Whats killing Harley Davidson

[odotb]

 I believe the resale value on Harley's will be the death of the motor company.
Case in point, Wifey says she would like to have a radio and that a new street glide would be nice. Took her 06 FLHRCI with 60 thou on it to get numbers run on a trade. Dealers wants $15,000 and her RK for a new stock street glide. This is same Dealer she bought the RK from. I tell him WTF, I realize her RK has 60,000 but it looks like a new one and has never been abused. He tells me "if you actually ride them, they aren't worth much". Well this just does it for me, I don't have the  money for this kind of depreciation. Maybe used Harley's in the future, but for sure no more new ones.

[bouncingVman]

Go some place else. Low retail value for a 06 FLHRCI is $11,185. Average retail is closer to $12,980. Those numbers are from NADA. You would have to expect less than low retail in my opinion, since the dealer has to resale and make a profit too... but it sounds like he was low balling the price.

my .02 worth.

[PineyJoe]

I most likely will never buy another new one, prices are way out of line, and like you said you can't get rid of them, I would like to sell my 02 RK for something else but with only 13,000 on it what am I going to get $8000 just gonna have to keep'er.

[One4Tone]

..sometimes ''It's cheaper to keep her"..I bought an 03 flht..I'd be lucky to get half today....at least i got the 100 year anniverssary..gotta feel sorry for the guys thay bought 02's..they paid heavy dollars ..as well...

[Scooterfish]

Based on MSRP for the Street Glide what are they giving you for the RK? Maybe $5000. In great shape with service records based on the NADA above you should be able to sell outright for $10,000. Bikes with alot of miles do seem to set on the dealers sales floor, probably because there is a simular bike with with low miles.

May have to get her an Ipod and ride the RK.

[Jeffd]

put a removeable fairing that has a radio on it.

[MikeL]

To all those people who bought bikes as investments it sucks to be you. You would have been better off investing that bike money in the stock market. For people like me this market gives me more opportunity to own a newer bike that I would never consider buying new. Thanks for flooding the market with your poor investment choices.

                                                                      MIKE

[crow]

I bought a Windshield Mount stereo for my Road King last spring. the OL and I hardly ever ride without tunes jamming now. Cost me $266 on E-Bay.   Here is sweet deal   http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Harley-detachable-road-king-windshield-with-radio_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem4ceeab7b60QQitemZ330421730144QQptZMotorcyclesQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories  Or a new one  http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MOTORCYCLE-RADIO-FATBOY-ROAD-KING-SOFTAIL-YAMAHA-HARLEY_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem563ab7793dQQitemZ370352290109QQptZMotorcyclesQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

[L-]

Mike,

What do you consider a newer bike? 

L-

[MikeL]

2000 and up L so I got lots of choices.


                                                                     MIKE

[lonegoosehonking]

 If you have been riding HD for a long time, you know that history repeats itself. Everyone thinks its the economy. I think those people are shitting themselves up. HD is just fading from popularity and the demographics of who is riding them is changing. Sure there are many of the faithfull that still ride . But Alot people are tired of getting raped by the dealers , and paying for bikes that are a little bit behind in the times. Now I love em but I still remember how in 99 a road king was going for $23500 in Dallas. I also remember my 99 at 32000 miles with a rod knocking and HD telling me oh well. So I guess its kind of hard for me to shed a tear for the dealers who were cashing in for so many years. I recognize the good dealers out there and have faith they will weather the storm because customer service is what brings business and sells bikes.

[panz4ever]

Doesn't matter if it is a car or bike, you go to a dealer to trade you will not get the price you want for your used bike. Sell it your self and then go in with cash to deal if you stuck on buying new. But as soon as you buy it it depreciates as soon as you take it out the door.

[Norton Commando]

HD is just fading from popularity and the demographics of who is riding them is changing.  

I agree... Today is the tomorrow that HD was worrying about yesterday; everyone, including HD, knew it was coming; it's no suprise.

