Picked this up yesterday.

[sandrooney]

Its either a 48 with a 49 motor or a 49 with a 48 front end. How can I tell for sure ? Got lots of parts with it as well. I will try and post more pics

[sandrooney]

here is another pic

[sandrooney]

One more

[jmb79]

Looks like the start of a nice winter project. 

[calif phil]

Nice score.   Congrats

[2CLK1]

its hard to see in the photo but it looks like the heads are not plumber intake type but oring style
which makes the later production, I don't remember when they changed?
Still looks like a good project.

[crazy joe]

Nice : )

[hardheaded]

its hard to see in the photo but it looks like the heads are not plumber intake type but oring style
which makes the later production, I don't remember when they changed?
Still looks like a good project.

either that are it's had weld in inserts installed. common mod.

[Leed]

Sweet! 

[Snuff™]

Beginning of a nice project.  I've recently started a '49 FL project for a friend.

[jmorton10]

its hard to see in the photo but it looks like the heads are not plumber intake type but oring style
which makes the later production, I don't remember when they changed?

Not sure what year they changed, but my 57 Pan was all stock when I bought it (about 100 tears ago) & it had O-rings.

~John

[Snuff™]

For pans, '48-'54 plumber head.
From the pics, maybe an early '52 frame?

[freddie_ray]

If you need information on old Harleys try Todd. He's on InstaGram and You Tube.

Freddie_Ray

[sandrooney]

Thanks for the help. I will have some fun with it this winter.

[N-gin]

Ooooh nice!

[freddie_ray]

Heck I should have given you more info. it's HuntingHarleys.

Freddie_Rat 

[Speeding Big Twin]

Kevin, good score. Judging by the combination of top engine mount and by what appear to be horn mounts on the front downtubes, the frame appears to be 49, 50 or 51. However, the toolbox mount appears to be a type that is usually accepted as beginning with 1952 models but I can't tell if that mount is original to the frame. A close-up of the toolbox mount may tell us more and so may close-up photos of the horn mounts.

One side of the steering head may have forging number XE-35F? Can you confirm please. The other side may have a forging hallmark and a die number. What's the die number?
Left axle clip may have forging number XE-7? R-H axle clip may have XE-6? What die numbers are on the axle clips?
Front engine mount may have forging number 48-621? What's the die number there?

Under the R-H side of the heads, possibly between the pushrod holes, you may find casting numbers and date codes. What are they?
Thick twelve-hole D-rings didn't start until mid/later-55 models but I can't tell if they're H-D or AM. If they're H-D they could even have been six-holers originally (very late 54 and early-55) that were later converted to twelve-hole. Any numbers on top of the D-rings?

Any markings at the base of the cylinders? If no date codes, look closely for an indented casting number.

Under the trans case you may find casting number 121-35. Is there a date code under there?
Starter cover has a fluid level plug so that indicates the cover is 78 or later if H-D. Or the cover could be AM.
If the trans lid is H-D then it's very late 51 or later. I can't see provision for a switch. If no provision for a switch then the lid would be somewhere from very late 51 to 58 inclusive if H-D. Any markings on the lid?

F/FL engine or E/EL? If F/FL there may be a 7 stamped on top of each case near the rear engine mounting bolts. For 1949 models, H-D used at least two different types of 7. Photos?
Is the letter P stamped at the end of the serial number (SN) boss? And how is the SN in general? For example, I'd expect the 4 to be a certain style with an open top but there are some AM open-top 4s out there. If you're not sure about the SN you could post a photo of part of it and cover a few sequence characters. Or I could send you some photos for comparison.   

