M8 trans fluid leaking in primary

[FSG]

   might have better luck looking for a C2   

[masterp]

Not all 8970A bearings have the same cage.  Or, at least, not all are installed with the cage facing the same direction.  Sometimes the ball bearings are visible, other times the ball bearings are covered when viewed from the outside.

[masterp]

... take some pics of what's actually there for bearings and what type they are.

Not mine, but a picture of a '17 touring transmission nonetheless (according to the seller).  There are pictures of all the other angles on the ad as well.  I can only make out the bearing number on the countershaft and it's an 8970A.

[Bike31]

... take some pics of what's actually there for bearings and what type they are.

Not mine, but a picture of a '17 touring transmission nonetheless (according to the seller).  There are pictures of all the other angles on the ad as well.  I can only make out the bearing number on the countershaft and it's an 8970A.

Interesting and thanks for the pic. Look at Post #244 above and compare. In that pic it was reported the M8 uses the 35260-06B  BEARING HOUSING. The left input shaft bearing on the -06B looks different that pic, and the ad pic appears to dupe the pre-2016 -06A housing with similar 8970A bearings.

In raised letters above the bearings is written (I think!) 35053-06. That's for earlier 6-speed units.

[masterp]

Yep, I noticed that too.  I found that same picture of the M8, shown in post 244, online.  It's taken from a full picture of the plant assembly line and is in a bunch of places and is the only one I've found.  I edited and zoomed in and the same part number with no rev B on it either.  Who knows.  Maybe early castings were not yet revised. 

It would still be nice to see what a person with a known problem bike has/sees.

[masterp]

Ok, I have no idea how to attach a hi res image but it's out there in Google image.

[Bike31]

Short of FSG's contribution of pics I've yet to see anything similar from the afflicted M8's that are transferring trans oil. On the HD Forum a member (SC) has ordered a set of current right side trans shaft bearings to compare with those installed in test bikes. Theory being they're maybe part of the problem.

If I had one doing that I'd have the Dealer take a look and pics. Some reportedly have had some or all of their trans replaced, and today it was mentioned HD has some form of heads up bulletin regarding the issue. No solution reported though.

Gary

[FSG]

Not mine, but a picture of a '17 touring transmission nonetheless (according to the seller).  There are pictures of all the other angles on the ad as well.  I can only make out the bearing number on the countershaft and it's an 8970A.

While I cannot say that it's NOT a pic of a '17  P/N 35260-06B  BEARING HOUSING,  I'll say that I'd expect to be able to see the scissor on that scissor gear.

Please remember that 35260-06B is a Part Number, what we see on the housing 35053-06, is a casting number.

[masterp]

Nope, there is definitely no scissor gear anywhere in that transmission being sold as a '17 touring. 

[Karl H.]

? ? ? 

[103eagle]

Here is the modified one.
[attach=0]

Durwood, how bout an update?  Has the gasket fix continued to work?  Been some time since you posted and were testing.

Thanks in advance

Eagle Out

[harleytuner]

Tune one yesterday, had the 114 kit with Head Hoggers heads and Woods cams, after tree tune I drained the trans - 20oz.  Primary - 35 oz (I spilled a little though) I currently habe the primary off, it's getting a Scorpion basket in it today).  I didn't check sumping yet but I'm suspecting it as well. 

[rbabos]

Don't think the bearing itself has anything to do with it. More likely the amount of oil from the back side transferring through it and onto the hole area for the clutch pushrod. Where's the scissor gear and does it add extra oiling to this bearing. Something as simple as a shield on the outboard side of this bearing could solve it if there's too much oil fed in the inboard side.
Ron

[Bike31]

https://serviceinfo.harley-davidson.com/sip/service/document/79422#TRANSMISSION_GEARS

P/N 27 1st gear on the countershaft.

Gary

[Durwood]

Here is the modified one.
[attach=0]

Durwood, how bout an update?  Has the gasket fix continued to work?  Been some time since you posted and were testing.

Thanks in advance

Eagle Out

I am covered up here at the shop, will post an update when I get a chance to put some more dyno time on it.

Daren

[rbabos]

https://serviceinfo.harley-davidson.com/sip/service/document/79422#TRANSMISSION_GEARS

P/N 27 1st gear on the countershaft.

Gary

Thanks. Don't see any connection to the problem with that gear. For some reason there has to be a collection of oil between that bearing and the clutch slave area. Don't think venting is the issue because once hot venting is quite none existent . If the oil head is higher then the hole in this bearing/slave area it will just flow into the primary in this non venting state. Basically gravity flow. The higher the rpm, the more oil and higher head is what I'm thinking.
Ron

[harleytuner]

Tune one yesterday, had the 114 kit with Head Hoggers heads and Woods cams, after tree tune I drained the trans - 20oz.  Primary - 35 oz (I spilled a little though) I currently habe the primary off, it's getting a Scorpion basket in it today).  I didn't check sumping yet but I'm suspecting it as well.

I just saw a typo in my previous post.  It was 38 oz i drained pout of the primary.  I pulled the sump plug today and got 18 out of out and that was after idling for 3 minutes or so.   This was a dealer build and they told him its covered on the warranty.   They said they never heard of either of these issue's so i sent the owner the link to this thread as the other forum. it'll be interesting if they chime in.

[FSG]

Don't think the bearing itself has anything to do with it.

    but it's a new bearing and I'd like to know what it is and perhaps why the change,  it may be beefier and have something to do with wide transmission cases that we may see in 2018

[mchertel]

I have read in this forum and the HDF that some believe this issue is only happening on the "older" releases?  Is there any empirical data on this as far as build dates?  Realizing that the engine build date is not the same as the stamp on the completed bike so even if this is true there will be a grey area at best?  Just curious what the data shows.

And as a note, call me stupid but the CVO 114 is so much nicer than the UL 103 I had (even after upgrades on the 103 and maybe due to the upgrades!!) I bought it even knowing about this issue.  I now have 1000 miles on it and have checked the transmission fluid every 200 miles or so and it's still good to go.  This to me proves that this issue is not happening when keeping the bike below about 3500 RPM's for 5 minute cycles etc...  I do shift at higher than 3500 at times but not close to always.  Or HD secretly fixed the later runs.....which I doubt.

Finally as mentioned previously, thanks to all that are pouring their time and attention into this issue.  For now I am going to ride more, worry less, and check for updates here!!

[SLAATY]

Welp, add mine to the list. '17 FLHR currently running stage 2 - torque cams, street cannons and a heavy breather all tied together with the moco's street tuner.

8,100 mi., had the 1k service done back when. I ride conservatively, shifting around 2700 generally. Noticed low trans fluid when I did my own 5k service and topped off. After catching this post I rechecked and found it low again, so I decided to stand the bike up and pop the derby cover. Fluid came out just popping it loose, and was level with the hole. Drained enough to level it again as I used Formula + in both holes.

Gonna call my dealer tomorrow.

[misfitJason]

Maybe this is a all a plan by the MOCO to get more fluid to the compensator!

[rbabos]

Maybe this is a all a plan by the MOCO to get more fluid to the compensator!

Too late. I guess the guy never got the memo.
Ron

[Buglet]

    Just service one the other day. Went on 900 mile trip never over 3500 lost 7 oz out of trans. into primary.

[bigal51]

My M-8 is doing it too.  last change 22oz in trans and 40oz in primary.

[Durwood]

These latest reports are encouraging, as mine still hasn't moved with the modified gasket.

400 plus miles and a complete dyno tune with 30 plus max power runs, with more dyno time coming very soon.