New TTS release date?

[vetteandharley]

Understand the new TTS will have extra data logging time and will keep original map in dongle.  Anyone know the release date or if you purchase one now will it be expandable to the new model?

[Steve Cole]

The current product is completely different than the new one coming out for the CAN equipped HD bikes. The CAN equipped model is due to start shipping first of next month.

[vetteandharley]

So for a 2010 FLTRX there is no reason to wait, correct??

[HogMike]

So for a 2010 FLTRX there is no reason to wait, correct??

Correct, you run the "updater" to get all the latest changes!

[Rdub]

What is "CAN equipped HD bikes"?

[Coyote]

2011 up Softails and 2012 Dynas are CANBUS bikes.  It's old technology but new to HD of course. 

[wurk_truk]

To further it a bit...  The new HDs use a different protocol to 'talk' to the ECM and sensors.  Our touring bikes and older HDs use an older technology, and uses the older TTS VCI.  The 'new' vci is presently only for CANBUS bikes.  Since it is a 'how they talk' issue for the new bikes, there is NO reason to await this for the present bikes.  If you need a tune, and wish to use TTS, just simply buy the one for your bike and you will be good.

[Rdub]

Thanks for the explanation.

[Sash]

Now this is what I don't get, how come the SE tuner works with any Harley but this TTS don't ??

[Scotty]

Now this is what I don't get, how come the SE tuner works with any Harley but this TTS don't ??

SEPST has a flash rom for a firmware update to the actual VCI (They were thinking ahead)

So each year if they change ECM's and other things they can write new code and change the program and voila it works.

I'll bet the new TTS one has a flash based firmware update as well and no doubt it will work on the earlier bikes if and when they release firmware and software to do it.

Probably need to sell out all the old stock before making it backward compatible.

[HogMike]

Now this is what I don't get, how come the SE tuner works with any Harley but this TTS don't ??

The TTS tuner is not from H-D, the SuperTuner is, but, read the 2nd post.
A lot of the aftermarket tuners will only work on some Harleys and some disable the O2 sensors, etc. etc.
Maybe talk to someone who has what YOU are interested in, not necessarily the dealers!
There are pros and cons to each tuner, do your homework and chose what's best for YOU.
JMHO

[HogMike]

Yeah, what HE said!

[Sash]

I am on the market for a tuner, I think I'll get the SE tuner as soon as found a good online store to get one.

[Jeffd]

I am on the market for a tuner, I think I'll get the SE tuner as soon as found a good online store to get one.

www.lshd1.com is a good outfit

[HogBag]

 

I am on the market for a tuner, I think I'll get the SE tuner as soon as found a good online store to get one.

Wait 3 weeks for the biggest meanest tuner to be released. TTS Mastertune (SERT) has ruled for 12 years.   Cheers

[blawless68]

I am looking for a tuner.  Has the new TTS been release for 2011 softail (fatboy)??

[wurk_truk]

I am looking for a tuner.  Has the new TTS been release for 2011 softail (fatboy)??

Not as of yet.  Steve is having supply chain issues where he doesn't have all of the new parts in, so he cannot program them and ship them out.

[Mr. Wizard]

The name New TTS doesn't fit... need to call it something else.   

Why not TTS II or TTS-II or TTSX2?

[wurk_truk]

Can't have TTSX2.  Sounds too much like SPX.  HAHA!!!

[hrdtail78]

I thought the company's name was TTS (The Turbo Shop) and Mater Tune is the name of the product.

[Mr. Wizard]

Can't have TTSX2.  Sounds too much like SPX.  HAHA!!!

Too funny WT

OK, if you think about it. This new version is the third version... T3, TTS-3 TTS-III 

[TXP]

Well. I have used PCV, PCIII, TTS, and SESPT,  this week. Without throwing rocks at anyone, IMHO TTS is hands down the leader in the HD tuning industry. BTW this is an uncompensated endorsement.  Russ Fullen aka TXP.

[lonewolf]

I thought the company's name was TTS (The Turbo Shop) and Mater Tune is the name of the product.

Maybe it should be The Internatioal Turbo Shop or TITS for short. 

[wurk_truk]

Hey Russ...  long time no see.  I hope everyone is good where you are at!

Russel...  I vote for TITS!!!!!

[rbabos]

I thought the company's name was TTS (The Turbo Shop) and Mater Tune is the name of the product.

Maybe it should be The Internatioal Turbo Shop or TITS for short. 

mmmmmmmmmmm TITS.
Ron

[Mr. Wizard]

BAWWWWwwwwahhhhhha

Good morning. This is Steve Cole with TITS. How may I assist you today.... 

Yeah... this is going to far.

[hrdtail78]

BAWWWWwwwwahhhhhha

Good morning. This is Steve Cole with TITS. How may I assist you today.... 

Yeah... this is going to far.

Bet Vickie would be the hard sell.

[strokerjlk]

I am on the market for a tuner, I think I'll get the SE tuner as soon as found a good online store to get one.

Wait 3 weeks for the biggest meanest tuner to be released. TTS Mastertune (SERT) has ruled for 12 years.   Cheers

wait 3 weeks.
its going on 5 months now since this thread
2013 softails will be out before we can tune a 2011.. with tts
it is kinda hard to tune anything with tts right now.
where o where are all the tts tuners? old/new 

[FLTRI]

...its going on 5 months now since this thread
2013 softails will be out before we can tune a 2011.. with tts
it is kinda hard to tune anything with tts right now.
where o where are all the tts tuners? old/new 

Since you don't use TTS (MT8) due to their "locking" the dongle to the ECM so it cannot be programmed over with another tuner...why do you care when the TTS product will come out?