[Blazing Saddles]

Mikel:    I couldn't agree more.  I own to ride.  I had a '92 FXSTC for 15 years and just sold it.
I'm now riding an '04 FXSTS that I bought last July with only 4K miles on it in 5 years.  The used market is full of great deals on bikes with next to no miles on them.  Bikes are intended to be ridden.  I do consider my bike as an investment - in adventure, fun and excitement.  I expect to pay for all the maintenance it needs as I roll up the miles and I know it will drop in value. There is absolutely no possibility of a capital gain  :hyst:or even holding par value.

Blazin'

[Deye76]

To all those people who bought bikes as investments it sucks to be you. You would have been better off investing that bike money in the stock market. For people like me this market gives me more opportunity to own a newer bike that I would never consider buying new. Thanks for flooding the market with your poor investment choices.

 

Well said.
"Whats killing Harley"?
No jobs here anymore. Even the yups are losing their jobs to greed.

[charley992002]

odotb,

When you trade you get approximately wholesale $$$ between rough and clean values.  Mileage and condition play a big part of what a given dealer will give as a trade-in allowance.  If you owe on the bike then the equation gets more in their favor.  For example the bike you mentioned, according to the latest NADA is $10375 for rough wholesale and $11565 for clean wholesale $$$.  The mileage average from current NADA for that year and displacement motorcycle is 24100 miles, you have 60000 miles.  I would guess that $8-9000 for trade-in allowance would be average.  Sorry mileage does affect the trade-in value, heaven help you if you owe on it also.

[deathwish]

lots of good reasons here but lets face it everyone was getting to much for their used bike. A bike that has 60,000 miles shouldn't be worth over half it's orig. price. It sucks but is fact. When you reach that point if you were the buyer, you'd be wondering if it has 5,000 miles left before a major problem or does it have another 60,000. Ride them and keep them and do the maintance. But you better get mechanical inclinded because haveing dealers do the work will break you.

[odotb]

Mikel,
  Don't know if you are referring to me or not, but did you notice the 60,000 miles on the 06 part. If I had wanted an investment, it damn sure wouldn't have been in  a motorcycle. Like my post said I'm through with new.

[gryphon]

The biggest thing hurting the MOCO right now is probably the reverse of what made them big. Most buyers weren't like odotb and his ol' lady who do obviously ride. For maybe a couple of decades most new buyers were buying a fashion statement or were convinced that buying an HD would make them a biker (kinda like buying a rope makes you a mountain climber). If you don't love to ride then the newness wears off fast. Now there are literally thousands of bikes out there with very low miles and thousands of dollars worth of accessories that were installed before the bike ever got mile one on it. Take a look at ebay. Right now there are over 2300 bikes listed. Of these, fewer than 300 were made before 1993. More than 1000 of those bikes are less than 5 years old and the majority of those have averaged well less than 3000 miles a year since new. Now check the completed listings. Very few of these bikes are selling. The market is full of bikes that are virtually new, with thousands of dollars in accessories. Unless the MOCO comes up with something that is substantially different, that is a vast improvement, and that cannot be retro-fitted, there is very little incentive to buy new.

[chopper]

at least i got the 100 year anniverssary..gotta feel sorry for the guys thay bought 02's..they paid heavy dollars ..as well...

   Yeah.. pity us poor 02 owners..

All we got was the lower NON anniv.price, Timken bearings, and better cranks.

[texaskatfish]

I stand (or sit) to be corrected............

The ONLY way to truly get one's MAX money's worth from darn near ANY vehicle (IMHO):
A. buy brand new and always trade for new 1 - 2 yrs MAX
OR
B. Buy new or used and ride or drive the wheels off

Any 'other' way and you're likely to wind up 'upside down' ......

[MikeL]

No odotb I didn't direct my reply to you at least you ride and a lot.
Now you have people dumping low mileage bikes on the market the poor investment types and are hurting guys like you who ride the piss out of them in a short time.
For me it would be a challenge to see how many miles I could acquire and keep it running in the process. Some people can't and they trade.
There's a lot of opportunity out there for the used bike buying public like me.

                                                                        MIKE

[marc]

Yup...I had a 99 95 inch Wide Glide with 45,000 miles on it and went to trade it in on a new 04 GeezerGlide and they wanted to give me a little over $10,000 for it...I said WTF and he said you have way to many miles on it...He showed me plenty of used newer bikes with much lower mileage on them...I sold it myself for about $2,500 more...Why own a bike if your not going to ride it...I guess I will have my GeezerGlide forever...

