Burns Stainless Exhaust Headers

[Just Nick]

Looks like the saddlebag mount/guard is a little close. What years will they fit? And I too would like to see a dyno chart/engine specks on build. I would love a burns on my build but at that price I need some more info

[strokerjlk]

Hey guys, here is a teaser.  This is the first article off our production tooling.  Should be shipping the big inch pipe (117+) in about 4 weeks.

beautiful.would love to try it against my wegner  on the dyno and the track. has to be 5-6 lbs lighter

[qtrracer]

Think they have so many sold already it doesn't matter.

[vincer77]

The problem with dyno sheets for these kind of pipes is what engine do we test it on?  Many of these big builds are custom, so if we test well on one, the same pipe may not be optimum for another.  So should we cherry pick?

What we have done to help the situation is that the primary length of the pipes can be adjusted based on your build. The pipes therefore can be made to be the same specs as Ray's, if you have Ray's engine build.

The pipes as shown are at the longest primary length, about 36".

[pwmorris]

The problem with dyno sheets for these kind of pipes is what engine do we test it on?  Many of these big builds are custom, so if we test well on one, the same pipe may not be optimum for another.  So should we cherry pick?

What we have done to help the situation is that the primary length of the pipes can be adjusted based on your build. The pipes therefore can be made to be the same specs as Ray's, if you have Ray's engine build.

Agree-
As long as the pipe also clears the S&S motors at cam cover, and not just HD stuff, and is set up  primary wise with a few different specs for the bigger motors (Built Harley 117, 120R Harley, S&S 124, 26, 43), this could be a big HP winner...
A guy could then pick a pipe based on motor size and what if any mods have been done to it, that should be really close to optimum for his build that should put a smile on his face.

[Jonny Cash]

The problem with dyno sheets for these kind of pipes is what engine do we test it on?  Many of these big builds are custom, so if we test well on one, the same pipe may not be optimum for another.  So should we cherry pick?

What we have done to help the situation is that the primary length of the pipes can be adjusted based on your build. The pipes therefore can be made to be the same specs as Ray's, if you have Ray's engine build.

The pipes as shown are at the longest primary length, about 36".

sent you an email.

[q1svt]

The problem with dyno sheets for these kind of pipes is what engine do we test it on?  Many of these big builds are custom, so if we test well on one, the same pipe may not be optimum for another.  So should we cherry pick?

What we have done to help the situation is that the primary length of the pipes can be adjusted based on your build. The pipes therefore can be made to be the same specs as Ray's, if you have Ray's engine build.

The pipes as shown are at the longest primary length, about 36".

Okay, but you had to design the pipe to a specific build... share those details, the dyno sheet will show how/where the build made power, and anybody with knowledge of the build components can get a better idea how the pipe did... 

Also, how they might want to change the length too for their build.

Otherwise why would someone drop the $$$ for your HD pipes [yes BSS has a great reputation], when they can get the info from a company like Wegner?


edited: where these pipes ever dyno tested to refine their design/performance? or just computer software designed and the bike pictured was for fitting only?

[strokerjlk]

Can you show us something with this pipe that is pulling to 6600-6700 rpms ?

[1FSTRK]

The problem with dyno sheets for these kind of pipes is what engine do we test it on?  Many of these big builds are custom, so if we test well on one, the same pipe may not be optimum for another.  So should we cherry pick?

What we have done to help the situation is that the primary length of the pipes can be adjusted based on your build. The pipes therefore can be made to be the same specs as Ray's, if you have Ray's engine build.

The pipes as shown are at the longest primary length, about 36".

That should not be a problem for you it should be your strongest selling point over the mass produced pipe that only fits one particular engine perfect.
You do what we all do; you post the dyno run with all the information on the engine the test was done on.
As for the cherry picking that is what this is all about, finding the best combination of parts to produce the desired outcome.

If you are saying that these pipes will be produced on a case by case basis then it should not matter what engine you pick to do the testing as long as you give the engine specs we can expect the optimum outcome for that combination. If you want to show the value of designing and producing the pipe tailored to the build, pick two engines at opposite ends of the spectrum and post both. If you are having trouble finding test engines I am sure there are more than enough volunteers here and many can provide back to back results from their current combination just as Ray did.