What I find interesting is most tuners are waiting for the best tuning product rather than simply sell and use an inferior product just to get the job from the customer. After all, It's not the tuner who gets the short end.

Hurry Steve! The natives are restless!
Bob

[hrdtail78]

Quit confusing them with facts.

[strokerjlk]

Most tuners are waiting for the best tuning product?
They been waiting two years to tune a softail then
The best product would be one avaliable,tried and true. Your tuner isnt even avaliable.

[HV]

Looks like 2013 MAY see ALL bikes including FLs TBW with the new Can Bus  ... perhaps thats why its late being released....

[Rider57]

Looks like 2013 MAY see ALL bikes including FLs TBW with the new Can Bus  ... perhaps thats why its late being released....

Thats what I think.

[hrdtail78]

Most tuners are waiting for the best tuning product?
They been waiting two years to tune a softail then
The best product would be one avaliable,tried and true. Your tuner isnt even avaliable.

Tried and true in someone's hands that know how to use the features that MT8 offer. Just like this 09 FLHX with 107, R&R heads and 54's. Been back to the builder/ tuner twice. Still pings and runs sluggish. Customer had to buy O2. Other tuner threw them out.  Don't need them for the 2003 style tune that was done. 

BTW. there are TTS units out there for sale at regular MSRP.  Just have to know where to look. BUT Jim probably knew that. He just saw another chance to throw a shot toward TTS.   Taking shots, will always open you up to take some back. Don't worry Jim, I'll get your build straightened up for you. You can go back to spending all your time worrying about Steve and the name calling.

[strokerjlk]

Looks like 2013 MAY see ALL bikes including FLs TBW with the new Can Bus  ... perhaps thats why its late being released....

Thats what I think.

me to.
Funny it wasent mentioned at the v twin expo
man it was all the rage. just wait a couple weeks . then a couple more ,then a few more.
its coming guys. just wait
cant get parts ,just wait  suppliers holding it up wait wait wait
but it sounds good now.
been waiting since 2011 for the 2013 lineup

[BVHOG]

I don't know what all the fuss is about, there are plenty of alternatives out there, the SEST, DL and power vision are all ready and working.  But I am sure we will hear from the Kool Aid crowd about how much better the TTS is, or will be someday.
It goes like this.................. I know you would like to have your 2012 cvo convertible tuned,  but if you wait an unknown amount of time you can get this tuner that will potentially be better, in the mean time just let that 30 thousand dollar plus bike, or your dreams of riding with a new engine build on hold. It will look really cool in your garage and you can go out on it and make rumbling noises with your mouth till the new unit comes out. I think there are CD's available, maybe the people waiting can get a recording of a running motor till the real stuff shows up or as part of the online software download.

[Durwood]

 

[FLTRI]

We waited for 1 1/2 years past the original delivery date for Gran Turismo 5.
Best damn driving simulator/game on the market.
Nothing more flattering to TTS than customers who would rather wait for the TTS product when alternatives are available.
Bob

[BVHOG]

The only ones waiting are the ones that are being mislead into believing nothing else will work. The others are enjoying their bikes.

[HV]

Me thinks that the large % of people waiting to use the TTS are ones that read a lot of HTT... ...the rest are all riding very well running Bikes    and enjoying their Ignorance 

[autoworker]

 
I love a good drama.

[ToBeFrank]

It will look really cool in your garage and you can go out on it and make rumbling noises with your mouth

LOL!

[lonewolf]

Me thinks that the large % of people waiting to use the TTS are ones that read a lot of HTT... ...the rest are all riding very well running Bikes    and enjoying their Ignorance 

Until they ride a well tuned bike. 

[HV]

That's correct...buying a TTS would only be the first step...finding someone who can properly tune with one would be your next  ....for that HTT does have some Masters... no question there... 

[Ohio HD]

We waited for 1 1/2 years past the original delivery date for Gran Turismo 5.
Best damn driving simulator/game on the market.
Nothing more flattering to TTS than customers who would rather wait for the TTS product when alternatives are available.
Bob

[RXBOB]

 ,,,,,,, Steve an news on release dates

[RXBOB]

Come on steve any updates this is getting outa control

must have some idea whats going on?? is it ever gonna happen?

not trying to be rude just need some sort of update

[Mr. Wizard]

I talked to him last night. He's close, very close. He wants the product to go out just as bad as we need the product to tune but he will not let product out the door until it's right. Can't blame a guy for wanting quality.

Steve taking to development -->>

Those waiting on orders -->> 

[08fxstc]

He's close, very close.

Heard that before, wait and see I spose. He wouldn't want to speculate a time incase he has to postpone once again. Hope he has enough stock to supply the demand, I wouldn't want to be one that had to wait longer again if I was to miss out on one from the first batch.......

[LJfxst]

Yeah would be spewing if i missed out on the first batch wonder how many super tuners they have sold due to not being able to get the tts just have to hurry up and wait

[FLTRSE3CLONE]

Most tuners are waiting for the best tuning product?
They been waiting two years to tune a softail then
The best product would be one avaliable,tried and true. Your tuner isnt even avaliable.

