants out of the newer drum and a little bit of curiosity on my part. So if you knew "off the top of your head", seems simple. If you don't know you don't know, I for one don't and as I haven't got any need to do what he's trying to obtain got no real work to do. If I was Id for sure research it and share with the class.

Offline ecir50

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #47 on: March 14, 2019, 07:31:23 PM »
Here is the numbers I had on hand when did the hollow drum swap.

shifter drum (HD 33383-02)
shifter mechanism  (HD 34972-02B)
shifter mechanism sleeve  (34979-00)
gear selector centering screw (HD 34978-00A)
neutral switch (33904-00A) normally open, white one.

Recently took it out, playing with a N1 and a Pingel right now.

Good BAKER Gearheads video on the neutral switch.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48MefjRh97c

Jims Shifter Shaft Sleeve Tool 1664
http://www.jimsusa.com/pdf/instruction-sheets/1664-IS.pdf






Offline kd

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #48 on: March 14, 2019, 07:37:05 PM »
I think the N1 solves all of the problems finding neutral and ordered it in my GrudgeBox.
KD

Offline JW113

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Re: 2nd to Neutral
« Reply #49 on: March 15, 2019, 01:09:04 PM »
FWIW, I have no problems finding neutral on any of my bikes. Even with an Ironhead! The point of my complaint with the Evo 5 speed is how to get into neutral. Can only be done from 1st, whereas any of the other four bikes I own can be done easily and reliabily from 2nd.

I get it, this is no big deal to many/most people, to have to shift into 1st to get into neutral. The absolute primary reason I hate that is because I'm a big city boy, ride daily to work and back through 25+ stoplights, some of them very long. I'm not one to sit at a 2-3 minute stop light holding the clutch in, so I pop into neutral, preferably as I roll up to the stop. Which, 99 times out of 100, is in 2nd gear. So why shift to 1st to simply get in to neutral? Clearly Harley-Davidson agrees, as all of their big twin bikes since 2000 allows you do get from 2nd to neutral (as did the Shovelhead 4speed before it). It's the Evo 5 speed that does not. And I have no idea how the Evo Sportster 5 speed trans does, but the Ironhead 4 speed also goes easily from 2nd to neutral.

-JW
2004 FLHRS   1977 FLH Shovelhead  1992 FLSTC
1945 Indian Chief   1978 XL Bobber