I have have no problem paying the price for a pipe that comes out of the box tailored to get the most from my engine. I would how ever hate to pay for the tailored pipe  and then have it not work or not work as good as the mass produced pipe that cost half the money.

[vdop]

Can you show us something with this pipe that is pulling to 6600-6700 rpms ?

love how it's looking.

[trex]

I would be interested for sure. Like to see a stage 1 for my 95in. Modello Heads, Wood cams Dyna

[jmorton10]

Hey Mike,

Did you quit racing??

~John

[Buffalo]

  Nice looking pipe!! Too bad they completely ignored the majority of responses to their questions about what everyone wanted. Almost everyone suggested the muffler had to end at or behind the saddlebags.
This pic sure doesn't come even close, right. Not for me!
I even added a 5 1/2 extension onto my Propipe to get the sound out from under the bag, along with a second mini baffle that actually added 2 1/2hp/2t. The echo from under the bag drove me nuts! fwiw Buffalo

[Admiral Akbar]

  Nice looking pipe!! Too bad they completely ignored the majority of responses to their questions about what everyone wanted. Almost everyone suggested the muffler had to end at or behind the saddlebags.
This pic sure doesn't come even close, right. Not for me!
I even added a 5 1/2 extension onto my Propipe to get the sound out from under the bag, along with a second mini baffle that actually added 2 1/2hp/2t. The echo from under the bag drove me nuts! fwiw Buffalo

Maybe it's because they were looking for performance and not looks?   

[Nowhereman]

You  drop coin like that for a pipe you have to put together, your looking specifically at performance.
For me, form always follows function when it comes to performance.

[pwmorris]

  Nice looking pipe!! Too bad they completely ignored the majority of responses to their questions about what everyone wanted. Almost everyone suggested the muffler had to end at or behind the saddlebags.
This pic sure doesn't come even close, right. Not for me!
I even added a 5 1/2 extension onto my Propipe to get the sound out from under the bag, along with a second mini baffle that actually added 2 1/2hp/2t. The echo from under the bag drove me nuts! fwiw Buffalo

Maybe it's because they were looking for performance and not looks?   

When JBV was thinking about doing a bagger pipe, after testing, the pipe was decided that it should end somewhere close to where this pipe ends.

As far as dyno sheets, they would have to R&D and have a variety of big motor bikes at their disposal to test with as mules on their dyno. Or find bagger guys to send them their pipes and have them test their pipe on Dynos (and log all data, retune to the new pipe, etc) that have the motors these pipes as designed for.
Obviously, there are plenty of pipes available for stock or lightly modified baggers to choose from.

They would need minimum to have at their disposal in house as mules, or send to someone who will back to back dyno test (risky)-

-A built 117" (or 120R, or crate 124" S&S) or other bagger with production pipe currently making around 130 hp.
-A built 124" or crate 126" S&S making 145-160 hp.
-A built 126" or crate 143" S&S making + or - 170 hp or more.

They could then be real close hp wise, to confidently sent someone a specific set up pipe to really rip.
Otherwise, they could build a pipe with dimensions that are close, and send it to someone, but some hp may be left on the table.

[02roadcling]

Hey Mike,

Did you quit racing??

~John

Did you miss hearing/reading about his terrible crash several years ago?

   cling

[Just Nick]

Hey Mike,

Did you quit racing??

