113 or 127 in an 85 FXEF EVO ????

[Reddog74usa]

Anybody do this before? Any areas to beef up or modify?

[ecir50]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2lo9dftd9Q

[Ohio HD]

Clutch for sure. I'd go Barnett Scorpion or Bandit. Don't know if anyone makes a better clutch basket for that bike. But if it's not beat on, will probably be fine.

[thumper 823]

I think you need to do better with the question..
I am guessing increase the displacement?
Are you using stock EVO cases?

[turboprop]

Anybody do this before? Any areas to beef up or modify?

Have not done this, and dont know anyone that has, but I have done a bunch of work on an old evo FXEF. Not a lot of room for a taller engine in there. Especially for the rear cylinder. Anyone that has ever worked on a stroker shovel head will know what I am talking about.

The primary drive case on that bike uses the older style of starter and a keyed transmission main shaft. Weak at best. Not sure if '85 had the newer evo style brakes yet or not. Either way, the shovel and evo front disk brakes were pitiful. If you do squeeze in on of these engines, those brakes should be looked at. I also think that had a measly 22 amp charging system, it too should be reevaluated. Lets not forget that oil tank. Who knows what is in it; it too should be looked at very closely.

Have fun with that old bike. Peeling back a layer of the onion can be fun, or not.

[capn]

There is a member on here gryphon who has a 120 ultima in a four speed frame.

[Deye76]

Reddog you've been around  , most of this stuff you know, but in case you forgot, gonna need a good battery & starter. If the compression is 10:1, or thereabouts you should be OK with OE starter and battery if their in good health. I use a lithium iron battery and the stock starter, and extra plate Energy One clutch in my 113" FXR. Although I haven't beat on it yet, it shows no signs of problems in roll on's to red line. 

[Reddog74usa]

Am thinking about having some fun with the bike and just poppin in a 113 ultima on the cheap and just wanted to see if anyone else has done this on one of these and see what else they did to make the bike reliable. The brakes are stock and in 85 they came thru with evo style calipers. For me the'll do for now. Was also interested in how the keyed mainshaft holds up on the trans. I may just keep it an 80 incher and go with J Sachs nice little evo set up. Probably the best bang for the buck and really don't need the 113 power stressing this old 4 speed evo frame, but it would be a lot of fun eh!!!!!!!!!! Here's a pic of the bike

[turboprop]

I know a bunch of guys that have put engines with similar output into early FXRs with the keyed main shaft. Seems like they have all had issues with the keyway in the shaft or hub.

Interesting tidbit. Before Delkron trans cases dried up, I built a bunch of transmissions for the FXR crowd. Usually the owner would send me a gear set from a newer TC that they purchased on ebay. Very few of those late model TC gear sets had a main shaft that was within spec. Of thirty or so sets, I may have seen two main shafts that were not condemned for being out of true. Just a hunch, but I would be very suspect of that '85 shaft.

[tmwmoose]

Yeah has far as the clutch is concerned you have the early wet clutch that had its problems especially with the keyway on the clutch hub they cracked real easy. A collar was and probably is still sold to address this , good enough for what your doing?
Boy you sure do have some sweet stock bikes   

[jsachs1]

Steve, I've done a dozen FXR bikes with Ultima engines over the years. Put in a good trans, and the hardest thing to find will be a good 2 into 1 pipe that will work with the engine, and foot controls. All else is normal stuff. 
John

[Deye76]

Steve, I've done a dozen FXR bikes with Ultima engines over the years. Put in a good trans, and the hardest thing to find will be a good 2 into 1 pipe that will work with the engine, and foot controls. All else is normal stuff. 
John

John, have you found a 2X1 that works good with a Ultima motor? (specifically a 113")

[BKACHE]

I put a 113" Ultima in when I had my '96 FXD bottom end redone. I then switched it for the shovel engine in my '82 FXRS. The 113 was .01" taller than the stock evo. That was no issue. I think the 127 is .1 taller.
The rear brake lever needed to move out 3/8 of an inch and the lever itself I ground down a bit to miss the nosecone. The clutch cable just barely fit on the right side of the engine between it and the down tubes. That prolly won't be an issue for you since I think the cable goes to the other side of the engine for you.
With the manual compression releases, the stock Prestolite starter did just fine to start the FXRS.
The clutch was not a fair fight at all. The 3 finger did not ever hook up on Vanocker canyon. Once back I put a pro-clutch in it. Just spent the money for the pro-clutch.  Picture of the FXRS #168 and #171 in the 'show your FXR' thread.

