M8 trans fluid leaking in primary

[PoorUB]

It vents through the mainshaft, to the slave cylinder and out a small hole at the top of the slave to inside the dummy cover over the end of the tranny. The dummy cover is open to atmosphere.

[rbabos]

Ron, I believe the primary vents directly to the slave cylinder cavity then out the drilled hole to the side cover.

Brian

Yes, I understand that and that's fine. It's with the addition of this seal, primary venting is stopped, assuming the seal is actually sealing.
Ron

We are either both right or both missing the same thing on this one.
Once that seal is in the nut and the pushrod is installed, the primary is sealed. You can vent the slave cavity all you want.

Maybe we are a couple of oddballs in how we think?
Ron

[To The Max]

Just a thought ,how is the push rod lube'd now that the seal is stopping the gearbox oil ?? max

[rbabos]

Just a thought ,how is the push rod lube'd now that the seal is stopping the gearbox oil ?? max

Not much needed for that. It would creep along the rod with capillary action from the other end , just from normal use.
Ron

[harley_cruiser]

Ron, I believe the primary vents directly to the slave cylinder cavity then out the drilled hole to the side cover.

Brian

Yes, I understand that and that's fine. It's with the addition of this seal, primary venting is stopped, assuming the seal is actually sealing.
Ron

We are either both right or both missing the same thing on this one.
Once that seal is in the nut and the pushrod is installed, the primary is sealed. You can vent the slave cavity all you want.

Maybe we are a couple of oddballs in how we think?
Ron

Ron I believe it is going to vent through the push rod tube, between the actuator and the cap then to the backside of the Actuator and then back through the new hole that he drilled into the trans case the out the original vent. At least how I understand it.

[harley_cruiser]

Just a thought ,how is the push rod lube'd now that the seal is stopping the gearbox oil ?? max

Not much needed for that. It would creep along the rod with capillary action from the other end , just from normal use.
Ron

Delete

[rbabos]

Ron, I believe the primary vents directly to the slave cylinder cavity then out the drilled hole to the side cover.

Brian

Yes, I understand that and that's fine. It's with the addition of this seal, primary venting is stopped, assuming the seal is actually sealing.
Ron

We are either both right or both missing the same thing on this one.
Once that seal is in the nut and the pushrod is installed, the primary is sealed. You can vent the slave cavity all you want.

Maybe we are a couple of oddballs in how we think?
Ron

Ron I believe it is going to vent through the push rod tube, between the actuator and the cap then to the backside of the Actuator and then back through the new hole that he drilled into the trans case the out the original vent. At least how I understand it.

Are these pushrods not solid, unlike lifter pushrods that have a hole in the middle. If a hole, then it would vent. No hole, no venting.
Ron

[PoorUB]

Ron I believe it is going to vent through the push rod tube, between the actuator and the cap then to the backside of the Actuator and then back through the new hole that he drilled into the trans case the out the original vent. At least how I understand it.

Read my post, #825. It vents outside, not to the transmission. Look up an online parts retailer, and look at the tranny brake down. Once you seal the end of the shaft there is no way for oil to get back into the tranny. He was showing a hole in the top of the slave cylinder, it would vent under the dummy tranny cover.

[rbabos]

Ron I believe it is going to vent through the push rod tube, between the actuator and the cap then to the backside of the Actuator and then back through the new hole that he drilled into the trans case the out the original vent. At least how I understand it.

Read my post, #825. It vents outside, not to the transmission. Look up an online parts retailer, and look at the tranny brake down. Once you seal the end of the shaft there is no way for oil to get back into the tranny. He was showing a hole in the top of the slave cylinder, it would vent under the dummy tranny cover.

So, is there a hole in the middle of the pushrod or not? That changes things.
Ron

[PoorUB]

So, is there a hole in the middle of the pushrod or not? That changes things.
Ron

No, it just vents around the outside of the pushrod and the hole through the main shaft.

[rbabos]

So, is there a hole in the middle of the pushrod or not? That changes things.
Ron

No, it just vents around the outside of the pushrod and the hole through the main shaft.

So, it's back to how can the primary vent if a seal stops that original process.
Ron

[harley_cruiser]

Ron I believe it is going to vent through the push rod tube, between the actuator and the cap then to the backside of the Actuator and then back through the new hole that he drilled into the trans case the out the original vent. At least how I understand it.

Read my post, #825. It vents outside, not to the transmission. Look up an online parts retailer, and look at the tranny brake down. Once you seal the end of the shaft there is no way for oil to get back into the tranny. He was showing a hole in the top of the slave cylinder, it would vent under the dummy tranny cover.

I believe there is a cavity in between the slave and the plate that it sits on. Do you have photo of the slave?

[harley_cruiser]

Personally I Like PoorUb Idea about the slinger, except I would use a bushing inside the shaft instead of the o-ring on the shaft.



