I am trying to write an EFI general tuning guide....

[UltraNutZ]

UltraNutZ  If you were purchasing a bike off Ebay and the seller said it was tuned by the guy selling it by looking at a scatter plot.  Trust me it is "Perfect" so don't look, what would you do?  Trust him or check the tune?

lol.. scatterplots.. those are toys for big boys like you Chad.. I'm content with my TTS graphs and charts.  If I have a need to look at 3rd party graphs because of an issue I can't isolate, I'll certainly use my purchased copy of MLVHD but those occasions are VERY rare to me, like really twice in 2+ years.  The bikes I build run well and street-tune well.  If they need more than street tuning, they go to someone a hell of a lot more competent than me.

[Jamie Long]

PV w/ AT110 kit.
Both wide and narrow bands istalled
using Dragula (original) provided bungs

Bought from Jamie, emailed (couple days ago) for help on this as well.
No reply just yet.

I did receive your email request for a tune revision with a copy of the tune you are running as well as a log, I responded this morning with a brief request for more data. Noted in your request were your modifications as well as some back history on your build. You also noted "The bike runs very well (fast) but mpg sucks, and it is clear that there are ares where it could run better in mid-range operations. I'm hoping you can improve this."

The first thing I noted in your log is that at the time the data was collected it was running in Auto Tune mode, AT-Pro specifically where the AF is set to 13.0. If you are able to get me another log under normal closed loop operation it will give me more data to work with. For channels you can go to datalog signals and select Narrowband Logging, and then add the Lambda front & rear from the Dynojet signals from any gauge screen and they will be added to your logs.

[masstch]

PV w/ AT110 kit.
Both wide and narrow bands installed
using Dragula (original) provided bungs
Bought from Jamie, emailed (couple days ago) for help on this as well.
No reply just yet.

I did receive your email request for a tune revision with a copy of the tune you are running as well as a log, I responded this morning with a brief request for more data. Noted in your request were your modifications as well as some back history on your build. You also noted "The bike runs very well (fast) but mpg sucks, and it is clear that there are areas where it could run better in mid-range operations. I'm hoping you can improve this."

The first thing I noted in your log is that at the time the data was collected it was running in Auto Tune mode, AT-Pro specifically where the AF is set to 13.0. If you are able to get me another log under normal closed loop operation it will give me more data to work with. For channels you can go to datalog signals and select Narrowband Logging, and then add the Lambda front & rear from the Dynojet signals from any gauge screen and they will be added to your logs.

Jamie, thanks for your reply here. I did save another (brief ) log that is available here:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/w9jpca9lurkl47x/log0112.csv?dl=0
I have also replied with attachment to your email.
Hopefully, there is useful data in that one.
The bike is apart just now, but hopefully, it goes back together Tuesday evening. I will save another log as soon as I can send it. I'm hoping to get this thing much better dialed-in.

[harleytuner]

UltraNutZ  If you were purchasing a bike off Ebay and the seller said it was tuned by the guy selling it by looking at a scatter plot.  Trust me it is "Perfect" so don't look, what would you do?  Trust him or check the tune?

lol.. scatterplots.. those are toys for big boys like you Chad.. I'm content with my TTS graphs and charts.  If I have a need to look at 3rd party graphs because of an issue I can't isolate, I'll certainly use my purchased copy of MLVHD but those occasions are VERY rare to me, like really twice in 2+ years.  The bikes I build run well and street-tune well.  If they need more than street tuning, they go to someone a hell of a lot more competent than me.

LOL, I don't use scatterplots.  I get all the info I need from live data and logs.  I too, have a paid version of MLVHD and use it, but not for the scatterplots. 

[whittlebeast]

HarleyTuner, too bad you have not figured out the scatter plot stuff.  You ought to see some of the stuff I am finding on the ITB installs.  It's really cool to see tuned length intakes work.  It turns out you can toggle from Speed Density to Alpha-N tuning based on either a MAP of about 80 KPA or a throttle position of 15-20%.  This stuff transitions like clockwork.  You can also see this stuff on the Dyno Sheets as the torque ramps up.

Andy

[harleytuner]

Maybe someday I'll take the time to study it more, but (unfortunately/fortunately) time is something I just don't have a lot of at this point. 