[Reddog74usa]

Thanks for the info. I do have a Pro Clutch on the shelf. Did you stay with the tapered shaft? and how well did it hold up? I don't do burnouts (at least from a stop) and I'd like to zip this bike up a bit with a 113 but if I'm going to have to spend tons of cash to modify everything to support it I may save it for something simpler but if it's doable by just using most of the parts I already have I may just take the plunge. It would be different and one hell of a sleeper.

[BKACHE]

I did stay with the tapered shaft. Beside that the left side of the engine is pretty unchanged. Maybe grind case to sit if you have mid controls. (As the saying goes "beat it to fit - paint it to match") The kicker will be an issue with what pipes you put on. The 624 cam that is stock in the 113" sure did honk!

[Reddog74usa]

Yep I had a Ultima 113 in an FXR with Sachs heads  on it and a bored Super G with a Bassani RR. Made 139.8 HP and like 133 TQ with that Ultima cam, and yes it did haul the mail.

[jsachs1]

Steve, I've done a dozen FXR bikes with Ultima engines over the years. Put in a good trans, and the hardest thing to find will be a good 2 into 1 pipe that will work with the engine, and foot controls. All else is normal stuff. 
John

John, have you found a 2X1 that works good with a Ultima motor? (specifically a 113")

IIRC, I had to usually modify or relocate forward controls, or rear brake master cylinders, and linkages. Also had to make pipe brackets to support the collector, as well. Some Dyna exhaust set ups will work as a starting point. Also Bassani
John

[BKACHE]

As I recall the top engine support bracket did not work. I ordered a chrome (ooohhh chrome!!!) one and got out the VBFH and 'lightly tapped' the bracket into the proper angle. The rear brake master needed the leading edge to come out to be in line with the pushrod - washers. The top bracket on the transmission needed to be fabricated with my hacksaw and grinder and drill. I did need to make a few exhaust brackets too like John had mentioned. The one weekend swap in my garage turned into a few weekends, but if you have 'another bike' in the mean time you should be good to go.
   

[Burnout]

Dudes!  An FXE is not even a close relative of an FXR. 

An FXE has basically a 4 speed frame.

A big EVO will not fit any better than a big Shovelhead did in that frame. Anything with tall cylinders is going to require some frame work.

A big bore short stroke EVO will fit fine. Think 4 X 4=100", or you might be able to get more stroke with some short pistons. I know a 4 X 4 will fit.

[BKACHE]

You are absolutely correct an FXE* is quite different that a FXR* or FXD frame.
An evo did fit in the frame stock. So if the Ultima folk are to be believed the .01" taller should fit too at the top. The nose cone is a bit wider to the right ankle side of the FXE*. But if a 4" bore will fit - it should slide in.

[Reddog74usa]

Ya'll do know the 85 FX frames were modded to be taller by the factory to fit the taller Evo don't you???

[Ohio HD]

This is an '85 Evo 4 speed. Not tons of room above the rear cylinder.


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[Burnout]

Ya'll do know the 85 FX frames were modded to be taller by the factory to fit the taller Evo don't you???

I used to know this stuff, not sure about a taller frame for the EVO 4 speeds.
I'm not sure a stock EVO is taller than a Shovel.
Anything over 100 inches is going to be a tall motor, even a 96 or 98" 3 5/8 motor is going to be tall.

I am certain a 4 X 4 100 inch motor will fit though. Might be hard to find the parts to make one anymore.
I don't recall who made them....

First the memory goes.....

[Mark222]

Yep, the '85 FXEF from the factory has a taller frame opening since the Evo was taller than the 80" Shovel.  I once knew for certain, but I can no longer remember if it was 1/2" or 1" taller......

Mark

[mp]

The factory did not modify a 4sp frame to fit the Evo.  Since it already fit the Evo, they modified the softail frame to fit the 4sp swingarm for the '85-'86 FXEF, FXSB and FXWG models.