CHP ticketing for modified pipes?

[MaxxV4]

A friend of mine was up in Placerville a couple of weeks ago and was pulled over by the CHP on westbound Hwy 50 near the I-5. The cop told him he had him clocked at 76 mph in a 65 zone, but he was only going to give him a warning on the speed. Then he told him that he was going to give him a fix-it ticket for his pipes. ( 03 Heritage with python staggered duals) The cop told him that he wasn't being singled out and that his boss had told the officers to cite all the modified pipes that they came across.
Has anyone else in the Nor-Cal area heard about or had the same experience? His pipes are a little loud but not to the extreme like drag pipes.

Mike

[seattledyna]

I live in Pville and havent heard about that yet up here, ocassionaly I ride with some retired CHP motor officers, I might ask them next time I see them.

your friend got off easy, slip some stock muffs on for the inspection and away he goes, at least no speeding ticket

[nicadocius22]

funny this subject came up. i was listening to kgo radio a few months back and they had the regional director of the chp on taking questions. one of the questions was from a biker who had a question about getting a ticket for having too loud of exhaust. the chp director said that you CAN get a ticket for having modified exhaust but that the chp (officer that pulls you over) has no way to test the level of noise that is coming out of your pipes. so if you go to court there is no was for them to know if exceeds the limit, therefor you are innocent. he said that they would like to outfit the officers with the technology to be able to test cars/bikes but that with budget cuts and whatnot it just isnt a high priority.

[harborjohn]

funny this subject came up. i was listening to kgo radio a few months back and they had the regional director of the chp on taking questions. one of the questions was from a biker who had a question about getting a ticket for having too loud of exhaust. the chp director said that you CAN get a ticket for having modified exhaust but that the chp (officer that pulls you over) has no way to test the level of noise that is coming out of your pipes. so if you go to court there is no was for them to know if exceeds the limit, therefor you are innocent. he said that they would like to outfit the officers with the technology to be able to test cars/bikes but that with budget cuts and whatnot it just isnt a high priority.

I ride with a couple motor cops. They say the same thing. You can be written for anything but it can not be proven in court.

[apes]

The rub however, is that you have to take a day off of work to fight the ticket and the CHP gets paid.....

[nicadocius22]

or ride around on a harley that sounds like a sewing machine

[turboprop]

I think it depends on who you are and what you are doing when the cop gets you in his sights. If the cop wants to pull you over, the pipe thing is another tool for them to use, just like a busted tail light.

I was recently on the west coast, rode up to San Jose via Phoenix. Lots of bikes with loud pipes, many cops from various agencies, not a single ticket or even discussion about pipes. I am sure smaller groups or individuals will probably get different treatment from the cops. You can expect the loud pipe thing to come up if you look like a $hithead and the cop thinks the juice is worth the squeeze.

[YFOPOS1]

Sounds like the CHP  did your friend ok , pulled him over gave him a little talking ,wrote him a fix-it ticket (sorta) lol
Now he can either take the time like Mike said and slip some stockers on and get it written off or take it to court and fight it.
Either way maybe your friend needs to think of it as another way , maybe stay under the radar and say ride only 5 over not 11 

Ok the Chippies read the first line of my post and got bored and clicked on another site.
That said;
yeah a few years ago the CHP had a hard on big time in the Redding area to pull over any bikes with non stock pipes !
A couple of friends got a Too loud pipes ticket, one put his stockers on to get it written off , the other fought it in court with the above argument about "prove its too loud" he got out of the ticket.
Not sure now, but just a few years back Redding PD had harleys with the stock mufflers punched out ...Redding HD did the work ...

[04Glider2]

Reading the original post the ticket wasnt' for loud pipes it was for "modified exhaust" that may not be as easy to beat as "load exhaust". That would leave you with having to put back the original stock exhaust? Don't know for sure if there is a law on the books at this time to exclude modified exhaust.
I read somewhere recently about a new CA law coming where the mufflers would have to be stamped EPA Cert or something like that. The governator signed it into law I believe. Take effect in 2013?
Wouldn't apply in this case, but you can read about it here:

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/2/8064/Motorcycle-Article/AMA-on-New-California-Exhaust-Law.aspx

That is the new upcoming law here is the current law:

http://www.ph.ucla.edu/mc/exhaust.html

Just be glad the cops don't carry decibel meters with them.