[starrider]

Hi guys...just chiming in. I am happy with my dealer. Have bought my 00 Heritage and 03RK from him...and still riding both. Don't think i need another one...However when ever i go to the store i try to think of something i might need...as they are good people and times are tough.

Reading and hearing  some of the dealers closing (posted here)...The ones that are planning on staying...buy them a beer 

[hogwilde1]

I have an 03, does this mean I can sell it and retire on my fourtune??

[hotroadking]

Never trade

Sell yourself
then buy a new one or used.

WIth the miles you put on a new one JMO would
be best, 2 year unlimited mileage warranty and
they are dealing....

[ksshovelman]

I'm pretty sure my '69 FL is worth much more than it was 40 years ago

[boooby1744]

Go some place else. Low retail value for a 06 FLHRCI is $11,185. Average retail is closer to $12,980. Those numbers are from NADA. You would have to expect less than low retail in my opinion, since the dealer has to resale and make a profit too... but it sounds like he was low balling the price.

my .02 worth.

Those "book" prices mean nothing.No one has money(ors not willing to part wth)  to buy bikes.My buddy and i bult a bike and are selling it for the cost of parts,8 months,no takers.In years past we made a few bucks and the bikes sold in weeks.

[RK101]

My 04 RK has 52+k on it and has never been in the shop for any kind of major repair. Maint. and minor repairs have been done by me. (Thanks to the members of HTT) I couldn't ask for a better bike. It might not be the fastest or the prettiest. It might show some character marks from being enjoyed and ridden, but Harley is not seeing another dime from me to buy a new bike. I could buy a new bike but I doubt I could get this lucky two times in a row. This old girl stays till the end,and like many others I've heard all the Harley hype a couple to many times before for it to mean anything. Some (not all) of there dealers and there arrogant attitudes have come full circle and is now biting them in the keester.  Riders who have been riding for a while are tired of it and saying Screw You. That's what IMO is killing Harley.

[FXDBI]

Went to the dealers on sat with a friend who is looking for a new bike. Dealer says 14,500 out the door and you get a $500 in store credit for a 2009 Dyna Superglide. I bought a new Street Bob in 2006 can buy a new 2010 for about $3500 less than I paid.  Used 2007 Dyna low rider with 21,000km, had a lot of Harley add ons stg1 with v&h short shots in very clean condition for 13,500 out the door. This is up in Edmonton,Alta Canada dealer is still moving  alot of bikes, our dollar is up and bikes are cheaper. They have a 2010 Road Glide with a 1 in 200 paint job bike looks just awesome 36,000 out the door bet it dont last a week. I bought mine to keep not really worried what its worth its paid for  and its mine. If I go buy a Geezer Glide I will keep the Dyna anyhow. Bikes are no differnt than a car come trade in time got a trade in your gonna get screwed on it.

[tyson1989]

I'm not an old school biker nor am I a yuppie.  I just love to ride.  In the early 90's, when I was still young and stupid, I was riding rice rockets.  Lots of fun to ride just don't do much more than 1/4 mile at a time or hop around town.  At that time the 90th Ann. bikes showed up, the local Harley shop also sold rice.  I sat on that 90th Fatboy and fell in love.  Told my GF now OL I was going to own a 100th ed. thinking I would have something. 

Got married had a kid 95 sold the rice, no place for the baby seat.  In 03 bought my Deuce, got rapped a couple times.

But fell in with an old school group, they have been riding since the early 80's.  Probably the best thing that ever happened to me.  Lost my investment mentality and started riding and really enjoying my time "in the wind".  Now I don't ride like you guys, only 22K on the Deuce, but I do my own work.  Even a couple cam changes and a carb change. 

Like was said earlier Harleys are loosing fashion again.  In the late 80's and early 90's rice rockets were cool around here.  When I got rid of mine in 95' I had to give it away. Now rockets are coming back--go figure. 

I look at it this way---When Harleys come back I can be the "old school" guy making fun of the yuppies.