Tried and true in someone's hands that know how to use the features that MT8 offer. Just like this 09 FLHX with 107, R&R heads and 54's. Been back to the builder/ tuner twice. Still pings and runs sluggish. Customer had to buy O2. Other tuner threw them out.  Don't need them for the 2003 style tune that was done. 

quote]
I'll wait six months & remind you of your comment you posted... I've never in my life heard of a customer wanting a bike de-tuned as the throttle is too responsive! I actually thought that was the point of tuning/building a engine?? What your in store for will be well deserved with such a bs statement that you posted & in time you'll see the "Paul Harvey" side of it!

[nhrider]

I've been waiting since May for the new release.   Really would like the TTS product, but I'm stuck on the mods I want to make without a tuner.   If there isn't at least an update soon, I'm going to have to find an alternate.

[hrdtail78]

 

[strokerjlk]

Most tuners are waiting for the best tuning product?
They been waiting two years to tune a softail then
The best product would be one avaliable,tried and true. Your tuner isnt even avaliable.

Tried and true in someone's hands that know how to use the features that MT8 offer. Just like this 09 FLHX with 107, R&R heads and 54's. Been back to the builder/ tuner twice. Still pings and runs sluggish. Customer had to buy O2. Other tuner threw them out.  Don't need them for the 2003 style tune that was done. 

quote]
I'll wait six months & remind you of your comment you posted... I've never in my life heard of a customer wanting a bike de-tuned as the throttle is too responsive! I actually thought that was the point of tuning/building a engine?? What your in store for will be well deserved with such a bs statement that you posted & in time you'll see the "Paul Harvey" side of it!

It ok Tim this is what happens when you fire a customer.
He had to go somewhere to get the new SE compensator, baker F6F put on.
I am sure he is detuned to his satisfaction now.
I doubt he ever left the dealership without his 02 sensors when they put his PC 5 on .
Please don't quote the 
I have had them on ignore for some time. It works nice until they get quoted.

[08fxstc]

I've been waiting since May for the new release.   Really would like the TTS product, but I'm stuck on the mods I want to make without a tuner.   If there isn't at least an update soon, I'm going to have to find an alternate.

Well, it's not like you don't have alternatives, SEST, Power Vision and Direct Link can all do the new can bus bikes, all VERY capable of giving you a great running bike.

+1.

My two cents only but I have a TTS now and would be stuffed if I would wait as long as some have and postponing what I want to do to the bike for the sake of it. I would have it tuned with another product and be riding my bike with the mods done and be smiling.

[rbabos]

I've been waiting since May for the new release.   Really would like the TTS product, but I'm stuck on the mods I want to make without a tuner.   If there isn't at least an update soon, I'm going to have to find an alternate.

Well, it's not like you don't have alternatives, SEST, Power Vision and Direct Link can all do the new can bus bikes, all VERY capable of giving you a great running bike.

+1.

My two cents only but I have a TTS now and would be stuffed if I would wait as long as some have and postponing what I want to do to the bike for the sake of it. I would have it tuned with another product and be riding my bike with the mods done and be smiling.

My thoughts as well.
Ron

[hrdtail78]

 

[hrdtail78]

 

[HogBag]

I'm very happy with the old TTS and how reliable its been on my 07. My guess is the new tuner will be worth the wait with more power and heap more options to keep it in front of the pack for another 10 years. The pack has copied the TTS in its present form so Steve will come up with the goods to blow them away again.
 

[happyman]

I'm very happy with the old TTS and how reliable its been on my 07. My guess is the new tuner will be worth the wait with more power and heap more options to keep it in front of the pack for another 10 years. The pack has copied the TTS in its present form so Steve will come up with the goods to blow them away again.

so now that the  13's are comming out in a couple weeks will there be more issues  with getting the TTS. Never know about change HD may make to throw a wrench into things. Also will the the tts fit all big twins say  from 10- the 13's comming out?  Looking at getting a 13 in place of my 10 flhtk. also have a 07 1200 sporrty, both use the tts with great results.
Thanks

[HogMike]

I'm very happy with the old TTS and how reliable its been on my 07. My guess is the new tuner will be worth the wait with more power and heap more options to keep it in front of the pack for another 10 years. The pack has copied the TTS in its present form so Steve will come up with the goods to blow them away again.

so now that the  13's are comming out in a couple weeks will there be more issues  with getting the TTS. Never know about change HD may make to throw a wrench into things. Also will the the tts fit all big twins say  from 10- the 13's comming out?  Looking at getting a 13 in place of my 10 flhtk. also have a 07 1200 sporrty, both use the tts with great results.
Thanks

Harley 2001-present.

[happyman]

I'm very happy with the old TTS and how reliable its been on my 07. My guess is the new tuner will be worth the wait with more power and heap more options to keep it in front of the pack for another 10 years. The pack has copied the TTS in its present form so Steve will come up with the goods to blow them away again.

so now that the  13's are comming out in a couple weeks will there be more issues  with getting the TTS. Never know about change HD may make to throw a wrench into things. Also will the the tts fit all big twins say  from 10- the 13's comming out?  Looking at getting a 13 in place of my 10 flhtk. also have a 07 1200 sporrty, both use the tts with great results.
Thanks

Harley 2001-present.

so how long before the updated version will hit the street?  also i take it  the TTs will then work on the touring and dyna  plus softails?

[08fxstc]

I'm very happy with the old TTS and how reliable its been on my 07. My guess is the new tuner will be worth the wait with more power and heap more options to keep it in front of the pack for another 10 years. The pack has copied the TTS in its present form so Steve will come up with the goods to blow them away again.

