Mounting a Cycle Electric Regulator

[PaJoe]

I replaced the defective stock regulator on our '90 Ultra with a new Cycle Electric Regulator. It works OK but is a little bigger than the stock and interferes with the oil cooler installation. I can easily use 3/8 x1" steel bushings and longer bolts to raise it up but not sure if it needs to be secured to  a metal plate on the bottom for the additional support - my concern is it may flex being up in the air and cause problems over time.   

Are these sturdy enough to just have two small contact points? It will be mounted to the the same bracket that is  over the front motor mount, just not tight against it. 


thanks in advance

joe

[Traveler733]

Your spacers should be ok, as long as you maintain a ground for the regulator. Use star washers top & bottom to be sure you keep it grounded. I have been runnnig one this way for about 5 ears now. No problems with it.

[flhs90]

I just replaced my battery.
Perhaps this would be a good time to check my voltate regulator.
Is there a simple test whether or not my vr is good or not.
Where would I get the "Cycle Electric" part and how much.
Can you post pics?

Thanks in advance.



Being straned is "not wor.th " the "ounce" of prevention pound of cure truism.


FLHS 90

[tinkerman]

Just food for thought guys....

One time it was nessesary to mount regulators and such tight to a steel plate to help absorb some of the heat (like a heat sink ). Now perhaps I am too old school with this idea and have fooled too much with the old Lucas electrics on the British bikes. Is that still a requirement? If so elevating it with spacers for clearance might cause some problems.

It would be good to get some feedback from the engine gurus here with their opinions. Maybe the new electrics is a lot more efficient and doesn't build up the same heat.

Tinkerman

[PaJoe]

Thanks to all, I will check into this further

flhs90,

I think there are only 2 major parts to the charging system. The alternator (rotor/stator) and the voltage regulator. If the stator puts out AC voltage in the correct range for your bike it is ok. The voltage regulator on my bike sits on a bracket over the the front motor mount and it plugs into the plug for the stator at the front  of the engine crankcase by the inner primary. To test it I unplugged the voltage regulator and used a meter to check the AC voltage at a particular rpm, for 1989 and later it should be about 16-20 volts AC per 1000 rpm. If you don't get the AC voltage then you need to do more testing, check to see if it is shorted or grounded. If the alternator is working then the only major part is the voltage regulator. My bike has a voltmeter in the inner fairing so it was pretty easy to see the voltage was not going up when I increased the rpms. If you don't have a voltmeter in your circuit you could check it at the battery,when the rpms go up it should be charging about 14 volts.

Bad wires, loose connections or bad ground might interfere with it working properly, so you would want to check that before buying a new one.. 




I got mine from Dennis Kirk because I was in a hurry. I am very angry at them right now even though I got my money back on a defective battery I purchased from them. Most times I can order by 8PM on a Monday and get it on Wednesday. Jireh would probably be cheaper, but take longer and there are cheaper regulators out there, as low as $69.00. I chose the Cycle Electric because of the recommendations from various forum posters.

[Porkchop]

Cycle electric

[flhs90]

I tested my new battery at the battery. 12.3 volts, not fully charged. Have it on a Battery Tender Trickle charger.
Alternator(stator Rotor is putting out like it's supposed to:  Stator AC Output check= 16 volts+ at 1000rpms.; 32+ volts at 2000 rpms.) This test was done with my multimeter across stator sockets and voltage regulator/rectifier unplugged.

With the bike running volts at the battery are 12. 12 and even less with the headlights turned on, dropping into the high 11's voltage.

Think it's time for a  new regulator. All connections, regulator ground checked. no loose wires that I can see.

Please advise:

The Cycle Electric is about double in price. Any links to this topic or advice is appreciated.

Thanks,
Dave

[PaJoe]

The voltmeter gauge in the dash on my '90 Ultra always drops down at idle, especially with the brake lights on, at red lights it may show lower than 12 volts. However once the rpms are up it works it way up to about 14 volts. If the battery is low, such as after I had some trouble getting it started,  it may take several minutes for the voltage to get up to that level.  When you do your test make sure you get the rpms up close to the 2000 rpms, you want to make sure it is not working before you spend the money on a new one. As I posted, with mine it was obvious, 20 minutes of riding at 50 mph  and the gauge did not go up at all, I cleaned the plug and it worked for about the first 5 miles, then the same thing.

Regulators are easy to change, however, a stator is not so easy. Choosing the regulator  was a tough decision for me, a new Harley regulator cost about $95 from a local dealer, I can get another 20% off buying from a dealer on line and the Cycle Electric cost closer to $120. It may be a little cheaper at www.jirehcycles.com . The Drag Specialties were as low as $69.00 at Jireh. I was not sure which way to go but a few well respected individuals recommended the Cycle Electric. Only time will tell if I made a good decision.

[flhs90]

I copied and pasted the stator testing with check light. Karl of Cycle Electric told me to conduct the stator short test with engine running and make sure the test light has a good ground.

The top pin socket from the stator did not light the check light.
However the bottom pin socket lights up the check light.

Looks like it's time to replace the stator.

Anybody out there done this? What is the toughest part? I see I open up the primary, etc.
Compensating Nut can be a challenge.
Tips in advance would be appreciated.

Thanks, Dave






Stator Testing

Stators are very simple and their problems fall in to two categories: shorts and opens. Shorts can be from winding to winding or from winding to ground. Winding to winding shorts are tested with a AC volt meter from pin to pin on stator plug with the motor running. Check service manual for proper voltage at given rpm. Open stators have no AC voltage output. The best way to test for shorts to ground is with a 12 volt test light. Check from each stator pin to ground. If the light lights the stator is bad, there should not be any continuity from either stator pin to ground. Sometimes an ohms meter will not pick up a short to ground. The light test is better. Measure AC amps between stator and regulator. Shunt drop regulators draw full AC amps all the time and no extra load is needed. If you have a Cycle Electric Inc. or other series pass regulator, it will be necessary to load the DC system to achieve full AC amps. Put a DC volt meter and extra loads across the battery. Add load until battery voltage drops below 13 volts with the motor above 2500 rpm. Read AC meter and compare to service manual specs. Low output indicates a stator or rotor problem. Rotor problems are rare, but sometimes the magnets do get weak or become loose.

[14Frisco]

Here's a link to a Twin Cam stator change:
http://hdforums.com/forum/touring-models/89699-got-an-electrical-problem-need-help-3.html

[PaJoe]

You really would do better if you had a manual to follow, but the thread posted by 14Frisco looks helpful.

I put a new stator in mine when I changed engines, the old stator still worked but the leads were really dried out and most of the insulation was cracked and falling off.  It was a lot of work, the key was to make a good block to wedge in the primary chain to keep it all from turning.  I tried just putting it in gear and have my wife hold the break but that would let it move just enough to prevent me from breaking the compensating nut loose - it's about 150 ft pounds, very tight. Some say use an impact wrench, but that did not work for me, I needed a long, maybe 36"  1/2 inch breaker bar to break the compensating nut loose. The stock engine was better as I did not have to remove the inner primary, only the outer primary , clutch and compensating nut. The rotor on mine was different than the one in the thread posted by 14 Frisco , mine had two holes and you just needed to hook something in the holes to pull the rotor out - the do magnets make it hard to pull out. Sometimes they have red Locktite on the compensating nut so you need to heat it to break it loose. The nut on the clutch is left hand , it turns clockwise to loosen. The compensating nut is right hand and clockwise to tighten. When you but a stator buy new mounting bolts as well, they have locktite on them - I used the Harley stator kit and I think it had the pre-treated bolts with it.

good luck