Sorry for the long rant..

Eric

[Ed Y]

As mentioned in more than one place, avoid trade-ins at the dealer, sell it outright and buy either new or used. I started riding HD's in 1956. I've had more than a few over the years but to recap the last 20+, here's my story:

- bought a used 1982 Lowrider in 1987 off an ex-sailor (bike was bought new in Hawaii) for $1,000. Put a little TLC and a paint job on it. Sold it in 1988 for $4,000. Next month bought a 1988 FXSTS (# 255 of 1340) for $10,000. Rode it 10 years and put 91,000+ miles on it. Had it repainted due to a wreck and sold it in 1998 for $13,000. Bought a used 1992 FLSTC for $11,000, rode it for a year, sold it for $12,000. Bought a brand new 1999 FLHT in May of 1999 for $13,010. Rode it for 10 years, modified to 95" with gear drives and cams,  and put 132,000+ miles on it. Sold it in April 2009 for $9,500. Bought an 02 RG with 36,000 miles on it for $12,000. Bike is 95", headquarters heads, gear drive, fuel injected, chrome HD rims, chopped tour pak and cruise control. Great bike.

Overall, I think I've done pretty good by selling outright and shopping around for the new 1999 FLHT I bought. I've never had much trouble selling my used stuff because the TLC and maint I do on my bikes is well known in the local area where I live. Prior to 1987, it was easy to find decent shovels and even panheads for very little money so lots of buying and selling took place in those days.

And for the guy that's got an 03 and thinks it's worth more $$$ cause it's an anniversary model, I think you're gonna find out in the long run, that don't mean squat. JMHO

[fxstd_01]

" Yeah.. pity us poor 02 owners..

All we got was the lower NON anniv.price, Timken bearings, and better cranks."

Thank you Chopper!  I couldn't have said it better myself.

-jeff

[harleytoprock]

The present day image of the Harley rider is killing Harley. Younger people think Harleys are so uncool because the image is an "old fat guy". Don't throw rocks at me because I started riding in 1969 and still think Harley is the coolest thing on the planet. But thats the truth. AS this is what younger people have actualy told me. I really can't figure out why the Harley riders average age as gone up so much. When I was a kid there were plenty of guys in their 20's and 30's into Harleys now there is very very few in that age group. I think this is the first time in Harley's 100 year history that this has happened. Some say its because Harleys are not affordable to the young folk but I disagree as we had no money for new Harleys either. Thats why we bought old junk. And there is still cheap junk out there but the kids would rather just plunk down there money for a fast cheap rice rocket. I hate to say it but when us older folk are gone so will be Harley Davidson.

[CraigArizona85248]

I'm pretty sure my '69 FL is worth much more than it was 40 years ago

Yeah... I know my '49 panhead is worth more then the $750 sticker price from 61 years ago.   

I agree with harleytoprock... H-D is not attracting enough young buyers.  They have to get the 20-something crowd infected with the same bug we got.  I think they are starting to make some headway in this area.  In this part of the U.S. I'm starting to see a lot more men and women in the 20's riding H-D.  We'll see if it takes hold or just fizzles out.

-Craig

[ksshovelman]

The only new vehicle I have ever purchased in my life was a Jap bike. 

Reasons: 
1)  Less than $6000 (I think it was closer to $5000). 
2)  It resembled a Harley and the plastic was real shiny.
3)  Cheap monthly payments.
4)  Dealer was close.

[PoorUB]

I traded my '05 Ultra with close to 60,000 on a '10 Ultra. MSRP on the '10, no freight, no set up, they gave me $12,000 for the '05. I tried to sell the '05 for $14,000 and did not get one bite!

[starrider]

Here's a thought...it is these movies where the action heros are riding a space age rocket motorcycles.....just have to get more of these movie makers who help set the trend by making movies where the hero is lookin cool riding a Harley...02

[fxrp]

put a removeable fairing that has a radio on it.

