HarleyTechTalk

Mayor, don't tear up your sniffer just yet. I'm trying to find where I read that a sniffer shouldn't have lead joints, but can't confirm yet. 50/50 melts at 400F, I don't know how hot a sniffer will get.

To those guys that weld on bungs to the exhaust;
Do you weld the bung on the back side of the pipe  or on a more accessible area that requires removing the heat shield? I hope this question makes sense and doesn't sound too dum.

Quote from: harleytoprock on February 08, 2009, 06:41:52 PM
To those guys that weld on bungs to the exhaust;
Do you weld the bung on the back side of the pipe  or on a more accessible area that requires removing the heat shield? I hope this question makes sense and doesn't sound too dum.

my plans are to weld on the back side like the factory bungs.  I'm actually putting factory take off '07 head pipes on one of my '02 dynas.   

Since I planned to use Harley 02 sensors, I thought it would be best to put them exactly where Harley puts them, in addition they're pretty much hidden, but easily accessible.

Quote from: fuzznut5197 on February 08, 2009, 06:15:17 PM
Mayor, don't tear up your sniffer just yet. I'm trying to find where I read that a sniffer shouldn't have lead joints, but can't confirm yet. 50/50 melts at 400F, I don't know how hot a sniffer will get.

keep me updated.  I'm not sure how much of an issue it would be anyway.  I used flux on the threads, then threaded in as much as I could (just about bottom of ring), then soldered the connection. There's probably very little if any solder that made it past the threads. 

I just had to trim the heat shield slightly- '01 Dyna SE 2-1 exhaust

I also used factory takeoff headers.

I highly recommend one for everyone who is attempting to tune their own bike. Here is an opportunity for those of us who have and use them to share our opinions, the pro's and cons of the instruments we have, and why we selected the one we did.   

I use the RSR for it's durability (water, weather) it's ease of installation, and use. I have it permanently mounted, it's simple, accurate, and easy to use.

>Fire it up<

Done.

http://harleytechtalk.net/htt/index.php?topic=5848.0

Quote from: mayor on February 08, 2009, 06:51:27 PM
keep me updated.  I'm not sure how much of an issue it would be anyway.  I used flux on the threads, then threaded in as much as I could (just about bottom of ring), then soldered the connection. There's probably very little if any solder that made it past the threads. 

I can't find where I read it. It was someone's personal opinion, and there are no cautions from any other sources, so I would say you're good to go. 

RE: my afr stuff, I'm bizzy, and will put the full story in afr zone, but for now here's the rear cyl:

this whole thread should be moved to AFR, and .....maybe even made a sticky ?

lotta good info here, might as well keep it easy to find

well, since this thread is about meters.......here's my newly acquired WEGO:

...and here's the wiring mess that comes with it:

The WEGO has the wide band sensor which allows the user to use a pipe sniffer. 

....still haven't WEGO'd anything yet.....

Quote from: mayor on February 08, 2009, 07:10:55 AM
Fuzz, you could always start a new thread in the AFR section...

Done

I bought one of the Edelbrock units, picked up a front pipe off E-bay for cheap which I brought to a muffler shop and had them weld the bung in place and was good to go.  I ride a FLHT without a radio so I installed the meter in the rear of the "glovebox" opening.  Not always trusting that the calibration of the unit was on mark, I used a smooth idle mixture reading as my base.   It appears to read a bit rich - the bike runs best, plugs look best, idles best when jetted to at 13:1.  Planning to get a comparison reading this spring so I validate its accuracy - CWO

2005 FLHT

HD Oil Press Gauge
Wally's Oil Temp Gauge
95" KB 9.25 pistons (0.30 over) 9.7:1 static with milling
Big Boyz heads (83cc)
Cometic .030 Head Gasket
Andrews 26g cams
185-190psi ccp
HD SE Billet camplate and pump
LMR pressure spring
Mikuni 42 carb (22.5 pilot/160 main/50 accel/98 needle)
Daytona Twin Tec Ignition Module
Fullsac Duals
Wild Pig mufflers with Rush 2 1/2 inch baffles
Easy Clutch ramp
SE HD Clutch Spring
Hayden M-6 Auto Primary Chain Tensioner
Compu-fire 1084 starter gear
All-Balls starter clutch
Shimmed compensator nut
Throttle-Up stabilizer
Mustang Solo Seat w/Backrest
Edelbrock 6593 AFR Gauge
Floating Front Rotors
HD push button fuel cap release
Spotlights wired independent of Hi/Lo Beams
Extended shifter

Rumor has it, 13.2 is the sweet spot. I imagine 13.1 is close enough.

Quote from: PanHeadRed on February 13, 2009, 05:20:57 PM
Rumor has it, 13.2 is the sweet spot. I imagine 13.1 is close enough.

just a rumor, don't forget you can't believe everything you read on the internet.   

