08 and up 103 build with your hands tied (Stock pistons, OEM dbw TB with mods)

[1FSTRK]

Looking for dyno sheets and build info.
What it the most hp and tq you have made with a 2014 DBW throttle body and stock 103 pistons.
A friend is looking to change cams, and is considering head and throttle body work but does not want to buy a new TB or remove the cylinders and pistons.
Thanks for any sheets you can provide.

[sfmichael]

You'd be one of the guys I'd go to for that information... 

[1FSTRK]

I just do not have anyone that builts with these restrictions. Everyone knows the tb and compression are the hold up and guys like Vic do not test on this like they did with the 88" motors.

[PoorUB]

The big question is, what is your customer expecting?

Cams and head porting you should get 110 torque and 100 HP pretty easy. Even more with milling the heads for a compression bump, porting and appropriate cams.

[sfmichael]

I just do not have anyone that builts with these restrictions. Everyone knows the tb and compression are the hold up and guys like Vic do not test on this like they did with the 88" motors.

Gotcha...I'll be very interested to see what pops up in the replies. Good question 

Gotta figure 57 and 555tqster to be front-runners...
Maybe CR575. Love the 204's I have although my chart isn't awe inspiring.
Will the guy be doing the normal other Stage 1 stuff?

[Don D]

Just had a shop call me and they used my Street Pro heads on a late model 103 Stock tb and injectors, Andrews 57, and V&H power duals and V&H mufflers, 9.9:1. Made 105/121. Just one of many. I will be seeing him and get the dyno.

[SOCS]

Ultranutz  had pretty good numbers with his 57h, 103" build too. Think he used Kirbys street heads stock pistons and tb. He sent me a dyno sheet but it seems that I lost it.

[m1marty]

I sent you my info with my stock block/tb build. Aaron/Aharp got roughly 120 squared with heads and fueling 574 cams a while back too. With compression, good heads, cams and exhaust- Ive seen quite a few over 110/110 with what youre talking about.

[berms]

Just had a shop call me and they used my Street Pro heads on a late model 103 Stock tb and injectors, Andrews 57, and V&H power duals and V&H mufflers, 9.9:1. Made 105/121. Just one of many. I will be seeing him and get the dyno.

That sounds like a winning combo. 

[N-gin]

So how does he have his hands tied lots of good running 103s. .027 head gasket. Good port work as mentioned above, shave down the head, and cams. Most important an exhaust.
As far as I can see your friend just doesn't want to remove pistons, right.

[1FSTRK]

Just had a shop call me and they used my Street Pro heads on a late model 103 Stock tb and injectors, Andrews 57, and V&H power duals and V&H mufflers, 9.9:1. Made 105/121. Just one of many. I will be seeing him and get the dyno.

Sounds like this is on the right track, I would like to see the graph when you get it.
Is that 105tq or hp
How much did you have to cut the heads to get 9.9:1 with stock pistons?

[1FSTRK]

I sent you my info with my stock block/tb build. Aaron/Aharp got roughly 120 squared with heads and fueling 574 cams a while back too. With compression, good heads, cams and exhaust- Ive seen quite a few over 110/110 with what youre talking about.

I wanted to show him your sheet but I can not find it.
The 120/120 that Aaron got was with stock 103 pistons and a oem 50mm tb?
I have not seen the 110/110 graphs, that sounds like what I would expect to see, there is just so much that you can do with the stock DBW TB and limited compression.

[1FSTRK]

So how does he have his hands tied lots of good running 103s. .027 head gasket. Good port work as mentioned above, shave down the head, and cams. Most important an exhaust.
As far as I can see your friend just doesn't want to remove pistons, right.

Right, no removal of stock pistons and cylinders, Must use OEM DBW TB but it can be reworked as much as possible.

You can only go so big on the cam and ports because of the static compression limit.
The DBW TB can only be worked to flow a given amount of air so that to is a limiter.

He would like to see good tq by 2500 rpm and keep the peaks as square as possible. I know you can short cam it and get a big tq hump the noses over early or run a pipe that will have a big dip to start out with and gain a couple hp at peak rpm but that is not the goal here.

He is flexible on the exhaust, air cleaner, and willing to pay for a good tuner and dyno tune. He is just trying to learn from other peoples failures and successes before he starts spending money.

[prodrag1320]

dons numbers seem pretty much the answer your looking for,103-106hp & 115-120tq depending on cams & degree of headwork

[Durwood]

So how does he have his hands tied lots of good running 103s. .027 head gasket. Good port work as mentioned above, shave down the head, and cams. Most important an exhaust.
As far as I can see your friend just doesn't want to remove pistons, right.

Right, no removal of stock pistons and cylinders, Must use OEM DBW TB but it can be reworked as much as possible.

You can only go so big on the cam and ports because of the static compression limit.
The DBW TB can only be worked to flow a given amount of air so that to is a limiter.

He would like to see good tq by 2500 rpm and keep the peaks as square as possible. I know you can short cam it and get a big tq hump the noses over early or run a pipe that will have a big dip to start out with and gain a couple hp at peak rpm but that is not the goal here.