Google Dragonfly Concepts

[preacher son]

Jeeze, way to much worry here. If your havin fun, forget the money. We all make good deals and bad deals, but when it

comes to the ride in the wind, screw the money. Do what you got to do and keep on keepin on. Ive lost bucks on every

bike i have owned, just chalk it up to good times.                  Dont Worry-Be Happy     

                                                               Preacher Son

[apes]

at least i got the 100 year anniverssary..gotta feel sorry for the guys thay bought 02's..they paid heavy dollars ..as well...

   Yeah.. pity us poor 02 owners..

All we got was the lower NON anniv.price, Timken bearings, and better cranks.

I've been sad since I read this....now what am I going to do with my 02 heritage and 02 ultra....I might as well leave them out at the curb all night with the keys in them, nobody wants them......I'm bummed

[CDeucer]

Yeah, my 02 walks away from all them new 96 inchers. Makes me sad. No wait....... makes them sad! 

[Ridetard]

Sometimes I think most of the folks here have lost or never related to what ths site is all about.  I have a biond with my bike, it is forever.  No intentions of trading her in or selling for that matter.  If I dont like it, I can paint it, rebuild it, do what I want to do to make it trully mine and not some 40 grand cookie cutter "made in China" harley.
Harleys has several problems to contend with.   Unavailability of credit, bikes over priced and engines that are cheep crap!
Have a good day.

[ksshovelman]

Ridehard,

As corny as it sounds, I understand what you are saying.  I have no intentions of selling my FL. I get the funds, I might buy a more comfy bike for those long hauls, but my ol' girl has a place in my heart and will always have a place in the stable when I'm not riding her.

As for prices of Harley's, chromed metal costs more than plastic.  I could not believe the amount of "chromed" plastic on that Honda I mentioned earlier.

[Flat Dog]

There is a glut of everything except for affordable health insurance in the market now. In my profession, everyone is now a photographer and charging 20% of what they really should just to make a trailer park living - the competition is worse than a Wal Mart chinese bidding war. With a glut of Harleys being sold off by yuptards as so many here have said, the trade in/used prices are crap. A wise fellow or two here had mentioned keeping that you ride, and I wholeheartedly agree. Too many great used private party bikes out there to dump a huge amount of cash on a stealer. It's fun restoring an old faithful scoot, too. I wouldn't get ride of my bike no matter how much people say the new frame designs are so great. I have a bond with that beast, and an 'easier' ride can't break that.


FWIW, I visited two local dealers, and was amazed at how many employees are now gone, and their inventory was at least half of what it was just a year ago. Seeing the poor tech at one place trying to get a dozen bikes wrenched made me cringe...

[JohnCA58]

I call my bike the  "perpetual money whore" and I enjoy it because it is the way I want it to be and ride.  It will never leave my stable.   

[harleyjt]

I have an 03, does this mean I can sell it and retire on my fourtune??

I just have to laugh when I think about what was going on in 02 and early 03.  Dealers were asking for huge deposits (and getting them) just to get on the list for an anniversary bike.   A lot of people early on thought the 03s would be very collectable so they spent big bucks on them, and then I've heard of a few that were squirreled away in garages so the value wouldn't be impaired.   LOL!!!!   They're a dime a dozen now! HD cranked up production and opened the floodgates with the 03 anniversary bikes - that's what killed the goose!  It was the final nail in the coffin of the Harley mystique.  Anyone could walk in and ride right out on a new Harley of their choosing - probably even in the color they wanted.  No waiting!   Such a deal!!! 
jt

[NETacomaFatboy]

my take is that this will work itself out soon, most likely later.  Dealers have not pushed the panic button yet.  Sales have dropped but they sticking to their old MO of dicking is on the trade value and holding the price of new & old bikes too high.   I am amazed that the 2 Dealers near me and still in business.  I guess sales of clothing is holding them up some.

[CraigArizona85248]

Sometimes I think most of the folks here have lost or never related to what ths site is all about.  I have a biond with my bike, it is forever.  No intentions of trading her in or selling for that matter.

I don't think HTT is about keeping your bike forever.  I think it's here as a knowlege base for all thing Harley (technical topics in particular).  BUT... I totally relate to what you are saying.  I will never sell my panhead (short of an act of God occurring that leaves me no other option).  The panhead has been my daily ride since before I joined HTT and will continue in that role into the forseeable future.  Maybe one day I'll add another bike, but the panhead stays.

