Real Life Evo longevity examples

[Iron Cowboy]

I asked a couple different dealers in my area if I should replace my tappet rollers etc. as preventative maintenence being that the ol 90 heritage is at 50k and never been opened up (except for base gaskets) and I want it to last as long as I can.
They both told me Harley says the evo is a 100k motor and no need to fix what aint broke. Now I know about the guys that have done it for peace of mind and have heard the horror storys of failures but am wondering about those that havent?  I would like to hear from evos owners that have left the motor stock and how long they have made it without any problems, along with any longevity rules to live by or tips that help? I guess you could call it my "cheap peace of mind attempt"  Thanks

[fxr4mikey]

what does the service manual call for ??

[Iron Cowboy]

yea, good question....dont have one, thats why I asked the service dept. guess i'm not to worried about what the manual says but just wanted peoples own experiences

[fxr4mikey]

yea, good question....dont have one, thats why I asked the service dept. guess i'm not to worried about what the manual says but just wanted peoples own experiences

OK, you're gonna make me go look ..... have to go to the garage ..... I'll be back





EDIT:
I'm back .... I didn't find anything in the manual that specifies any 'mileage' at which time to replace the lifters.

Whut I did find is the 'wear specifications' for the lifters.

for the FXR 2, 3 and 4 the specs are:

Guide fit in the crankcase (loose) 0.000 - 0.004 inches

Fit in guide (loose) 0.0008 - 0.002 inches



Now, I have only a GUESS as to where those measurements would be taken .....  

I would 'assume' that the first one would be how the lifter block fits in the crank case

I would 'assume' that the second one would be how the lifters fit in the lifter block




sooooooooooooooo  for me, I guess I'll just replace them about every 50 - 100K miles .... maybe ..... or when/if I change my cam

[choseneasy]

I know people have gotten more miles out of lifters but I would say it is a good time to change.  You will get an easy 100,000 miles out of a stock evo if you don't beat the living sh$t out of it. Worst thing about your motor is the weak crankcase insert on the sprocket side-- but all you can do is ride it til it fails( if it ever does) anyways.

[stroker800]

   Lets face it ,,,all motors are not created identical to each other,,they are assembled by humans,,made from human made parts for a company tryin to make more money each year..I have seen the evo with 425k  on it,,only replaced friction parts..There is no doutb you can get 100k outta stock motor,,they make 46-49 hp,engine warm ups and oil changes,,,,I belive these engines fail do to human error and sub par parts from contractors,,,BUT also HD's engineering and cutting costs..Lets admit it,,if they built the motor with power and longevity ,,,there would be no "screamin eagle" parts to sell..
Dave

[Dan89flstc]

I would change the lifters, the old design lifters have a history of failing at the rollers. The guys at the dealership won`t know this because they were in High School when Evos were being sold...

Also, if the front belt pulley is the original type, I recommend you replace it with the upgraded pulley,nut,lock and spacer. The pulley that came on the evos until 94 had a poor locking system for the nut and they had a habit of coming loose.

[Reddog74usa]

Had a Bro that got 100K out of his 89 heritige. never even did the base gaskets but they weep a little. Only mods were a S&S shorty and drag pipes. He kept the stock ignition. He rode it hard but never abused except a few times and always changed the fluids on shedule using H-D lubricants. he bought new in 89 as a left over and only had one issue with it  (Stator burned up). Sold it a year ago and it was still running good. He wanted to see how much he could get out of the bike. I'd say he did good getting 100 K miles, 20 years of ridding and all for just a total out lay of 2300 bucks when you consider what he paid and then what he got for it when he sold it. And yes the original lifters were still in it. 

[64 Panhead]

   Hi ALL,  I have a 1997  EGC  with 83,000 miles on it an never apart,  use Mobil 1  15/50 oil an change 3000 - 4000 miles,  Love that Motor an the sound of it,  everything is STOCK an plan to Ride it for Many a Years....   64   

[evo58]

a great lifter enemy to short the lifter life its stiffer valve springs, the stock ones are nice and easy on valve train.
stronger springs can destroy the little rollers and make a side force on the lifters guides, and loose the rocker bushings,
thats a trade off;
Evo 

[Norton Commando]

I have a '90 Evo and changed the original lifters at 50,000 miles and found that the needle bearings had a bit of slop in them. They probably could have run longer but why push it.

The original '90 pulley, as Dan pointed out, was a piss-poor design. I replaced it at 30,000 miles; the new pulley design is much better. Also, the steel insert on the drive side of the engines case separated from the surrounding aluminium some time ago. The fix is to replace the engine case, which is big $$$. So, if you manage to stretch the life of your lifters you haven't gained much in the grand scheme of things because you'll have to replace engine cases and transmission pulley at some point. 

[tinkerman]

Guys,

What's the year range for the steel insert you are discussing. I have know about the tranny pulley issue for awhile...just haven't had the inner primary off or I would have replaced it....probley will do a ratio change when that item comes up...but would also like to know how far back the steel insert issue goes as I run an 88 Heritage.

Sorry, not intending to hi jack the thread,

Tink

[Caper]

FWIW,in the book 101 harley performance projects it says 86-90 were the years with the insert issue.