I would make it tapered so that when the shaft turned the centrifugal force would push the oil back into the transmission, make it press fit into the shaft hole, and leave enough space between the shaft and the bushing for the primary to breath.
You could also put another bushing on the shaft or O-ring on the shaft to sling the oil off the shaft before it got to the bushing inside the shaft.
Make the bushing out of Teflon.
The oil is getting into the shaft, and there is nothing to stop it from going all the way through.
And yes I know the drawing is out of porportion and that there is not much room for a bushing.

[kd]

Without a vent from the primary isn't there a risk of pushing oil vapor into the starter?   

[1FSTRK]

Ok
Watch this and then reread the last two pages of this thread, then tell me what you think.
https://youtu.be/kTcRRaXV-fg

[harley_cruiser]

Without a vent from the primary isn't there a risk of pushing oil vapor into the starter?   

Is that directed at my post? You would leave enough room between the bushing and the shaft for the primary to vent to the transmission.

[PoorUB]

So, is there a hole in the middle of the pushrod or not? That changes things.
Ron

No, it just vents around the outside of the pushrod and the hole through the main shaft.

So, it's back to how can the primary vent if a seal stops that original process.
Ron

The seal rides on the shaft nut, not the push rod.

[crewchief25H]

Here is what was done to my 18. Press fit, tapped in with a driver and mallet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=annxgu8HknQ

[kd]

Without a vent from the primary isn't there a risk of pushing oil vapor into the starter?   

Is that directed at my post? You would leave enough room between the bushing and the shaft for the primary to vent to the transmission.

Not at all. I have been following this thread after reading the one the link was to in the other forum where they are machining a nut for a pushrod seal. My thought is, if you seal of the only vent (which is through the trans, the next likely route is through the starter armature brg.. I can't imagine that seal is spec;d for that kind of duty but maybe it is.

[1FSTRK]

So, is there a hole in the middle of the pushrod or not? That changes things.
Ron

No, it just vents around the outside of the pushrod and the hole through the main shaft.

So, it's back to how can the primary vent if a seal stops that original process.
Ron

The seal rides on the shaft nut, not the push rod.

OK
One seal on the nut OD No seal on the nut ID against the pushrod, makes more sense now.

[rbabos]

Without a vent from the primary isn't there a risk of pushing oil vapor into the starter?   

Is that directed at my post? You would leave enough room between the bushing and the shaft for the primary to vent to the transmission.

Not at all. I have been following this thread after reading the one the link was to in the other forum where they are machining a nut for a pushrod seal. My thought is, if you seal of the only vent (which is through the trans, the next likely route is through the starter armature brg.. I can't imagine that seal is spec;d for that kind of duty but maybe it is.

That pic fooled me to on the sealing part. Lighten up the pic to see the inner part of the seal. It has no contact on the shaft basically so the concerns of venting are none existant since there is no sealing. This is the fix?
Ron

[koko3052]

Stronger glasses Ron.

[HOGROD]

I drained my primary and trans last night after noticing no fluid on the trans dipstick for a while now and have mentioned it to the dealer when they had it in replacing a blown oil pressure switch that dumped all my oil on the ground and left me stranded. Yes I had it in to get fixed and they couldn't figure it out until it stranded me.

Anyways they said the level was fine, just where it should be. So I drain them, the primary had 40 ounces and the trans had 22 ounces. I'm sure the primary would have had more had I been adding fluid to it. It had been 4,200 miles since the last fluid change so I have no idea how long it had been low. I did notice the bike grinds really bad going into first gear when it's cold. I have to let it warm up before attempting to try first gear.

I seen on the HD forum where someone mentioned this fix and I'm going to ask my dealer if it will be possible to get it or I will just pay out of pocket for it. I believe they were using a 2014 CVO for the parts. I apologize if it had been posted I didn't read all the pages. I just wanted to post it in case it hadn't been linked here.

"In the German V-Twin forum some are reporting that the migration has stopped after changing the clutch pushrod to a larger diameter version of a former CVO model. Bellow the replacement parts:

11143 Retaining Ring
37909-90 Retaining Ring
37092-06 Clutch Release Rod
37000113 Clutch Rod End
37000112 Pushrod , Clutch Release Plate"

Here's the link to the post, #1898

https://www.hdforums.com/forum/milwaukee-eight-m8/1175678-who-s-been-having-to-add-transmission-fluid-190.html

[rbabos]

So, what is the clearance between the pushrod and mainshaft bore in these M8s?
Ron

[harley_cruiser]

Without a vent from the primary isn't there a risk of pushing oil vapor into the starter?   

Is that directed at my post? You would leave enough room between the bushing and the shaft for the primary to vent to the transmission.

Not at all. I have been following this thread after reading the one the link was to in the other forum where they are machining a nut for a pushrod seal. My thought is, if you seal of the only vent (which is through the trans, the next likely route is through the starter armature brg.. I can't imagine that seal is spec;d for that kind of duty but maybe it is.

That pic fooled me to on the sealing part. Lighten up the pic to see the inner part of the seal. It has no contact on the shaft basically so the concerns of venting are none existant since there is no sealing. This is the fix?
Ron

Even if it works, it's to complicated, Harley will never steal it.
I've got a main shaft, push rod and some supplies coming. Oil sling on the push rod and a dam in the hole of the cylinder.