-Craig

[GaryD]

I have an 03 Ultra and never expected it to be worth a lot of money ......those days were long gone, I bought it because of the color and I was in the market for a bike at that time. I really like the 105th copper color too, but I'm not going to buy one because my 03 is still going strong. And getting close to being out of work, I can't afford anything except that TowPac kit in a couple years.
I'd like a TriGlide, but won't spent $30k for any bike....I just bought a new car (GMC Terrain) and it cost LESS then the TriGlide. Go figure.

[Princess Butt]

The market forces at work are really playing hell with resale and trade in values. But, there is something to consider. Used bikes are now cheap, and someone can get a nice 5 -7 year old Dyna for less than a Japanese cruiser. Guess what's going to happen? There's a whole generation of riders and future riders in their 20's and younger; they'll be snagging up the bikes on the used market.

For me, I'm keeping what I have and not buying a new one. I think they can last a long, long time if you maintain them correctly and don't abuse them.

I've had my '97 Road King since new. When I bought it, I figured in a year or two, I could sell it for what I paid for it. Well, it's still my daily ride to work. I figure at this point, at over 80,000 miles and showing it's age, it's probably not worth much in trade.

Am I lamenting this? Absolutely not. It's been probably the best investment ever. It's worth 1/3 of what it cost new. But the memories and the enjoyment that bike has brought me are priceless. I can't replace the happy times, the good times, the misery of riding in the snow, or the freezing cold on the daily commute. That bike and I are inseparable.

Spare me the whining of lost money on an investment. Anyone who buys a mass produced item hoping it will be worth something is nuts. The market will eventually saturate with that item, and the manufacturer will stop making them. Another 50 years it may be worth something but by then, we're either dead or wishing we were.

This is an investment in fun. If you're not having fun, don't do it anymore, and go find something else.

[chaos901]

I recently traded-in my '02 EG Classic with 65,000 miles.  Did a little research and figured it was worth about $8,500.  That is pretty much what I got form the dealer. 

Can not complain.

[polarihog]

yup..I agree with chopper.. 02's were the best of the lot....

[runamuck]

I too have one of those '03 bikes. An e-glide that I bought used..I also still have my '01 wide glide that I bought new...thought about trading both in for an 09 or 10 e-glide. The truth is that they ARE hulking masses that mostly old guys like me can appreciate..the young guys think they look like crap and dont have enough power to get out of thier own way..HD will never sell these kind of bikes to the next generation..young guys passing me on the freeway at 95 arent planning any cross-country rides and dont have a wife sitting on the back snapping photos of the scenery and wont pay 20+k for a bike. I'm happy with both of my bikes. After us boomers (born in '47) are gone what is the market for HD going to be?

[Lew]

Want a laugh?

http://seattle.craigslist.org/search/mcy?query=Harley&catAbbreviation=mcy

[truck]

Want a laugh?

http://seattle.craigslist.org/search/mcy?query=Harley&catAbbreviation=mcy

Can you be a little more specific?

[Lew]

Thought checking out the asking prices for some/most of the scoots from this area would be a hoot.  Oh well...never mind..... 

[Kansas]

I agree with Gryphon 100%.  I bought my 2007 Dyna last season with low miles and it was about $10K cheaper than the new ST Deluxe I wanted with bags and a windscreeen.   For $10K savings I like my Dyna just fine.  Until the motor company comes up with a reason for me to consider coughing up the big money, a new bike is just a bad decision for me.

[deathwish]

They are really happy a lot of me don't exist. I will never buy a new Harley as long as I can build what I want. Not a lot of builders left but I get what I want. Even better than Harley parts and doing it myself it cost less. Resale-Notta-keeping them all forever

[getsthegrease]

Harley dying? Don't think so. They've been up, they've been down. Still here. I know when I finish paying this one off, I will get another. Just like bikes. It'll be brand-spankin'-new too. They're SHINEY.

[bouncingVman]

Just wait ... in 20 years the baby boomers kids will be buying Harleys. All of a sudden they will become cool to have, and the crouch rockets not so cool. History repeats itself.