[JohnCA58]

Sacramento PD does carry a decibel meter in the Sargents car for that shift, when a unit pulls one over for loud pipes, the shift Sarg. can make a trip to the unit and do a reading.  they will hold the meter so many feet from the bike and take a reading.  seen it done.  running a Thunderheader on my bike, I just keep it quiet any time I am in town.   they will also pull you over for loud stereo's,  I have seen that done in Old Sacto many times.

[IndyHarley]

the problem is much deeper - police departments put pressure on cops to write tickets and in some States they even have requirements that you write so many tickets a year (we all know they have quotas but quotas are illegal and if challenged a court will state that) so the officer has to write tickets. maybe many times they choose to write tickets that won't stand up in court. the offender gets to win the case (yes there is a downside to that also) but the officer gets credit for writing the ticket. It is not a perfect world but when people start telling others what they have to do and start basing what you do on tickets (in the officers case) this is what you get. Yes I am sure there are other factors but in the OP post I think he got off easily because surely a speeding ticket has a bigger fine and if he caught him on radar doing 13mph over the limit in Indiana that would be over a $300 cost and the officer would win because of the radar and the amount of mph over the limit.

Now - was that officer trying to be nice  by writing the ticket that wouldn't stand up in court - unfortunately I don't think that was the case but it sounds good.

[Bill in OKC]

More tickets seem to get written when state coffers get low.  I wish there was some way to know how much money is generated from tickets and what the money gets used for.

[PoorUB]

I had a cop write me a B.S. ticket once, something stupid. Anyway I told the cop it was B.S. and he was wrong. He just told me it was his job to write the tickets, and it was the courts job to sort them out. I got out of it with a phone call to the city attorney.

[MaxxV4]

My friend is relieved that he was not cited for speeding and he does have the stock mufflers that he can slip on to get the fix-it ticket signed off. It should only be an admin fee that he will have to pay. (I'm guessing on that one) I was mostly curious whether anyone else in the Nor-Cal area had been hearing about increased enforcement for pipes. I know it's possible anywhere if you don't keep your right wrist out of it, but what is it they say........ "As California goes, so goes the nation."
Thanks for the replies.
Mike

[Ultrashovel]

I used to run loud pipes and I've yet to have a problem. Generally, at least in Northern California, they won't stop you for loud pipes by themselves, although I guess they could if they had some way to measure it like a decibel meter. The CHP in California will stop you for speeding, however, and if there are modifcations to the exhaust system or any other such violations, they can cite you. The pipes don't even have to be loud, just non-stock (no OEM markings for them, for example).

The "fixit ticket" citation doesn't warrant a hearing to dispute "loudness" either, since that's not what the citation is written for. It's written for the "modification". I don't know if there's a fee but in any case, it wouldn't be a fine, just an administrative fee.

I'd just put my stock mufflers back on and have it inspected. They used to say that any peace officer could sign off on it but the procedure may have changed.

[Evo160K]

I'm with 04GLIDER2.  Seems to me the CHP officer may not have been talking or concerned about the sound, knowing that would be difficult to test/enforce, but the fact the pipes weren't the original pipes.  I'm not sure, the oem pipes may have some h-d certification on them that an aftermarket pipe doesn't.  Lot easier to enforce modified by removal than modified sound.

[Bakon]

Can't answer for California but in Pa its a loser for any ticket on the local govt side. Out of 110.50 total the local govt gets half the fine of 25 or 12.50.
No money maker there.
costs to court might break even at 35
Ems collects 10 can't figure out why, never collect for cops on their trips to hospital at 500~1500~ a trip.
Then there is our famous CAT fund which does not pay new claims, still collecting for the 1980's claims. They get 30~50 depending on offense.
So to say they write any tickets to make money is not true.
Usually heavy enforcement is due to a civilian complaint. Period.

