M8 trans fluid leaking in primary

[stro1965]

Add me to the list of folks seeing oil migrate from the transmission to the primary. Just 400 miles after the 1K service on my '17 I decided to have a look. The dipstick was dry and the primary was overflowing. I'm estimating that about 8 ounces migrated over in just 400 miles. Now, that said, I don't ride this bike like most folks do. This Road King was purchased almost exclusively as a cone competition bike, and I'm on that clutch all the time. Definitely gets ridden like a cop bike. That might explain the excess migration in my case. Dropped off at the dealership today. They claimed to have never heard of this issue and had not seen the TSB.

[Ohio HD]

Looks like it presses over the end of the mainshaft. Not much for it to grip to.   

[1FSTRK]

They have come up with a small seal that goes on the clutch pushrod, there is a pic over on HDF. Looks like it's pressed on to the nut on the mainshaft bearing, owner says it was installed 11/30, too cold to test it out yet.

If they can keep it in place it will sure slow down the tranfer. It will not fix the engineering flaw that traps the oil  above the main shaft but it is a cheap bandaid so HD will use it to get the public off their case and they will quietly make a proper change on a different model year. No defect, no recall.

[PoorUB]

Here it is,

[FSG]

    well at least they're doing something, but ......... 

they'd be better to use a better flangenut with a mating face seal fitted to the inner side cover, but then they would need to vent the slave cavity back to the trannie

[FSG]

Looks like it presses over the end of the mainshaft. Not much for it to grip to.

it'll probably press  into the mainshaft as well

[1FSTRK]

 There is the problem with any type of seal/baffle compared to removing the trapped oil, it could turn the slave cylinder into a diaphram pump, and  they can't totally seal the end of the shaft because it is still the only primary vent. 

[PoorUB]

I was trying to understand what they are trying to do here, seal the push rod? Seal the end of the shaft to the slave cylinder? Either way, how does the primary vent? Are they sealing the shaft to the slave and the rod, but allowing air to pass on the back side, (tranny side), of the seal? What happens if the area behind the slave eventually fills with oil?

I wonder what would happen if they drilled a 1/8" hole in the main shaft, under the output gear. They could seal the end of the mainshaft, and the mainshaft spinning would spin any oil out the hole, and the primary would still vent through the hole.

[1FSTRK]

That would work in the future but costly as a retro on the bike that are out there.

The trouble is that they created this problem so undoing the design mistake would be a better fix, maybe they could call 1984 and find out what made this system work for over 30 years until they "fixed it"

[Durwood]

Here it is,

Forward progress 

[rbabos]

They have come up with a small seal that goes on the clutch pushrod, there is a pic over on HDF. Looks like it's pressed on to the nut on the mainshaft bearing, owner says it was installed 11/30, too cold to test it out yet.

If it in fact seals the pushrod,  the primary will not vent then. A separate vent is needed.
Ron

[Bigtwin]

I have this piece in my bike since earlier. Return trip of 80 Km: nothing to report. I'll tell you later if it's OK.

[Karl H.]

 

[08flstf]

Haven't read or heard anything lately. Has this issue been resolved yet or not?

[hattitude]

Haven't read or heard anything lately. Has this issue been resolved yet or not?

Nope....

On another forum I read, the new super fix by the MoCo is not a fix after all... it was a button-looking cap on the end of the pushrod...

It helped some, did nothing for others...

The MoCo continues to search for a band-aide fix, rather than the proper fix (which they probably know by now) that would cost way too money...

The same can be said for their sumping issue...

[PoorUB]

And the longer they drag it out, the more bikes will need to be repaired.

They should just fix it with whatever means necessary and repair the rest as needed. It seems not all are affected so I don't see it being a recall issue, but as the bikes come in that transfer oil, fix them! Pick a number, if it transfers 4 ounces in 1,000 miles, then fix it. I don't see it affecting more than a few thousand motorcycles as it seems many out there have never heard of it.

[Jim Bronson]

It is kinda hard for me to believe that they have had an engineering team working on this for six+ months with no permanent fix in sight. It seems like it isn't very high on their priority list.

[hattitude]

It is kinda hard for me to believe that they have had an engineering team working on this for six+ months with no permanent fix in sight. It seems like it isn't very high on their priority list.

I believe they know full well how to fix it, and fix it properly...

But someone has decided the fix is too expensive, so they're experimenting with cheap, partial, band-aide fixes..... hoping to save face (not have to admit to a big engineering mistake) and money (cheap bolt-on fix v  re-engineering a part).....

[1FSTRK]

It is kinda hard for me to believe that they have had an engineering team working on this for six+ months with no permanent fix in sight. It seems like it isn't very high on their priority list.

I believe they know full well how to fix it, and fix it properly...

But someone has decided the fix is too expensive, so they're experimenting with cheap, partial, band-aide fixes..... hoping to save face (not have to admit to a big engineering mistake) and money (cheap bolt-on fix v  re-engineering a part).....

We have a winner

To engineer a true fix is to admit the original design was flawed and that means they would have to provide the new design to all owners back to the Rushmore bikes that used it.

[PoorUB]

It is kinda hard for me to believe that they have had an engineering team working on this for six+ months with no permanent fix in sight. It seems like it isn't very high on their priority list.

I believe they know full well how to fix it, and fix it properly...

But someone has decided the fix is too expensive, so they're experimenting with cheap, partial, band-aide fixes..... hoping to save face (not have to admit to a big engineering mistake) and money (cheap bolt-on fix v  re-engineering a part).....

We have a winner

To engineer a true fix is to admit the original design was flawed and that means they would have to provide the new design to all owners back to the Rushmore bikes that used it.

Harley does "improvements" all the time and does not do anything on previous models, mainshaft on the six speeds was one, total change of the cams and chains in '06-'07. 25MM wheel bearings going to a A the B suffix, but no problems mentioned. How many different TC breather assemblies are there, four? No problems there either, just and improvement if even mentioned. I am sure there is many more.

HD will find a cure and it will show up as an running change in 2019, and mention something about "improved primary and transmission venting", it will retrofit back a couple years and nothing more will be said about it. Perhaps dealers will get a service bulletin about it getting applied to earlier models if the customer has a complaint of oil transfer. It will be touted as a great improvement over earlier models then swept under the rug like it has been done many times before.

[Moparnut72]

Does this problem occur in all TC late models or certain ones. I have a '17 Slim. Guess I better check it.
kk

[rigidthumper]

Does this problem occur in all TC late models or certain ones. I have a '17 Slim. Guess I better check it.
kk

Bulletin TA0022 applies to only touring models for 2014-2018

[Moparnut72]

Thanks
kk

[PoorUB]

Does this problem occur in all TC late models or certain ones. I have a '17 Slim. Guess I better check it.
kk

Touring only and limited number of motorcycles. I have 18,500 miles om my 2016 Limited and no oil transfer issues.

[Jim Bronson]

22K on my 2015 RK and no transfer issues.