[glens]

HarleyTuner, too bad you have not figured out the scatter plot stuff.  You ought to see some of the stuff I am finding on the ITB installs.  It's really cool to see tuned length intakes work.  It turns out you can toggle from Speed Density to Alpha-N tuning based on either a MAP of about 80 KPA or a throttle position of 15-20%.  This stuff transitions like clockwork.  You can also see this stuff on the Dyno Sheets as the torque ramps up.

Andy

Is "ITB" an air-cooled or a liquid-cooled Harley?

[whittlebeast]

ITB is Independent Throttle Body.  It does not matter if it is air cooled or not.

http://thekneeslider.com/images/2014/10/streettracker2.jpg

Andy

[masstch]

http://thekneeslider.com/images/2014/10/streettracker2.jpg
[/quote

Forbidden 403

[whittlebeast]

Try this

https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:H-D_XR750_Team_Latus_engine_right.JPG#mw-jump-to-license

These are too short but you can get the idea.

Andy

[whittlebeast]

Here is the setup in one of my personal cars.

http://www.nbs-stl.com/CRX/CRX%20Intake.jpg

Torque peaks at 5400 but we can pull it to 8400

[harleytuner]

Try this

https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:H-D_XR750_Team_Latus_engine_right.JPG#mw-jump-to-license

These are too short but you can get the idea.

Andy

You finally posted a picture worth looking at!!    Here's one I restored a couple years ago.

[glens]

HarleyTuner, too bad you have not figured out the scatter plot stuff.  You ought to see some of the stuff I am finding on the ITB installs.  It's really cool to see tuned length intakes work.  It turns out you can toggle from Speed Density to Alpha-N tuning based on either a MAP of about 80 KPA or a throttle position of 15-20%.  This stuff transitions like clockwork.  You can also see this stuff on the Dyno Sheets as the torque ramps up.

Andy

So the Delphi ECM on our bikes is programmed to switch between the the two modes how?

Or in this case does "ITB" more appropriately mean "Impertinent Throttle Bodies"?

[whittlebeast]

The Harley ECU does not switch but other bikes do and this is a general tuning guide.

[Durwood]

Try this

https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:H-D_XR750_Team_Latus_engine_right.JPG#mw-jump-to-license

These are too short but you can get the idea.

Andy

You finally posted a picture worth looking at!!    Here's one I restored a couple years ago.

Very nice Chad

[harleytuner]

Try this

https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:H-D_XR750_Team_Latus_engine_right.JPG#mw-jump-to-license

These are too short but you can get the idea.

Andy

You finally posted a picture worth looking at!!    Here's one I restored a couple years ago.

Very nice Chad

Thanks.  The only things that are not OEM are the cables, hoses, some of the wiring and the outer rim on the front wheel. This bike was raced it's whole life, when it came to us the frame was painted blue and there was 4-5 coats of paint on the body work.  I got all the paint stripped and it's back to the original orange gelcoat from HD.  We even managed to source new old stock decals.  I did all the powder coating at my personal shop, the frame is the original color and the yellow (shock) are a very close match to the original color.  (I blended 3 powders to get that yellow)

[whittlebeast]

In the interest of keeping the thread from being too hijacked, did you tune it?  What HP did you wind up with?  What was the size of the motor if you dynoed it?

[masstch]

For the record, Jamie did send me a modified tune based on the .pvv and the .csv that I linked in this thread.
I'm deep into transmission stuff but hopefully It'll be rolling later tonite..

[harleytuner]

In the interest of keeping the thread from being too hijacked, did you tune it?  What HP did you wind up with?  What was the size of the motor if you dynoed it?

It's funny you bring up keeping a thread on topic  that is an XR 750, yes I tuned it, I dint recall the numbers those.  In stock form they didn't make a ton, high 50's low 60's possibly, I really don't recall.  This one was a very high dollar restoration, I had to re-degree the cams back to stock.  I've tuned a bunch of flat track bikes over the years.

[BVHOG]

Try this

https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:H-D_XR750_Team_Latus_engine_right.JPG#mw-jump-to-license

These are too short but you can get the idea.

Andy

You finally posted a picture worth looking at!!    Here's one I restored a couple years ago.

Damn nice looking bike and I don't care if you tuned it or not. Betting if you did you used one of those inferior dynos though.