And for bad ticket stories,  they are a dime a dozen. But to complain about a warning... well some people just like to complain.

[Ultrashovel]

I'm with 04GLIDER2.  Seems to me the CHP officer may not have been talking or concerned about the sound, knowing that would be difficult to test/enforce, but the fact the pipes weren't the original pipes.  I'm not sure, the oem pipes may have some h-d certification on them that an aftermarket pipe doesn't.  Lot easier to enforce modified by removal than modified sound.

Yes, they have stamped part numbers and warnings that it's a violation of federal law to remove them, or words to that effect. The also say "Catalyst" if they contain catalytic material.

[Lew]

   Isn't Kalipornia supposed to crack off into the ocean and sink?  When is that gunna happen?

Lew

[crazylore]

They got meters and $200 tickets in New Hope PA

[q1svt]

MaxxV4, your friend got a fix-it ticket for not having the correct pipes on his bike… yes, it was related to noise but the 11 miles over the limit gave chp the reason to pull him over then they gave him a break so to speak with a fit-it ticket…  $$$$$$$$$

“Motorcyclist and governor of California Arnold Schwarzenegger today (9/28/2010) signed his name to a controversial motorcycle noise bill. SB 435, also known as the Motorcycle Anti-Tampering Act, gives law enforcement officials the ability to cite noise pollution violations under the California Vehicle Code, reinforcing a 27-year-old federal regulation that is rarely enforced.”

CHP generally in the northern California area are writing the tickets under the old existing EPA anti-tampering law that we all break (who hasn't added cams  ).  SB-435 is more for manufacturers to comply with EPA stickers on their pipes.  Based on CA craigslist WTB ads looking for the correct specific year complete exhaust systems, people are not getting around the fit-it ticket…

Also, I know of people getting fit-it ticket where the motor VIN is not the same as the registration.  They have to prove that their new S&S motor is the street legal one.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/greenspace/2010/09/motorcycle-noise-bill.html

[Bakon]

They got meters and $200 tickets in New Hope PA

Can you find out which motor vehicle code section they are using? Nothing I can find would be 200.

[deathwish]

always take it to court even if you lose because it usually cost the system more that the ticket can return. However be on notice that it has really been against Federal Law to modify any motorcycle exhaust since 1979 but isn't enforced. For many older bikes OEM cannot be purchased. In court it would be interesting for them to provide the ratio of Harley vs. others being written. Are you sure you aren't being targeted. Show me in the states that are cracking down and where they say you have to have factory exh where it states that for a car or truck. Motorcycles are being targeted. Here's one I used years ago. I am surprised someone hasn't produced it. I ran an expansion chamber on a 2 stroke. On the stinger I welded a tab and attached reed valve pedals. In town they would stay down on the hole of the stinger and be very quiet. Open the throttle and the reeds would bend away from the stinger and sound and run just like they weren't there. I am surprised noone has incorperated this inside an exhaust, out of site.

[Ultrashovel]

  Isn't Kalipornia supposed to crack off into the ocean and sink?  When is that gunna happen?

Lew

I'm OK. I'm 90 miles inland. LOL. 

[q1svt]

Are you sure you aren't being targeted.

Yes, we are … but the original bill wanted bi-yearly smog testing like other vehicles in California.  I know I can build high performance motors and get them to run quietly, Harley proves every day how hard it’s to build motors to pass emissions… the direction HD going to get any HP/TQ our next new bike might look a lot like a Boss Hog, or the rumors that the vrod motor will be the only HD motor available might come true

For many older bikes OEM cannot be purchased.

When it comes to fit-it and the owner deleted parts they have to find them on the open market (like headpipes). There will be money to make for all of those that saved their OEM parts

The SB423 bill allows for aftermarket mufflers it just requires the manufacturer to certify that it’s compliant with EPA and engraved on the part.