~John

Did you miss hearing/reading about his terrible crash several years ago?

   cling

I did. Did he make it out ok ? I assume he Quit racing after

[strokerjlk]

I am not at all running the pipe down . I have seen diff variations work and work good .
In the case of this specific pipe , just show me ANYTHING . Let me see both ends of the tuning ability. Show the tuning ability of the pipe on any build ( short/ long)  Give the specs on the build , I can figure the rest out.
IMO the pipe has to be able to pull high rpms and make hp . Otherwise you won't fill the need hp guys are looking for .
Every week ,I discuss a 160 + hp build with someone .
It always comes down to the pipe . I don't have any answers for them at this point, short of a custom pipe . And about 3 % want to do that .
Build them a pipe that will pull rpms , they will come

[TorQuePimp]

  Nice looking pipe!! Too bad they completely ignored the majority of responses to their questions about what everyone wanted. Almost everyone suggested the muffler had to end at or behind the saddlebags.
This pic sure doesn't come even close, right. Not for me!
I even added a 5 1/2 extension onto my Propipe to get the sound out from under the bag, along with a second mini baffle that actually added 2 1/2hp/2t. The echo from under the bag drove me nuts! fwiw Buffalo

  Seems burns wants to stick with one design (length/diameter) of muffler and it also seems they aren't interested in making the system long enough for those that actually ride the bikes/tour.

  Maybe there will be another version 

[jam65]

They are a Race exhaust company. If you want the most out of your build, you should look into an all out pipe to fit the bill. I don't think they are interested in making pipes for the daily rider as there is already a market for that. Burns hangs their hat on making competition exhaust products.

[TorQuePimp]

They are a Race exhaust company. If you want the most out of your build, you should look into an all out pipe to fit the bill. I don't think they are interested in making pipes for the daily rider as there is already a market for that. Burns hangs their hat on making competition exhaust products.

  That was truly helpful....I own a coulple grand worth of Burns collectors and mufflers

  so I know exactly who they are and what they do.

  Back to reality....and what was stated they were going to build

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  This is Vince with Burns Stainless, http://www.burnsstainless.com the exhaust guys.  NoCents suggested that I post here to get some feedback for a project we are undertaking.  We will be prototyping a production exhaust header for the high performance HD market - specifically baggers.   

We are planning a 2-1 system, and later develop a 2-2 system (with X-pipe). We expect a Stage 1 (stock to ~110) and a Stage 2 pipe (up to 124).   They will be 3-step designs, 304SS (US mill) and TIG welded with our reverse cone megaphone mufflers, very similar to the pipe NoCents built for his 124.

The 2-1 design is gaining a lot of respect of late in the HD market.  In fact Wolfgang Grasser just took three first place, and one third place finishes at he Wyotech Shootout using our 2-1 merge collectors with reverse cone megaphones.

So I have a couple questions for you guys:

1.  Would you guys be interested in an exhaust for built motors?
2.  What would you be willing to pay for a high quality system?
3.  Do you think there is a market for both 2-1 and 2-2?
4.  This may be a difficult questions, but would like to get a feel for how much you guys mod your engines.  That is, do you just install cams, cams and a big bore kit or go directly to 117 and 124 builds.
5.  We are prototyping on a 2010 Road Glide TRX.  Does this make sense for the bagger market?
6.  Do you have any general comments?

Your help is appreciated!

Cheers,

Vince

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  Nothing "racing" about the application

  The pipe was supposed to be for a touring bike

   Lots of suggestions were made....mainly that it extends beyond the bag

  If you want a loud droning pipe hanging  under the bag.....mission accomplished 

 

[q1svt]

  Thanks for getting the thread back on track...

[No Cents]

 We are all guessing at what Burns final products will be. One spy picture and everybody is jumping to conclusions.
Until we see the final released versions...we can only keep speculating.
  I hope Vince listened to what guys were asking for as far them wanting a pipe that would go to the end of the bags. Most guys I feel would want this.
I do agree they are a performance exhaust company and this is entering uncharted waters here for them to offer a direct bolt on system.
We know the quality will be outstanding and as far as off the shelf performance goes...that remains to be seen. It will take dyno time to show these results. I'm sure plenty of people would offer up their bikes as test mules. I got one sitting out in the barn...if Vince wants to send me a pipe to have dyno tested for them.
  Todays exhaust market is vast with people wanting different options. Their willingness to offer a product to suit both ends of the spectrum is going to be their best bet I would think.

Ray

[jam65]

Sorry to get things off track. I don't have a bagger and I was just thinking that whatever length and diameter a exhaust system needs to be for all out performance, that is the system I want. No compromises.