Belly numbers for 1949 Pans usually start with 249, regardless of engine size, but recently I was told of three 1949 Pans having belly numbers beginning with 149 which would be unusual although no pictures were posted and I was unable to follow up on those three engines. Do yours start with 249 or 149? Photos?
Eric

[sandrooney]

WOW SBT Thanks for all that info.
Here is what I found.
The left side of the steering head does have forging number XE-35F and the right side has forging hallmark and the number 20. The left axle clip has the forging number XE-7 and the right has the forging number XE-6. The front engine mount has the forging number 48L or E - 621. Unfortunately the frame was powder coated and that's all the numbers I could find and read.
The front head says 1948 and looks like K8 the rear says 19482 and looks like L8.
On the base of the front of the rear cylinder looks like 10-6.
The trans case has the casting number 121-35 and no switch or number on the top cover. It had this stamped by the adjusting bolt hole (see pic).
The 4 in the serial number is open top and looks to be a certain style. The belly numbers match and do start with 249.
Hope all this helps to determine the year.
Thanks so much for the help.
SR

[sandrooney]

Tool box mount

[sandrooney]

Horn mounts

[sandrooney]

The D-Rings have the number 17509-54A stamped on them. Here is a pic of the trans top cover. Thanks

[Speeding Big Twin]

Die number 20 on the steering head indicates a 1950 model frame according to Bruce Palmer's 37–64 second edition. The toolbox mount must have been added later because it looks like the 52–57 style.
 
Horn mounts look rounded on the corners and Palmer says that first happened with later-51 frames but your corners may have been rounded in preparation for powder coating. Two types of threaded holes in horn mounts and they may have told us something but it looks like yours have been filled.

Forging numbers on both axle clips are correct. With the powder coating the die numbers on the clips may be impossible to read but the left clip may have 13 or 14 while the R-H clip may have 8 or 9.

According to Palmer the forging number on the front engine mount for 1948–54 wishbone frames is 48-621 and he says this in the text on page 51 and in the chart on page 54. In the chart on page 55 he says 48E-621 was used for 1954–57 straight-leg frames but in the text on the same page (55) he says the number is 48-621 for 54–57 straight-legs. Below is a photo of a wishbone frame made in February 1953 and it has 48E-621. Then there's a forging hallmark and then die number 3:



Even though your frame is powder coated, can you read the die number on your front mount? It shouldn't be 3 though; instead it may be 2.

Casting number on the front head is probably 119 48 (the first 1 may be almost under the fin). Date code K8 indicates casting in 1948 in either November or October depending on whether or not the letter I was used.
Casting number on the rear head is probably 119 482. L8 indicates casting in 1948 in either December or November, again depending on whether or not the letter I was used. (Some Big Twin aluminium parts cast in 48 and 49 have M for December and that should mean that I was skipped. However, some of those same parts do indeed have the letter I and my research into this situation continues.)

If the rear cylinder has 10-6 then it may indicate casting in 1956 but that would normally be a 74ci cylinder because ELs weren't in general production after the 1952 model year. There should be a letter cast-in somewhere at the base and it may even be upside down. The letter indicates month of casting where A indicates January. For example, if you have A 10-6 then the cylinder was cast on January 10, 1956. For cast-iron parts such as cylinders there doesn't seem to be any confusion regarding the letter I and it seems that it was definitely skipped so J would indicate September, K indicates October, etc.

Casting number 121-35 on the trans is good but there should be a date code nearby. Depending on year the code may consist of a letter and a number or it may consist of numbers only.
If the trans lid has no provision for a switch then the lid is somewhere from very late 51 to 58 inclusive.
Characters stamped near the adjusting bolt hole are sometimes letters, sometimes numbers, and sometimes a combination of both. My best guess at this stage is that they were done by inspectors but I do not know for sure.

D-rings having 17509-54A on them is okay. It's a Harley part number and therefore it's unusual to see it on the part itself because normally a part number would only appear in the catalog and the part would have a different number on it.             

Open-top 4 in the SN sounds good, as do belly numbers starting with 249. I just tried to send you two photos for comparison but your inbox is full so I'll tune in again later on.
Eric

[sandrooney]

Eric, Thanks a lot for the time you took to put all this together it has been very helpful. I will check again on the front mount for the die number.
Thanks a lot,
Kevin

[BBQBIKER]

Nice score congrats!

[88b]

Nice