[shoveldog81]

Growing up in Los Angeles in the 60s, we all got lots of fix-it tickets - no cost if you showed it was fixed.  One time I got one for loud pipes.  So, my "fix" was to stuff the pipes with steel wool, and use a bolt to hold it in.  I took it to the police station for verification, started the bike, the cop stood behind it and said, "come on, rev it up".  That red hot blob of steel wool flew out and hit him in the leg, instantly melting those "double knit" pants they used to wear.  I think I spent at least an hour there, getting the lecture on what they could do to me.
Live and learn.
Dog
http://www.flickr.com/photos/49788418@N03/

[JohnCA58]

      that is hilarious 

[deathwish]

Hmmmm maybe we need to take our aftermarket mufflers and stamp them with all the legal shi- and have them rechromed. That'll confus-i-ate them. Since I ride Customs and the State inspected them its their fault for passng them with aftermarket exhaust, or so I'll contest.

[timtoolman]

just buy a set of fulsac performance mufflers  i did,  they are recored stocks  with basically reinhart  type baffle   and a emission stamp already,    different   muffler sizes availiable    then behave in town  raise the noise out side of town, but i currantly run reinharts but behave in town/cities in pa.

[seattledyna]

I have the complete stock exhaust system for my 91 FXR and kept the muffs for my 09 RG, If it comes down it I can always put em back on

Also have in a box the complete OEM exhaust and intake for an 08 touring bike, suppose it's worth holding on to now.

Just don't know how they would enforce widespread testing on bikes, California is broke and couldn't put that infrastructure together if they had to.

[MaxxV4]

My friend just updated me that he put his stock pipes back on and had the CHP here in San Diego sign off on it. He said the CHP looked the ticket over carefully to make sure he was signing off the correct thing and he told my friend that he was surprised that the cop up north wrote the ticket without having a decibel meter.
My friend was just relieved that he was not cited for the 11 mph over the limit and figured he would just keep quiet about the fix-it ticket.
Mike

[tdkkart]

just buy a set of fulsac performance mufflers  i did,  they are recored stocks  with basically reinhart  type baffle   and a emission stamp already,    different   muffler sizes availiable    then behave in town  raise the noise out side of town, but i currantly run reinharts but behave in town/cities in pa.

Not that we have an issue with being written tickets here, but I'm seriously considering the Fulsac conversion kit for a couple reasons. #1, I like the look of 4" muffler cans.
#2, Since they're a rec-core of your stock cans, they have the EPA number stamped on them. Unless the cop is really on the ball he just may buy into it.

[adayrider]

just buy a set of fulsac performance mufflers  i did,  they are recored stocks  with basically reinhart  type baffle   and a emission stamp already,    different   muffler sizes availiable    then behave in town  raise the noise out side of town, but i currantly run reinharts but behave in town/cities in pa.

Not that we have an issue with being written tickets here, but I'm seriously considering the Fulsac conversion kit for a couple reasons. #1, I like the look of 4" muffler cans.
#2, Since they're a rec-core of your stock cans, they have the EPA number stamped on them. Unless the cop is really on the ball he just may buy into it.

Unless he has a noise meter. Then what???

[turboprop]

This ticket thing might be a good thing. Had it not been for Cali, our harley's might still be running shovel heads, points and carbs. Who knows what this will force the industry to develop for exhausts. The interum might be difficult, but down the road we might be better off as a result of this. Being in NC I am glad that it is happening elsewhere.

[tdkkart]

Unless he has a noise meter. Then what???

You may be screwed, although noise meters are expensive. The DWI laws have been in place for MANY years, yet we can't even get breathalyzers in all the squads around here, I doubt we'll see noise meters anytime soon.

'Course if you're making enough noise to draw the attention of a LEO away from his donut box without an actual complaint called in, your probably acting like an asshat and deserve the ticket.