[Scooter Trash]

I'd chip in $.02 on the high miles on EVO and say on top of the lifter issue is to pay attention to the $6 cam bearings. Some of the mid 90's did not posess the Torrington bearings. Though HD says these bearings are quite accepptable (easier to set pinion/cam gear mesh) they do not last near as long as Torrington bearings..... I learned first hand whe one grenaded in my motor.

[guido4198]

The motor in my '85 got to 125,000 before doing the top end and replacing the roller tappets, cam, etc. At that time, we found 2 broken valve springs..have no idea when they "went",,she was still starting fine, and running alright ( for me...) when I went for the top end, but compression had degraded, and it was Winter in Nebraska....
After the Top End...she went on to 185,000 before the cam bearing area in the engine case started to crack and come apart a bit. Went for a new '99 crate motor at that point.

[Beave]

I left my 86 stock and went 120,000 before I replaced the original cam, lifters and rings.  The cam lobes and inner bearing journal were showing a lot of wear.  The front pulley only went 35,000 and the main bearing case insert came loose at 230,000.  After I put a high lift cam and springs in it lifter life dropped to 25,000.  I sleeved the case insert and I am still running them at 290,000 miles.

[lowriderglen]

A friend of mine that lives in Charlotte NC has a 90' Heritage that rolled over 100,000 last month. The motor is all original and he has no plans to open it up as it runs just fine...

[tinkerman]

So how much of the "problems" associated with HD bikes, especially drivetrain are the result of modifications and not the result of poor design....unless you consider the original HP/Torque figures poor design.



tink

[hd06myway]

I went over 80k on my lifters in my '89 Softail and just changed them for peace of mind.  My indy shop guy said they should be changed every 25-30k.  I got over 124k miles on that motor and only had the top end off once for gaskets.  I traded it in for my current '06 Softail, but it was running fine at 124k. I put wisco 10:5.1 pistons in, .005 over since we cleaned the cylendars up when the top end was off. They measured a mear .003 over.  Had a bearing in the tranny replaced when I starte dhearing some noice around 100k, didn't need to replace any gears in it, it looked fine otherwise.  Stock motor other then a EV3 cam, dyno'd at 69HP - 80TQ.  Great motor those EVOs.

[Scooter Trash]

I really liked my EVO when I had her. Yeah, you work on them a bit and they lasted along time. I like them more than the twin cam. At the time, the name of the game when riding is torque and not HP for MOST people. Mine had the 10.5:1 pistons, EV4 cam, 42 Mikuni, Bub true dual exhaust and a SE ignition module. The ignition module, I could have done with out. There was not that many times with a dresser did I need to wrap the engine up over 5 grand, but I could of if I wanted!
I was just fortunate enough to ride side by side with my bud that bought my old bike for 3000 miles to Sturgis and back. It still runs strong and true sans a starting problem here and there. It holds it's own against my 07' Ultra, though I like newer bike's gas milage and I do use the cruise, radio, CB etc on the newer bike.
Keep them old EVOs' running!!

[Reddog74usa]

If I had to R&R lifters every 25K I would not ride that particular bike or engine design. Sounds like someone is fishin for some work. I tend to ride hard, do performance mods and have always put way more than 25K on a scoot  and never had a problem with lifters because I didn't change em out that just sounds like Bull to me. 

[harleytoprock]

    I had a lifter roller fall apart at 23k. It wrecked lots of other things. I think its a good idea to change lifters.

[Reddog74usa]

Anything is possible and parts can be defective however changing out lifters every 25K just seems a bit over kill but hey who am I to stop folks from changin em if ya want. 

[strokerjoe]

it would be a real drag if you changed out lifters just because at 25,000. and the new ones what ever brand fall apart.

[MiketheBike]

All steel insert mains cases can fail.  This type of failure has been known to occur even in shovels but it only became very common in the 89 and 90 evo's where they would quite often fail during the warranty period.  Those bikes got new engine cases for free. Generally these engines failed in the first 25K.  The ones that didn't, usually lasted a very long time.  If you have a pre '89 or post 90 engine then I wouldn't worry about it if its not already a problem.  Same goes for '89 to 90 if you've got over 25K and its still good I wouldn't rush out to replace it. If your bike is running O.K. but engine oil is filling up the primary between oil changes then you might want to check whether this is a main seal or if the steel insert has become "porous".

While HD solved this problem in 91, all engines built between 91 and 94 had other crankcase issues and its advisable to leave these engines relatively stock.

As for the lifters, the early design lifters were prone to failure at around 30-50K.  That is, not every one failed but even if it was one in 20 you would not want to take the risk. And yes even some of the big axle lifters fail sometimes but this is rare. HD changed the design of the lifter in '96. I've never heard of one of these wearing out in a stock motor.  If you have a pre '96 EVO with 50K on the clock then I would change the lifters without question. And since you have them out replace the INA bearing with a torrington (making sure that you check the cam shaft alignment and ream the case bush if necessary). On stock motors use steel type adjustable pushrods. If you use aluminium rods make sure that the pushrod tubes have good clearance (grind the inside if necessary) - Its all a lot easier than it sounds. If you have a stock motor you shouldn't have to change them again for a very long time.  If you are using a non stock cam then the lift and ramp speed will determine the life of your valve train components. In these cases it is better to change out the lifters every 25K and change the cam bearing/check cam bush every 50K. The rocker pins also tend to wear out.

Just in case you wanted to hear "hey it will be fine - no need to touch that stock EVO".  Sorry can't help you.

Ride safe