IIRC Mr Cole is making the new TTS do a similar thing to the Harley tuner, PV ect anyway - collecting data in the dongle and storing maps in it? Don't think the "copying" as such is all one way.

My opinion only but the new one would want to v-tune the bike for me to make it worth the wait.

Not sure if i have messed a thread but surely Steve could chime in with an update, it has been a while since he did.

[woodreaux]

I too have too have been waiting since May for the new TTS release.
As others have pointed out there are other tuning solutions.
My luck is the day I buy the other tuner is the day TTS is released.

[happyman]

I too have too have been waiting since May for the new TTS release.
As others have pointed out there are other tuning solutions.
My luck is the day I buy the other tuner is the day TTS is released.

thats kinda how things go sometimes.. don't seem like the people that know ar at least should know  have much to say about this.
time will tell and i have an idea its a short time.

[Nebraskarider1]

Are there any dealers that have any left? I have only been able to find a 2 bike unit.

[Jeffd]

Are there any dealers that have any left? I have only been able to find a 2 bike unit.

Check with Kuryakan (sp?) 

[Coyote]

Are there any dealers that have any left? I have only been able to find a 2 bike unit.

I sent Steve a PM several weeks ago asking where I could find some and he never responded. 

[happyman]

Are there any dealers that have any left? I have only been able to find a 2 bike unit.

I sent Steve a PM several weeks ago asking where I could find some and he never responded. 

  just what is the problem that there are none available. guess i have not been paying attention to or noticed an issue till just  a few days ago. thinking seriously bout a 13 model and i prefer to ride it out of the dealership with a  TTS cooling things off

[KiwiRob]

Just got off another forum, & the week of the 23rd was to be the release of the new TTS.

Rob.

[RXBOB]

what month what year???

[justaguy]

The new Mastertune is shipping out the end of this week. But, they will not be fully functional until the updates are sent out 10 days later, through the updater. The ones we will receive will be able to do everything the old units were able to do. Then, they will slowly start releasing updates as they are available.

[LJfxst]

  :smilep:yeaaaaaah booooooy is it solid or still maybe

[LJfxst]

who can supply me one how do i get one quick

[hrdtail78]

I can, and up until yesterday at around noon (when I sold my last one) I could of sold you the older style one. The ones I had where first come first serve.

[KiwiRob]

what month what year???

I hope the above posts answered your question.

Rob.

[RXBOB]

yep my mate is a little excited hey LJ

[LJfxst]

yep my mate is a little excited hey LJ

hope for one to get here as build is finished 

[VDeuce]

Is there a discount for updating from a prior version?

Also, for those of us that use a small monitor for on-road data collection, will this work without a laptop along for the ride? I wouldn't think so, but thought I'd ask...

[Doc 1]

Is there a discount for updating from a prior version?

Also, for those of us that use a small monitor for on-road data collection, will this work without a laptop along for the ride? I wouldn't think so, but thought I'd ask...

Yes the new interface will record hours of data, (depending on the data stream), with out the lap top, the interface will also save the stock map and the last map you downloaded automatically.
The Beta software might not have this feature in it right now but it will come over the updater.
Doc

[happyman]

Is there a discount for updating from a prior version?

Also, for those of us that use a small monitor for on-road data collection, will this work without a laptop along for the ride? I wouldn't think so, but thought I'd ask...

Yes the new interface will record hours of data, (depending on the data stream), with out the lap top, the interface will also save the stock map and the last map you downloaded automatically.
The Beta software might not have this feature in it right now but it will come over the updater.
Doc

Does  the  new one allow  a person to have  one map for  normal running, plus the ability to have another map on it  to switch  to for yhe long  touring miles? understand some tuners may have that availalbe  and you just flip a switch. 

[Sporty 48]

Just went to Doc's and Mastertune websites.
No new options there.
Maybe dealers will have them first?

[mayor]

Does  the  new one allow  a person to have  one map for  normal running, plus the ability to have another map on it  to switch  to for yhe long  touring miles? understand some tuners may have that availalbe  and you just flip a switch.

The power and efficiency argument for having two maps is just clever marketing.  There is absolutely no reason to have two maps, assuming one is for power and the other is for efficiency.   Power and efficiency areas are two different areas, and there is no reason you can't have both in the same map.  The only practical reason to have two is to test how the bike reacts to say timing changes, and once you have the timing map that the engine likes...there's no need to switch again. 

[1FSTRK]

Does  the  new one allow  a person to have  one map for  normal running, plus the ability to have another map on it  to switch  to for yhe long  touring miles? understand some tuners may have that availalbe  and you just flip a switch.

The best part of the tts tuner is that once the bike is properly tuned you don't need any second maps or switches. The ecm knows if you are cruising or hot dogging around town and if you have filled all the tables in correctly it senses and adjusts for what ever you are doing at the time. No extra switches or compromising one to get the other.

Mayor I just can not out type you. Once again my post is reduced to a rewording of what you just posted.

[Steve Cole]

Beta test units have been shipped to selected dealers. As we receive feed back from those dealers we will make any changes necessary. The units will be updated as each dealers gives us feedback unit we turn all the feature on. Once that is done we will start shipping customer orders. We will not have every feature we want in place but the plans are to release them as they are fully field tested as software updates. Time before we release the product to customers depends greatly on those doing the field testing.