[76shuvlinoff]

I agree that usually it's some other behavioral issue that catches a LEO's attention. However I did get a helmet ticket from an overachiever when I was just idling through town. It turned out the officer was on a personal mission against non-dot lids and he told me up front the skid lid was the reason he stopped me it. It amounted to a "fix-it" ticket and when I arrived at the courthouse with a dot lid they tossed the ticket out.

Don't get me wrong, I was "breaking the law" and got nailed for it, I can take that but for shits and giggles I wrote a letter to the editor of the local rag that got a surprising amount of support because he had been a busy boy. Word of mouth has it that the officer got some pressure from his peers and superiors to drop his non-dot vendetta. I don't hear complaints about him anymore and have been through that town many times since with my beanie, no hassle.

[76shuvlinoff]

By the way, my son also rides a motorcycle.

I think that had a lot to do with how he handled it. 

[turboprop]

One day, he saw a group of 15 or so outlaw bikers in a group running along within the speed limit. Only issue was that none of them were wearing helmets.

Did he pull over the whole group and write out 15 tickets?....ah, no, he didn't. What he did do was to pull his cruiser up alongside of the leader. He then tapped on his forehead, indicating that they should put on their helmets and all would be well.

The leader waved back at him and then the whole group pulled over and put on their helmets. Needless to say, my son simply kept on going. All's well, that ends well.

Instead of making a big deal out of it, he handled it with some respect and no one got a ticket and the whole issue was over. Most cops I know would have handled it in the same manner.

Varies from agency to agency, but typically, the average patrol cop is prohibited by policy from stopping members of the big motorcycle clubs, especially large groups of members of the big motorcycle clubs. The clubs all know this.

Unless the cop is part of the gang unit or is taking part in a coordinated operation, they will typically just follow real close so their onboard cameras can record something for the gang unit intel section to review later.

Funny story, several years ago we were going through a southeastern state, maybe twenty five members and another fifteen or so additionals in the back.  This young, cop sees us speeding and makes a u turn, comes up real fast and pulls the last guy (with a slick vest). All of the bikes pull over, the chase vehicles stayed back in overwatch, etc. Standard drill. We get off the bikes, half of us have permits for concealed cary, to include our chicks. The cops are taught to always be incontrol, dominate the situation, etc. I think the young cop was shitting his pants. Wouldn't get out of the car. Some of the group started calling him, the chicks were heckling him. We were around his car watching him talk on the radio. Within a few minutes he killed the blue lights, backed up and left.

Sort of reinforces the idea that cops are bullies. Had that been a single sheeple instead of a large group of club members, the traffic stop would have ended completely different.

[Bakon]

No policy I ever saw. Cop was smart to not approach a group for minor traffic infraction.

[Bakon]

Varies from agency to agency, but typically, the average patrol cop is prohibited by policy from stopping members of the big motorcycle clubs, especially large groups of members of the big motorcycle clubs. The clubs all know this.

Wrong

Unless the cop is part of the gang unit or is taking part in a coordinated operation, they will typically just follow real close so their onboard cameras can record something for the gang unit intel section to review later.

Again wrong

Funny story, several years ago we were going through a southeastern state, maybe twenty five members and another fifteen or so additionals in the back.  This young, cop sees us speeding and makes a u turn, comes up real fast and pulls the last guy (with a slick vest). All of the bikes pull over, the chase vehicles stayed back in overwatch, etc. Standard drill. We get off the bikes, half of us have permits for concealed cary, to include our chicks. The cops are taught to always be incontrol, dominate the situation, etc. I think the young cop was shitting his pants. Wouldn't get out of the car. Some of the group started calling him, the chicks were heckling him. We were around his car watching him talk on the radio. Within a few minutes he killed the blue lights, backed up and left.

Not funny and smart on his part

Sort of reinforces the idea that cops are bullies. Had that been a single sheeple instead of a large group of club members, the traffic stop would have ended completely different.
[/quote]

Reinforces? Doing his job and who really looks like the bully, the cop or the club?

[Dennis The Menace]

Stop the BS.  Stay on topic with facts, or the thread will be locked along with your account.