[x52gnr]

I didnt buy my Harleys or any bike for that matter as a investment, I bought them to ride.....   The dividend is enjoyment, relaxation and clearing the mind.....

[GaryD]

x52gnr      

[Scooterfish]

I`m going to disagree on the 2003 models. I think they are a good investment and will be very valueable if held until 2103.Doing the math 93 years to go isn`t going to work out for me.

Trust me it`s a motorcycle not an investment.

[harleyjt]

I didnt buy my Harleys or any bike for that matter as a investment, I bought them to ride.....   The dividend is enjoyment, relaxation and clearing the mind.....

   
jt

[HroadhogD1]

    I didn't buy my Harleys for an investment either.  The fact that they were was just a plus.  There isn't to many things you can buy, and have a lot of fun with for 10 years, sell it and make money on.  I remember back in the Evo era, somebody was buying up a lot of older bikes, and selling them to the Japs. for a large profit.  That also thinned down the amount of bikes we had here in the U.S. and kept the demand up.  We would do good if that was to happen again.  If it did happen again we are without the older Harleys we like to see around.  Its not win, win.

   

[76shuvlinoff]

Jeeze, way to much worry here. If your havin fun, forget the money. We all make good deals and bad deals,......

And that's the truth.  Finally put a stablemate for the 76 (that I paid too much for) in the barn last year. An 09 (that I paid too much for) and from what I read here I should probably just scrap it.

puuleeease , What's killing Harley? Greed and the internet.  Go ride.

[chopper]

I read here I should probably just scrap it.

wanna "scrap it" my way, bro?     

[Hawg Holler]

I've got an 05 Road King. Including the cost of the bike, which I bought used in 06, I have spent an average of $5,400 a year in bike cost, upgrades and maintenance (fuel not included), most of which I do myself. A two week vacation just about anywhere will cost more than that. I have covered 60,000 miles on roads between Montana and San Diego and ride almost all year round. I have made many new friends and enjoy riding with them just about every weekend. I think I got a good deal even if the bike is worth $0 now. Nice thing is, the bike is still running great and I'm hoping to get 120,000 out of it before I have to rebuild the mill. My average cost will continue to go down every year. This is the only way to get all the value out of any vehicle.

If you trade every couple of years for a new one your taking it in the shorts on depreciation.

[Bladesmith]

I went to buy a new Harley in'06...the dealers price was much more then MSRP..I asked why and was told ,thats the suggested price..we can charge more so we do...I bought a used bike, an '06 with 1200 miles and lots of custom stuff for a whole lot less......This dealership just changed hands...hmmm

[GLFLSTCI02]

at least i got the 100 year anniverssary..gotta feel sorry for the guys thay bought 02's..they paid heavy dollars ..as well...

   Yeah.. pity us poor 02 owners..

All we got was the lower NON anniv.price, Timken bearings, and better cranks.

[wavlovr1]

Amazing what 10 years will do...

My 99 was wrecked in about one year (2000). The values were so high back then that I got almost every dime I had invested in it from Insurance, including add-ons and clothing...

Now they drop 20% just driving them off the Harley lot... But, hows your home value holding up? or your RV, boat, or even car? Unfair trade practices have led to one ugly fact; nothing is built in the US anymore. We are well on the way to becoming a third world country. At least I won't be alive to see it.

jb

[BKACHE]

overproduction

[classic]

Ya...poor 2002 owners... I paid RETAIL $16,900.00 for mine...some dealers were asking $22,000.00
does suck to know it's only worth $6,500.00 in trade. does have 60,000 miles, maybe I should have sat on it....NOT!!!!

[jmorton10]

I agree totally with the posters saying that kids don't think Harleys are cool anymore.

I remember in 1968 I wanted a Harley so bad I would have done almost anything for one.  I finally bought one in 1969 (a 1957 Panhead), customized/chopped it & rode/loved it for years.

Now, at my age (58) I ride a lowered customized (I do all my own wrenching & I have a TON of work in this thing) 04 RK.  I work at a car dealer & I can tell you, the old gray beards like me think my bike is awesome but our 20 year old employees have no desire whatever to own ANY Harley.........