[Sporty 48]

Beta test units have been shipped to selected dealers. As we receive feed back from those dealers we will make any changes necessary. The units will be updated as each dealers gives us feedback unit we turn all the feature on. Once that is done we will start shipping customer orders. We will not have every feature we want in place but the plans are to release them as they are fully field tested as software updates. Time before we release the product to customers depends greatly on those doing the field testing.

How about some crumbs for the loyal retail customer?
Please post pictures, list of features, maybe some tibits to hold off the tuning jitters?
Also, any wideband stuff in there?

[HogBag]

Steve you should through a line out and see if you get any bites   

[Steve Cole]

OK. We have been getting a fair amount of calls asking if BETA is for Public people and the answer to that is NO. If you get one of the Beta testers to sell you a kit what you will be getting is NOTHING. No warranty, No support and NO refunds so please do not try it. Each unit is known by us and whom they have went too. In order for us to work through any problems that may arise we do not want, nor will we have the public involved. All it does is slow the overall process and to that end we will not deal with the public at all, until a public release is made.

This is how it needs to be for Beta Testing so it can move forward as quickly as possible. We want these out as much as everyone else does but we want to make sure that when it goes out, its as correct as we can make it.

The new systems requirements are a minimum system of:

Windows XP sp3 or newer
1 Ghz processor
1 gig byte memory
USB port only supported

These specifications are a very basic machine by today's standards and should be capable of any Note book or Net book type machine as well as most PC's

[Sporty 48]

Steve,
Features is what we are interested in. What is in the package? That is what is called marketing, getting the excitement level up, cause a buzz of interest, spreading the word....
Beta testing is a BIG Pain in the bum. Pros are welcome to it.
But if you want real customer input from clever, intelligent bikers, surely there are one or two Sportster guys here...

[RXBOB]

Steve does that mean the BETA version that has gone to your dealers doesn't lock itself to a bike?
If it does won't you need Joe Publics bike anyway to carry out the testing, I don't know but surely the dealers you use don't have 15 of there own bikes to test it on and will rely on there customers bikes ( public) and then it will be theirs and locked to their bike

[happyman]

Steve does that mean the BETA version that has gone to your dealers doesn't lock itself to a bike?
If it does won't you need Joe Publics bike anyway to carry out the testing, I don't know but surely the dealers you use don't have 15 of there own bikes to test it on and will rely on there customers bikes ( public) and then it will be theirs and locked to their bike

from the rumors out here some tuners don't own, nor do they ride Harleys or any other bike.

[LJfxst]

  

[08fxstc]

 

The longer you wait the better the sepst looks hey LJ! lmao.

You done the build and cant ride till you get the TTS or you have postponed the build?

[08fxstc]

Steve,
Features is what we are interested in. What is in the package? That is what is called marketing, getting the excitement level up, cause a buzz of interest, spreading the word....
Beta testing is a BIG Pain in the bum. Pros are welcome to it.
But if you want real customer input from clever, intelligent bikers, surely there are one or two Sportster guys here...

A couple of features that make it better than the old one is the map storage function in the dongle, recording of v-tunes and sata runs in the dongle so no laptop etc and direst USB instead of serial to USB re Doc's post.

Dont know if any extra's to the program itself though.

[08fxstc]

The new systems requirements are a minimum system of:

Windows XP sp3 or newer
1 Ghz processor
1 gig byte memory
USB port only supported

Hey Steve, is it going to be USB3 compatable or just USB2?

Just asking as I noticed the last hard drive I got was able to use both.

[TN]

Are there any new functions with the latest and greatest? such as ABS interface so one can cycle the pump for service??




TN

[tdkkart]

A couple of features that make it better than the old one is the map storage function in the dongle, recording of v-tunes and sata runs in the dongle so no laptop etc and direst USB instead of serial to USB re Doc's post.

OK, but if there's no laptop there's no way to run a remote monitor for V-tuning, correct??
Efficient V-tuning is virtually impossible without a remote monitor.

[Tsani]

Hey Steve, is it going to be USB3 compatable or just USB2?

Just asking as I noticed the last hard drive I got was able to use both.

Won't matter. USB3 is backwards compatable and even the standard USB is fast enuf for what the ECM outs out.

[LJfxst]

 

The longer you wait the better the sepst looks hey LJ! lmao.

You done the build and cant ride till you get the TTS or you have postponed the build?

i havent started yet but was hopping to get it done this time i was home from work but looks like might have to post pone or go with the power vision and dyno it then maybe buy a tts at a later date if im not happy with power vision i would rather use the tts but unsure of the time frame and im not very good at waiting

[hrdtail78]

A couple of features that make it better than the old one is the map storage function in the dongle, recording of v-tunes and sata runs in the dongle so no laptop etc and direst USB instead of serial to USB re Doc's post.

OK, but if there's no laptop there's no way to run a remote monitor for V-tuning, correct??
Efficient V-tuning is virtually impossible without a remote monitor.

I have a customer's bike that looses VSS to ECM.  I have replaced pins.  Wiggle tested it without the cap on the ECM connector.  Bounced off the seat on dyno and on the road.  Had him put dyno miles and road miles on it.  Can't get the soft failure to produce it self.  Logging data at a slow rate for mile is the best plan for catching this every 4-5 day problem.  Data recording does not lock anything.  So much more can be done with onboard data recording than getting your VE's correct.  We have past that point a couple of years ago.

My understanding is Mastertune 2 came about to address CAN.  I'm glad for the extra features, but as a pro tuner.  I am looking forward to the X and Y axis being labeled on BOTH sides, and live tuning....and as I am live tuning I would like 5vdc inputs.

