andrews 54h question

[txtech]

i hve a 06 dyna with s.e.95 flattops,stock heads,.030 cometics. am running s.e.204s now,was thinking of changing to andrews 54h, it dynoed at 89h.p. 94 trq now .would the 54s help??  i now everybody says woods cams are better but they are also nearly twice the price of andrews and s.e. 

[Arrowsmit]

I have the 54N's in my 95" & love em, but I'm running Deweys heads at 10:1 static CR. IMO your best money spent right now would be for headwork.

VicW.

[Faast Ed]

Do the heads, leave those cams in there.

[mayor]

I'm going to buck the trend, slightly.     Both cams are similar, but they are somewhat different.  The early intake close of the 204's make them a very good drop in cam with flat tops and stock head chambers.  The 54's have an intake close 8 degrees latter than the 204's.  If you're not planning on pulling the heads(to raise compression) to make the switch, you're going to lower the dynamic compression which could make the 54's feel flatter.  What's your goal?  If it's double 100's, then the 204's are probably going to come up short regardless of adding head work.  The early intake close makes building horsepower late in the rpm's more difficult.  If your goal is 100ft-lb of torque, then either cam will fit the bill with quality headwork and compression matched to the cam's intake close. 

here's your options:
if you want more torque than you have now and you want to keep the 204's, pull heads and have them shaved to increase your static compression to bring the dynamic up to about 9:1 corrected. 

if you want to make the switch to the 54's- be prepared to increase the compression, pull heads and have them shaved to increase your static compression to bring the dynamic up to about 9:1 corrected.

[Arrowsmit]

Not really bucking the trend wannab, as headwork has been the center of all the recommendations so far. But IMO if it's decided to pull the heads for a bump in CR it would be a no-brainer to go ahead & get a good port/valve job done.

VicW.

[fxstdavew]

I would bet if you pulled the heads and had them milled to 82.cc with a 0 deck height  you would see a nice bump in torque.

[HarleyFranco]

Think about putting comp releases in if you shave the heads otherwise you'll be replacing starter drives.

Frank

[notarheli]

If interested, I have a set of 54G's that I'll sell ($165 shipped to continental US).  They have 5000 miles on them.  Good cams just not matched to my build.  I was getting 95/95 out of a 95" 2006 FLHTCI.  CR 10.2:1.
notarheli@hotmail.com

[fxstdavew]

Frank how do you figure that you need compression releases for that combo it's 9.0:1 corrected and 185 cranking compression.  I run this combo with no releases and no pinging and haven't needed a starter for the 30,000 miles it's been together

[txtech]

bike runs low 12s at the track with the 204s,gets 45mpg,doesnt ping on 89 octane,john deere lowend trq.all i need is a cam that will bust high 11s,get 47 mpg,no pinging,plenty of lowend trq.without raising compression, or spending more money on the heads or woods cams. andrews 37s maybe??

[GoFast.....]

I have a diffrent Idea. Put a bigger tb more air. I have a 06 tb that I just took of my bike that I bored to 50 because I had a SE butterfly and I know it will make a differnce because my stock 07 pulled 101tq with it.

[mayor]

bike runs low 12s at the track with the 204s,gets 45mpg,doesn't ping on 89 octane,john deere lowend trq.all i need is a cam that will bust high 11s,get 47 mpg,no pinging,plenty of lowend trq.without raising compression, or spending more money on the heads or woods cams. andrews 37s maybe??

so your goal is to go down the track faster, but keep or improve your daily riding milage? to borrow a smiley from Valley Racing-

the 37's are a great cam, but again more compression would help.  If you were not going to raise the compression, the 37's would be better than the 54's;however, the 54's advanced 4 degree's would be pretty much a high lift version of the 37's (although the valves should be checked for clearance). 

if HP was free or cheap, everyone would be able to put up great numbers on limited budgets.  That's just not the case.  You got to pay to play.....

why are you hesitant on increasing the compression?  increasing compression would be the cheapest way to increase your torque (...and torque and HP are directly related).

here's a free way to go down the track faster- you could just shave some weight. I'm sure there's plenty of stuff on that bike that you just don't need- seat, turn signals, footpegs, fenders.  what do they say, for every 100# is .1 of a second?   

ok back to being serious, how much are you going to have in switching the cams?  maybe $350-$400 in parts?  forget that and pull the heads, spend $65 on a cometic gasket kit (price through Jireh's), and the rest on the heads...

