Which clutch hub is best?

[stogieluvr60]

I do know a good primary system makes a crank trued or  welded  a happier component

No doubt...of course, the same can be said for a stock bottom end too. I wonder if greater attention had been paid to the shortcomings of the OEM primary drive, how many bottom end failures could have been avoided, not to mention IPB's & TMB'S? We Harley people must be either ultra loyal or ultra foolish....maybe a combination of both.....

[rbabos]

I do know a good primary system makes a crank trued or  welded  a happier component

No doubt...of course, the same can be said for a stock bottom end too. I wonder if greater attention had been paid to the shortcomings of the OEM primary drive, how many bottom end failures could have been avoided, not to mention IPB's & TMB'S? We Harley people must be either ultra loyal or ultra foolish....maybe a combination of both.....

Sorry, can't argue with that statement.
Ron

[timtoolman]

That's why with my new S&S crank I replaced the entire primary system 

[build it]

Is it possible to check the primary for any stack up load on the crank? Not sure if I'm wording that right.

[FlaHeatWave]

That's why with my new S&S crank I replaced the entire primary system

What components did you use in the primary?

[timtoolman]

Latest S.E. Compensator. New chain . New clutch basket, barnett clutches and their low profile variable pressure plate and the new S.E. Tensioner, mixture of formula plus and vtwin primary fluid

[Ken R]

Latest S.E. Compensator. New chain . New clutch basket, barnett clutches and their low profile variable pressure plate and the new S.E. Tensioner, mixture of formula plus and vtwin primary fluid

The Barnett people sure don't like Formula +. 
I called and talked to a tech person that said it was too thick for their clutches.   I used it with HD stock clutches, but it really clunked 1st gear after cold starts in neutral.  And starting the engine in gear would require holding the brake until the oil thinned a bit and got slung around inside the primary.


I've mixed stuff in my primary, too.  Right now, I'm running a little Syn-3, a little Mobile1 Synthetic 20w-50, and a little Synthetic ATF. 


The Barnett guy said that they like synthetic oils like Syn-3, ATF, AMSOil, Mobile1, etc.  "Just don't use Formula+ with our clutches."


I'm getting the best clutch life and adjustment stability in over 8 months with my current Barnett Carbon Fiber clutch that I got from California Phil's. 


Ken

[Admiral Akbar]

Latest S.E. Compensator. New chain . New clutch basket, barnett clutches and their low profile variable pressure plate and the new S.E. Tensioner, mixture of formula plus and vtwin primary fluid

The Barnett people sure don't like Formula +. 
I called and talked to a tech person that said it was too thick for their clutches.   I used it with HD stock clutches, but it really clunked 1st gear after cold starts in neutral.  And starting the engine in gear would require holding the brake until the oil thinned a bit and got slung around inside the primary.


I've mixed stuff in my primary, too.  Right now, I'm running a little Syn-3, a little Mobile1 Synthetic 20w-50, and a little Synthetic ATF. 


The Barnett guy said that they like synthetic oils like Syn-3, ATF, AMSOil, Mobile1, etc.  "Just don't use Formula+ with our clutches."


I'm getting the best clutch life and adjustment stability in over 8 months with my current Barnett Carbon Fiber clutch that I got from California Phil's. 


Ken

So you fixed your funky problem with the clutch.. It was the plates?

Max

[Ken R]

I firmly believe that Harley has changed their clutch plates in some way.  Where I used to get 6 months of torturous cone-riding on a set, the latest ones are only lasting 2 or 3 sessions.  I can tell immediately if one is going to last or prematurely burn out.  The dealership even put a whole new clutch in, basket and all(under warranty); and it didn't last through their check ride.  They readjusted and gave me the motor; their adjustment was going south within 4 miles and I had to limp home that evening.  They replaced it again; I could tell that it was going soft as well.  I know local riders that have had clutch recent replacements within 500 miles of buying brand new motorcycles.  I know of police motors that have gone through multiple clutches in just days on new motorcycles. 


Max, the problem is that the clutches would swell up when hot; so much that clutch lever freeplay would be huge-excessive.  So much freeplay that when the lever was against the grip, the clutch would not disengage.  If adjusted, the freeplay would disappear completely and the clutch's center adjustment would need to be re-adjusted, sometimes 2 or 3 times in one practice session.  I have one clutch plate in a pack that only lasted a few hours; the friction pads were worn clean down to the aluminum.  On the flip side, there were little blisters or bulges in the aluminum substrate.  That's just not right! 
The symptoms I was whining about appear to all be due to the wide swings in adjustment due to heat (in one direction) and wear (in the other direction)



I've been cone riding for 6 or 7 (or more) years; and never had this kind of problem.  Then suddenly, I couldn't keep a clutch in my motor for more than a week.  (symptoms would appear within minutes of the first ride)


So I gave up and tried the Barnett.  So far, it's behaving like clutches USED to behave.  I check adjustments after every practice session . . . . no adjustment have been needed.  So far, stable as a rock and the friction zone doesn't move around. 

[timtoolman]

That's funny because Mike at Barnett said formula + could be used just not much  in the colder temps that's why I mixed it New compensator likes the + and clutches like the other stuff . When I put it in 1st gear it goes click not clunk anymore, I was suprised

[timtoolman]

But then I removed the damper spring and spacer  and smaller clutch disc that goes in first  and used another full disc,

[Admiral Akbar]

I firmly believe that Harley has changed their clutch plates in some way.  Where I used to get 6 months of torturous cone-riding on a set, the latest ones are only lasting 2 or 3 sessions.  I can tell immediately if one is going to last or prematurely burn out.  The dealership even put a whole new clutch in, basket and all(under warranty); and it didn't last through their check ride.  They readjusted and gave me the motor; their adjustment was going south within 4 miles and I had to limp home that evening.  They replaced it again; I could tell that it was going soft as well.  I know local riders that have had clutch recent replacements within 500 miles of buying brand new motorcycles.  I know of police motors that have gone through multiple clutches in just days on new motorcycles. 


Max, the problem is that the clutches would swell up when hot; so much that clutch lever freeplay would be huge-excessive.  So much freeplay that when the lever was against the grip, the clutch would not disengage.  If adjusted, the freeplay would disappear completely and the clutch's center adjustment would need to be re-adjusted, sometimes 2 or 3 times in one practice session.  I have one clutch plate in a pack that only lasted a few hours; the friction pads were worn clean down to the aluminum.  On the flip side, there were little blisters or bulges in the aluminum substrate.  That's just not right! 
The symptoms I was whining about appear to all be due to the wide swings in adjustment due to heat (in one direction) and wear (in the other direction)



I've been cone riding for 6 or 7 (or more) years; and never had this kind of problem.  Then suddenly, I couldn't keep a clutch in my motor for more than a week.  (symptoms would appear within minutes of the first ride)


So I gave up and tried the Barnett.  So far, it's behaving like clutches USED to behave.  I check adjustments after every practice session . . . . no adjustment have been needed.  So far, stable as a rock and the friction zone doesn't move around.

Ken

Thanks for the info..

Max

[TorQuePimp]

http://evolution-industries.com/pdfiles/evo-motorcycle.pdf

  Very good stuff