[DrSpencer]

Hello Steve-Can the old units be upgraded with the new features?
Thanks

[FLTRI]

Hello Steve-Can the old units be upgraded with the new features?
Thanks

Not Steve but the new product is a new unit and has completely different innards.
Calibrations remain the same so no advantage to upgrading IMO.

Since the old units would have to be completely replaced I doubt if TTS has plans for upgrade. Calibrations remain the same from old to new.
HTH,
Bob

[redmtrckl]

Hello Steve-Can the old units be upgraded with the new features?
Thanks

Not Steve but the new product is a new unit and has completely different innards.
Calibrations remain the same so no advantage to upgrading IMO.

Since the old units would have to be completely replaced I doubt if TTS has plans for upgrade. Calibrations remain the same from old to new.
HTH,
Bob

Probably true.  The CAN bus system has a different chip set in it I think but it will have the ability to talk backwards to the old stuff. Right or wrong?

[wurk_truk]

Probably true.  The CAN bus system has a different chip set in it I think but it will have the ability to talk backwards to the old stuff. Right or wrong?

Yes.  It will do Can Bus bikes and all of the bikes that Gen1 used to do.  So, if someone has a NON CanBus bike and needs a tuner, this will work.  That was the whole idea... to make ONE tuner be able to do the different protocols.  Instead of having to buy a canbus OR a J1850.

[happyman]

Does  the  new one allow  a person to have  one map for  normal running, plus the ability to have another map on it  to switch  to for yhe long  touring miles? understand some tuners may have that availalbe  and you just flip a switch.

The power and efficiency argument for having two maps is just clever marketing.  There is absolutely no reason to have two maps, assuming one is for power and the other is for efficiency.   Power and efficiency areas are two different areas, and there is no reason you can't have both in the same map.  The only practical reason to have two is to test how the bike reacts to say timing changes, and once you have the timing map that the engine likes...there's no need to switch again.

so some of the folks that drag race for the heck of it  at their local strip only would not benifit?

[Coyote]

Does  the  new one allow  a person to have  one map for  normal running, plus the ability to have another map on it  to switch  to for yhe long  touring miles? understand some tuners may have that availalbe  and you just flip a switch.

The power and efficiency argument for having two maps is just clever marketing.  There is absolutely no reason to have two maps, assuming one is for power and the other is for efficiency.   Power and efficiency areas are two different areas, and there is no reason you can't have both in the same map.  The only practical reason to have two is to test how the bike reacts to say timing changes, and once you have the timing map that the engine likes...there's no need to switch again.

so some of the folks that drag race for the heck of it  at their local strip only would not benifit?

I don't think it really matters since you still need a laptop to load the map. 

[RXBOB]

wonder if 120r base maps will make the list

[strokerjlk]

wonder if 120r base maps will make the list

NFG 176 
NFG 205
NFG 009.   

[Hilly13]

 

[RXBOB]

I shouldn't have asked

[wurk_truk]

I shouldn't have asked

To be fair... Stroker is 100% correct and even Steve admits it.  I am running NFG 205 right now, and it took real WORK to make it run correctly.  (I had to alter most of all the warm up, idle stuff, to make it run nice). The problem seems to be that there is enough variances in things that for one bike the base map is real close and for the next bike, it is NOT.

Now that TTS is ready to start shipping soon, maybe Steve can devote some more time in investigating why the base maps for the 120R are so screwy.

[BVHOG]

I shouldn't have asked

To be fair... Stroker is 100% correct and even Steve admits it.  I am running NFG 205 right now, and it took real WORK to make it run correctly.  (I had to alter most of all the warm up, idle stuff, to make it run nice). The problem seems to be that there is enough variances in things that for one bike the base map is real close and for the next bike, it is NOT.

Now that TTS is ready to start shipping soon, maybe Steve can devote some more time in investigating why the base maps for the 120R are so screwy.

Seriously? why are they screwy? because every person that installs one has a slightly different combo of intake exhaust injectors etc. and the majority of the maps in any of these tuning devices have not been tested on an actual bike for the combo listed much less anything outside the specs.

[FLTRI]

Seriously? why are they screwy? because every person that installs one has a slightly different combo of intake exhaust injectors etc. and the majority of the maps in any of these tuning devices have not been tested on an actual bike for the combo listed much less anything outside the specs.

That's the truth especially as applied to big inch, performance builds! Too many variables as you mentioned (ie:injector output, and exhaust design) to offer a dialed calibration.
So, at best these calibrations offered by tuner mfgs without charge, should not be expected to do anything other than TTS V-tune or SESPT Smart Dumb-tune or get to bike to a qualified, experienced tuner.

These calibrations, including PV, TTS, Power Commander, and Direct Link, should never be assumed as a close or dialed map...but just a possible map for break-in or to get the bike to a tuner.

Auto-tune systems ONLY work IF the O2 sensors see proper signalling throughout the entire rpm/tp/load ranges...which is rare at best. You can't tell these systems which part of the calibration you want closed loop and open loop to take advantage of the auto-tune without using it for areas the exhaust and/or cam profiles eliminate proper O2 signalling.

TTS Mastertune and SESPT allows specific areas to run closed loop and where to run open loop to get the best of both worlds.

Bob

[1FSTRK]

IMHO the need for TTS released 120 cals has less to do with the tuning tables we have access to and more to do with the built in inaccessible differences that exist in every TTS cal.