[txtech]

i already have the .030 gaskets,ccp with the 204s is 195,192.  didnt cc the heads,but the exhaust ports have been polished also the combustion chambers,intake port left alone. i dont think i have enough compression to run 211s, the 204s quit at 5500,looking for something inbetween.

[mayor]

where the heads milled?  the ccp seems high for stock chambers.  if the ccp is right the 37's will bolt-in and should carry the HP a little further (maybe a few?).  The 37's typically start to level off just after 5k as well.  The 204's and the 37's are very similar, you may not see much difference other than peak torque location (and that might only be a few hundred rpm's)-although changing the peak torque location to the right increases HP. My guess is you would see more of a difference from simply changing cams by putting in a Wood's 6 (or 54's with an advance gear or an Andrews 44 if you can find one) than the TW37's, but you are still compromising the dynamic compression. 

[txtech]

i never noticed the 44 before, thanks mayor.  the 8 more deg.overlap should help over the 204s. whats your opinion on the headquarters 500?

[mayor]

the HQ-500 is probably similar gains as the 37's. There's a lot of people that like that grind, I'm more partial to the 37's.  The 37's with headwork and the right supporting cast can hit the double century mark.  I'm running the 37's in a dyna and love them. The Andrew's 44 aren't being made anymore, but they're still around.  They have an intake close of 41 degrees, so they would drop the dynamic compression down. 

[GoFast.....]

The only real way is to make what you have better because a larger cam drops compression and the only way to compensate for that is more compression. You can encrease what you have by a better TB. exhaust and tune ( trying to advance timeing). One other thing you could do is lose  weight or have someone race it that ways 150 lbs

[txtech]

The only real way is to make what you have better because a larger cam drops compression and the only way to compensate for that is more compression. You can encrease what you have by a better TB. exhaust and tune ( trying to advance timeing). One other thing you could do is lose  weight or have someone race it that ways 150 lbs

i have a propipe 2in1,i keep it tuned with a wideband gauge, havent called jenny craig yet though. my boss has 06 dyna with a s.e. 103 kit that made 101h.p.  105 trq. we put on a s.e. 50 mm throttle body and it droped to 97 h.p.102 trq. local tuner said thats all it had . the problem is we put a set of 211s and a pc3 in a freinds 08 96 dyna .it made 93hp ,95 trq. theres not a hundredth of a second between his bike and mine, on the street its toe to toe,i cant put a inch on the 96 bike. i already had my crank trued and welded by revperformance,guess i"ll have to buy some 10.5 pistons, 257s

[DblackmanC]

Just another reference...

Txtech...I have an '06 Dyna, SE 95" flat tops, SE 204 Cams, .030 cometics, Zero Deck, stock Heads, Stock exhaust with inner baffle removed, SERT and tuned by Ameagle13.
87 HP & 99 TQ and getting 51 MPG at 65 MPH. Love it...

Dan

[GoFast.....]

Put the gas to it. My brother has it on his dyna 95 in.When you flip the switch you hit the horn button.
And you think twice when you pull up beside him and want to race

[txtech]

Just another reference...

Txtech...I have an '06 Dyna, SE 95" flat tops, SE 204 Cams, .030 cometics, Zero Deck, stock Heads, Stock exhaust with inner baffle removed, SERT and tuned by Ameagle13.
87 HP & 99 TQ and getting 51 MPG at 65 MPH. Love it...

Dan

ihave the same motor with different exhaust,i had rush slipons when mine was dynoed at 89,94. i put on a propipe 2in1 havent had it on the dyno yet. i put the same cams and gaskets in a freinds 06  heritage it only made 82,91. he is using vance &hines bigshot longs, his also has a pinging problem 2 different tuners cant get rid of.

[DblackmanC]

What kind of fuel control system is on his Heritage? I've heard that the V&H Long pipes are not good for TQ and are hard to tune?? Never used them!
Dan

[txtech]

he uses a pc3,cyclesolutions tuner blames poor #s and pinging on the bigshot longs, dealership tuner told him pinging wouldnt hurt just downshift