He is flexible on the exhaust, air cleaner, and willing to pay for a good tuner and dyno tune. He is just trying to learn from other peoples failures and successes before he starts spending money.

Eric, I have a guy that is wanting to do the same type of build as your friend, I talked to WFO Larry a while back and he said his Stage 1+ head work would get it there, with the right cam and a good pipe.

[1FSTRK]

Eric, I have a guy that is wanting to do the same type of build as your friend, I talked to WFO Larry a while back and he said his Stage 1+ head work would get it there, with the right cam and a good pipe.

You will have to define "get it there"
We are trying to find some good graphs to look at. I see this as a question of "how much air can a 103 pull through a reworked OEM 50mm TB when the cam is limited by the stock piston compression" ?
Everyone has head work that will meet or exceed this build so that is not a main concern, the cam and head work must play well together to get the the most from the available tb flow and limited static compression.

If you take away the restrictions they all have a mid 120 square kit with pistons and big TB but that is not where we are headed, so can we see 110/110, or 115/115?
Most of what I see with the heads shaved will make higher tq but it seems the hp has been hanging in the 105-110 area.     

[dsvracer]

here is a dyno sheet of a 2012 with my street port and a Kuryakn 24d cam, stock throttle body, just blended the inside.
bike runs very good customer very happy.  dsv

[Durwood]

I haven't built it yet, so no sheet, and  110 square is what he wants, the torque should far exceed the goal.

If it comes through, my plan is a set of Larry's heads, set it up to come in at 200 ccp with a set of S&S 570's.

He already has VH Powerdual headpipe and IIRC, Crusher mufflers.

Leaving cyls and pistons intact and retaining stock TB.

[strokerjlk]

I am digging Eric.
this is a 2010 softtail . Dan bored this T/B as well. other than that... it fits your constraints.
pro pipe 2-1 had the plug in it .

[Don D]

Just had a shop call me and they used my Street Pro heads on a late model 103 Stock tb and injectors, Andrews 57, and V&H power duals and V&H mufflers, 9.9:1. Made 105/121. Just one of many. I will be seeing him and get the dyno.

Sounds like this is on the right track, I would like to see the graph when you get it.
Is that 105tq or hp
How much did you have to cut the heads to get 9.9:1 with stock pistons?

One head milled .002 to equalize at 84.6cc ea with a .040 head gasket. Looking back in my records I was mistaken this was done with our Street Pro TQ package which utilizes a 1.85 intake valve and proportionally smaller throat. 105hp 121tq

[N-gin]

I did stock pistons in my 103 with 555 cams stock heads. Did 88/105 on a bad tune. 94/108 on a good tune.

[1FSTRK]

here is a dyno sheet of a 2012 with my street port and a Kuryakn 24d cam, stock throttle body, just blended the inside.
bike runs very good customer very happy.  dsv

Dan this is the type of thing I was after. Is the 2012 Stock DBW throttle body the same size as the 2014 and up?
The one that strokerjlk posted looks close to this and also has your throttle body work.
Do you think that 110 is about the cap for these OEM DBW throttle bodies on a build like this?

[1FSTRK]

I am digging Eric.
this is a 2010 softtail . Dan bored this T/B as well. other than that... it fits your constraints.
pro pipe 2-1 had the plug in it .

Thanks Jim, looks good.
I have been thinking that I have not seen anything of this nature much above this level. I know Vic has said the cable TB's can be bored and worked to go well above what he can do with the DBW and that has been the limiter, once you go to the new TB it is not much more to finish the job and make the big hp.

[1FSTRK]

Just had a shop call me and they used my Street Pro heads on a late model 103 Stock tb and injectors, Andrews 57, and V&H power duals and V&H mufflers, 9.9:1. Made 105/121. Just one of many. I will be seeing him and get the dyno.

Sounds like this is on the right track, I would like to see the graph when you get it.
Is that 105tq or hp
How much did you have to cut the heads to get 9.9:1 with stock pistons?

One head milled .002 to equalize at 84.6cc ea with a .040 head gasket. Looking back in my records I was mistaken this was done with our Street Pro TQ package which utilizes a 1.85 intake valve and proportionally smaller throat. 105hp 121tq

Thanks for the info Don. Would you venture a guess on where the cap would be with your Street  Pro heads, I assume they have a bigger intake valve, or what ever head you recommend for a build with these limits?

[strokerjlk]

I am digging Eric.
this is a 2010 softtail . Dan bored this T/B as well. other than that... it fits your constraints.
pro pipe 2-1 had the plug in it .

Thanks Jim, looks good.
I have been thinking that I have not seen anything of this nature much above this level. I know Vic has said the cable TB's can be bored and worked to go well above what he can do with the DBW and that has been the limiter, once you go to the new TB it is not much more to finish the job and make the big hp.

I think the one i posted would have went 112/115 with the plug removed .
It's on a B motor also .

I done a couple SE 251/ 259's  that went similar peak numbers . 
Look at what a  SE stage 4 does with stock T/B .  Your just getting the compression a diff way .