[strokerjlk]

IMHO the need for TTS released 120 cals has less to do with the tuning tables we have access to and more to do with the built in inaccessible differences that exist in every TTS cal.

I have heard you have all the tools you need ,using any mt 8 cal.

[FLTRI]

IMHO the need for TTS released 120 cals has less to do with the tuning tables we have access to and more to do with the built in inaccessible differences that exist in every TTS cal.

It's a conspiracy to keep us in the dark and unable to properly tune the Unique? SE120r engines...but what about all the 107-145cu engines tuners have successfully used TTS base cals modified to dial these big inchers in??
Bob

[1FSTRK]

IMHO the need for TTS released 120 cals has less to do with the tuning tables we have access to and more to do with the built in inaccessible differences that exist in every TTS cal.

It's a conspiracy to keep us in the dark and unable to properly tune the Unique? SE120r engines...but what about all the 107-145cu engines tuners have successfully used TTS base cals modified to dial these big inchers in??
Bob

FLTRI sometimes you and strokerjlk deserve each other. No one was talking conspiracy.
To my knowledge TTS has never released any TTS developed cals for those big motors either. Steve posted here that cals were coming. He also posted that he was having troubles that he could not explain between the test bikes. If it is just the user tunable tables you would think he would release both cals he developed with the usual disclaimer that they are just starting points and you need to v-tune. The tuning needs of these 120r motors are more like the big aftermarket combinations that many have struggled with in the past and a fair deviation from SE base cals that HD paid him to develop. He may just be getting a taste of what others have been going through. This may well be an eye opener to some base cal needs that have existed all along. We are long past establishing that differences exist and that trying different base cals is necessary but what if none of the present base cals are set up properly for the needs of these type motors. I am not saying that you have not made other cals work on big motors, but Steve himself stated that the cals he has are not yet up to his standards and will not release them until they are.

[FLTRI]

FLTRI sometimes you and strokerjlk deserve each other. No one was talking conspiracy.
To my knowledge TTS has never released any TTS developed cals for those big motors either. The tuning needs of these 120r motors are more like the big aftermarket combinations that many have struggled with...

Every good tuner went through a learning curve to figure out how to get the base calibrations to work well with builds not listed in the SERT software.
It's our job...and to some, their passion as it is with me.
It's all about how to get what you need from what you have to work with.
There will never be base cals that will work well with anything but exactly the formula (a/c to exhaust tip(s)) they were developed for.
Harley Davidson paid Steve Cole to develop the SERT calibrations in his software. (SERT).
TTS furnishes those and mostly improved versions and completely new for 09-up software and calibrations which do not behave quite like the SESPT software and cals...

He may just be getting a taste of what others have been going through

.
No doubt; cause now he's got a variety big inch engines to play with now that were just in their HD infancy (95ci-103ci) when he developed the SERT cals.

...but what if none of the present base cals are set up properly for the needs of these type motors...?

Experienced tuners understand how to get the existing cals to work very well with pretty much all builds...yes even the biggest.
Cubic inches and injector size are adjustable plus a plethora of other tuning adjustments that are used to dial in these big inchers.

Steve himself stated that the cals he has are not yet up to his standards and will not release them until they are...

Yep that's Steve.
Bob

[mayor]

   why did you put my name as the quoted source? 

[strokerjlk]

FLTRI sometimes you and strokerjlk deserve each other. No one was talking conspiracy

.....conspiracy?
how did you throw me in with that?
there is no need for any developed cals anymore,you just got to use all the mt 8 tools , you guys settled for the fluff instead of actual cals.
now it doesn't matter ,because even if you got the same exact build,the variables introduced with the "tools" make it even harder to plug and play a map.
most guys v tuning on the street cant even use all the tools without a dyno so there is guess work from the start.

who deserves each other??... is the ones that bitched so long for more cals from actual builds that were actually developed from the manufacturer.
then settled for what they got!

[hrdtail78]

FLTRI sometimes you and strokerjlk deserve each other. No one was talking conspiracy

.....conspiracy?
how did you throw me in with that?
there is no need for any developed cals anymore,you just got to use all the mt 8 tools , you guys settled for the fluff instead of actual cals.
now it doesn't matter ,because even if you got the same exact build,the variables introduced with the "tools" make it even harder to plug and play a map.
most guys v tuning on the street cant even use all the tools without a dyno so there is guess work from the start.

who deserves each other??... is the ones that bitched so long for more cals from actual builds that were actually developed from the manufacturer.
then settled for what they got!

Spoken from a guy that has went out of his way to show closed loop doesn't work and why bother with MT8's, cause if you do.  You get named called. BUT other company's have tried to keep up the the leader.  We still might not have every tool, but TTS still does offer the most.  BOTTOM LINE.

So, lets take a step back and put us all in the same category.  Jim, Me, Bob, Bob, Steve........ We all make money on tuning bikes.  Best thing about this is seeing many bikes and forming an opinion on different problems that come up.  Just not the same thing.  I'm sure I am not the first company that got beta.  Just glad a company thought enough about me.

IMHO the need for TTS released 120 cals has less to do with the tuning tables we have access to and more to do with the built in inaccessible differences that exist in every TTS cal.

And has the opinion been gathered by what you have seen or what has been talked about on forums.  IMO there is a difference between someone that tunes a bike once a week to someone that has problems tuning their bike DIY.  Sure I said that.  IMO there is a huge difference between someone that is a DIY guy opposed to someone that calls themself that and just goes to forum and get answers.  Effort needs to be into it.  Just like tuning.