~John

[Jeffd]

I am purposely keeping my mileage low on my 2004 egc.  I only have 77,000 miles on it and will continue to try and only put 15-20,000 per year so that when I sell it I can at least recoup some of my money.  I figure someone will always want a low mileage harley.

[Bigs]

In 2005 after not riding for 28 years I decided to get a bike, sorry make that a motorcycle cause I already had 3 bicycles. I always liked the sound of a Harley so I thought I might pick up a late model used Sportster for a reasonable price. Boy was I mistaken. The people seemed to want an arm and a leg for the used ones so I bought a new 2005 1200C. The Sportster seemed good but riding double with my wife was a little hard on her so I told her we needed a touring bike so it would be more comfortable for her. Also she didn't like the Sporty after it was modified to stage II. She said it took off like a rocket and was to loud. I found a good year old low milage 2006 RG. Like a lot of you guys I couldn't leave it alone, had to modify it. Right now it has plenty of power for my wife and I riding the hills and it will be the last Harley that I will buy, not that I have anything against Harley but I'm up there in age - over 70.
   Bigs

[Jeffd]

I was in looking at BMW1200GS' today and just for kicks I asked what my bike would be worth on a trade-in.  2004EGC that is immaculate only 77,000 miles and 0 issues.  The owner of the place whom I've know for several years and bought 4 bikes from asked how many miles and I told him and he hemmed and hawed and said $6500.  I was quite pleased to know that my plan of keeping the miles down have enabled it to keep its value up where I expected it to be.  I however did decline the offer as I know in a couple of years it will gain even more in value.  I am pleased as I only paid $16,500 for it new in june of 04. 

[truck]

Dealers don't like to trade bikes that are ridden. If I remember right they deduct $1000.00 for every 10,000 miles over 4,000 miles a year.

[Glenn W]

I think there's a lot of things going on right now, the market is full of "motivated sellers" trying to get whatever they owe out of a sale just to make the payments go away. Most dealers have high inventories and are selling many new bikes below MSRP so they really could care less about getting another used bike in the house. With all that going on, those 60K miles are going to be the deal breaker for most people. I wouldn't buy a Harley with those kind of miles for anything near what you'd need to get for it, pure & simple. Right now isn't a good time to try and sell or buy a bike for top dollar.

[truck]

Another way to look at is that everything that was going to wear out or break has already done so on a higher mileage bike, less expense and down time to the new owner.

[mark61]

Or is just about to wear out or break! How often do people change those sealed wheel/trans/clutch basket  bearings? Everyone changes the fork oil every year right so those fork slider bushings should look like new?

mark61

[Glenn W]

Another way to look at is that everything that was going to wear out or break has already done so on a higher mileage bike, less expense and down time to the new owner.

Possibly true, but even if they had a shoebox full of receipts I wouldn't care. Right now there are so many fire-sale deals out there on bikes with less than 10k miles that I simply wouldn't have any interest in a higher mileage bike. Nothing personal, have more than 2x that 60k on one of my bikes and I trust it just fine.

[Scurvy]

The owner of the place whom I've know for several years and bought 4 bikes from asked how many miles and I told him and he hemmed and hawed and said $6500. 

You should have sold it for the $6800 I offered you awhile back, lol.
Ace test rode that beemer yesterday, good looking bike; but you know you should keep the EG and get the beemer anyways.

[Jeffd]

I'm afraid if I got a GS my poor EG would just be a dust collector and that would not be right LOL.  So I am getting a KLR instead.

[panz4ever]

I agree totally with the posters saying that kids don't think Harleys are cool anymore.

I remember in 1968 I wanted a Harley so bad I would have done almost anything for one.  I finally bought one in 1969 (a 1957 Panhead), customized/chopped it & rode/loved it for years.

Now, at my age (58) I ride a lowered customized (I do all my own wrenching & I have a TON of work in this thing) 04 RK.  I work at a car dealer & I can tell you, the old gray beards like me think my bike is awesome but our 20 year old employees have no desire whatever to own ANY Harley.........

~John

John...so when ya getting another pan!