Truk,
So, you had to tune ALL the tables.  Welcome to tuning my brother.  If everybody could do it.  .....?

[1FSTRK]

Gentlemen; I am not sure what you think you are debating or who you are debating with.
TTS manufactures the product.  TTS states that to use this product you must install one of their base cals as a starting point. TTS states that you may have to try more than one base cal to find what works best with a given motor combination. TTS continues to develop and release new base cals for new and different combinations.
The fact that you have to find the right cal is the proof that the other cals are wrong.
The fact that new cals are released is the proof that there are motor combinations that the old cals do not cover.
I have passed no judgment on this being good or bad, only stated that as long as the system requires different base cals for different motor combinations there will be motor combinations that do not match a specific cal. Some of these combinations (like the 120r) will become popular enough to warrant the time and effort to create a base cal for and other one offs will not.
To try and make this about the ability of the person doing the tuning is just a distraction from the subject. If it was only about personal ability and not about what is built into the cal the really good tuners and Steve himself would be tuning every combination off a single base cal with no need for anything else.
The nature and complexity of these systems demands that the details be right and with the many details that change in every custom build we have to rely on the people that supply the base tools to get us close enough so that we can finish the job with an acceptable outcome. This is why we wait.

[RXBOB]

I shouldn't have asked

Told ya's

[FLTRI]

  why did you put my name as the quoted source?

Well that's called a WHOOPS! Sorry about that Mike.
Bob

[mayor]

I thought you were just trying to give me a complex.   

[FLTRI]

...TTS states that to use this product you must install one of their base cals as a starting point. TTS states that you may have to try more than one base cal to find what works best with a given motor combination. TTS continues to develop and release new base cals for new and different combinations.
The fact that you have to find the right cal is the proof that the other cals are wrong...

Wrong? Not wrong BUT different which is why you may need to browse cals to find one your specific build characteristics meld with.

ALL MFG ARE IN THE SAME BOAT HERE! No mfg can guarantee their calibration will work for anything but exact formula of parts and their actual output, like injectors intake size, etc.

Fact is, the more experienced the tuner the better he will be able to choose a very close base cal from his library developed over the years from canned cals. (We have thousands from over 15+ years tuning these EFI bikes.

The fact that new cals are released is the proof that there are motor combinations that the old cals do not cover.

That is considered a normal course of development.

Some of these combinations (like the 120r) will become popular enough to warrant the time and effort to create a base cal for and other one offs will not.

Yep, but ONLY as a starting point for tuning NOT to be assumed "dialed" for the build developed for...just too many sensitive tuning variables that can drastically change fueling and timing requirements.

To try and make this about the ability of the person doing the tuning is just a distraction from the subject.

...But it IS all about the guy making tuning changes' experience and knowledge his ability to develop cals specifically for a particular bike's build formula and its idiosyncrasies.
These are not easily identified, measured, and corrected by most DIYers.

The nature and complexity of these systems demands that the details be right and with the many details that change in every custom build we have to rely on the people that supply the base tools to get us close enough so that we can finish the job with an acceptable outcome.

IF the DIYer has basic EFI tuning experience and requisite knowledge the above is possible.
The less experience and knowledge the more more difficult it is to understand and hence properly tune these big builds.
Keep in mind it is only these big inch builds that canned cals are not available...yet.
There are quite a few helper/base/canned cals for specific HD formula builds and  Stage1 bikes that work very well for DIYers to dial their bikes in.
Maybe tuners should start selling to DIYers,wo want to browse for the best match for their bike and its idiosyncrasies.? For example, if the build is a 117ci we have no less than 50 unique cals developed for base mapping while we probably have close to the same for 124's.
It's taken thousands of hours and tunes over many years to develop these base cals so I feel it's worth quite a bit.

Bob

[1FSTRK]

Bob you are talking tuning tables and I am talking base cals.
You seem to feel the need to defend the product and yet I have not attacked it it any way. I state something and you reword it or state that the other companies do it too. If you read through this I say something and you say "yup but that's not a bad thing" when I never implied bad or good.
The constant comparison between pro tuner and DIY tuner has nothing to do with the product and software as it is delivered to the public.
You seem to be under the impression that once you change the tuning tables that you have created a base cal. The true different base cals can only be created by TTS. This is why you can copy all the tuning tables and paste them into a different base cal and get different results. This is why it is important to have new TTS developed base cals for motors that fall out side the norm.

[jkelley]

Anyone have any updates on the release for 2011 Soft tails, and 2012 Dyna's yet?

[BVHOG]

And then?

[jkelley]

The only thing I heard as of yesterday was "there is no software available for the Canbus at this time"

BUt they are working as fast as they can.

I know the Beta testing was in progress but really nothing for a release date yet.

[RXBOB]

whats the word on the street over that side of the world on the TTS testing

Steve has gone cold since Jamie and himself had a little keyboard discusion

[guydoc77]

He started a new thread with a new forecast of release dates just the other day.

[RXBOB]

yep
day after my post

[feng jui]

Mastertune Website has just been updated, they start taking orders and shipping.

[7hogs]

How does the SERT upgrade work? I get a 404 code when getting to the download

[Steve Cole]

New Web Site is up. http://www.mastertune.net/

The New storage page http://www.mastertune.net/downloads.htm then on the Tuning File Repository