!ROFLMAO!

Good one.

Quote from: Evo160K on February 07, 2009, 08:47:04 PM
Crazycalvin,
One is a Harley the other is an Airtex, both are two-wire, both work fine.  I verified the gauge and system using cheap sensors from the junk yard, about $6 each, before I invested in new sensors and permanent wiring.  Believe me the cheap ones worked well.

If I were doing it again and didn't want to build a meter, I would go with the Edlebrock meter referenced above.  It's very reasonable and has everything you need.  Like I said, if you want to monitor both cylinders, you can buy a second 02 sensor and toggle switch between them using one meter and two 02 sensors.

Frankly, I'm not so sure accuracy with respect to a test gas is that critical.  As long as the sensor gives repeatable readings, you adjust for the best running engine for that rpm.  You know from experience when your engine sounds and feels happy.  For a carbed bike I wouldn't invest a lot of money.

Correct me if i am wrong but it's my understanding that the sensors require constant voltage to the heaters to prolong their life. So if you switch between two sensors to meter one then it is necessary to make sure you wire the switch in a way that the sensor heater is always energized.

Sportgordy,
That's probably correct because according to Edlebrock the sensors do have an internal heater, they're three-wire.  The Harley and Airtex sensors I'm using are two-wire and don't have an internal heater, so I'm confident toggling between two unheated sensors is fine.

Quote from: Evo160K on February 16, 2009, 10:49:06 AM
Sportgordy,
That's probably correct because according to Edlebrock the sensors do have an internal heater, they're three-wire.  The Harley and Airtex sensors I'm using are two-wire and don't have an internal heater, so I'm confident toggling between two unheated sensors is fine.

Evo160K
I thought i would mention as i was not sure myself. I did spend some time reading tech bulletions over at DTT and learned the wide bands do indeed have heaters which needs a constant voltage. I'm not familiar with Harley and Airtex sensors but it sounds like you have a handle on them and your good to go . I am curious how your meter works out. I'm thinking of doing something similar, but in my case, i would like to find a dual (round) meter, one that would fit in my fairing to replace the existing outside temp. Good luck with your install, again lets us know how it worked out

Sportgordy,

RSR has a nice looking, round, dual gauge about a third of the way down this site: 
http://www.rbracing-rsr.com/rsrgauge.htm

My meter works well, I'm very satisfied with it, particularly since it cost so little.  I installed it in August and spent a week riding in Colorado.  I have an individual runner, intake manifold, so I'm able to tune each cylinder individually.  I can tune for power or economy.  I got 43-53 mpg packing double with luggage, 57 riding solo on one leg.  Both sensors are narrow band, but if you think about it, you're really only interested in being in a narrow a/f band.  Anything outside, either way, and you adjust to get back into the narrow band.  It takes longer to get to operating temperature, I'm told, than heated sensors, but it's not an issue.  After all, Harley uses narrow band sensors with their EFI.  Let me know if I can assist in any way.  Good luck. 

First off: Evo thanks for the reply that you posted way back when in this thread to the question  that I asked you.  Second:  This is a very interesting thread to me.  I made up my sniffer with a tube Friday night at work.  I am now acquiring all the electronic "giblets" to build my own meter.  It has been a long time since I have bought electronic components; the place I always bought my electronic components before has gone out of business.  So I figure what the heck, I will go to Radio Shack and see what they have.  The guys in there ask if they can help me and I say "Yes, do you sell electronic components?" and they say "Of course we do!"  I asked for a L.E.D. bar graph and a LM3914 or R.S. equivalent and they both looked at me like monkeys doing a math problem!  I had the rest of the parts hanging around.  I'll let everyone know how it turns out after I get it built.  Keep it going.  Later, Calvin.

Crazycalvin,
You're very welcome.  I bought my parts from one of the local industrial electronics distributors, much less than the usual retail sources.  May I ask, why are you using a sniffer if you're using a meter?  Are you planning to use it on bikes without 02 sensors?

Evo, my bike is '06 Deuce.  I do not have bungs welded to my pipes, nor do I plan on welding them into my pipes.  I just am experimenting right now.  I wanted to build a sniffer to put up the pipe of the bike and then an indicating device (the meter itself) to indicate what the sniffer might be seeing.  All in all, my bike runs pretty good, averages 40 to 43 mpg, plugs look good, no pinging, and starts well.  I used a SEST to get me to the point I am at now.  So I figured I would experiment and see what happens.  I figure if I make an error, I can load in the previous map saved ( I am anal about only making one change at a time, noting the change, and saving the file with new revision number).

Crazycalvin,
Well that certainly makes sense.  As a fun experiment, you might pick up a set of late model head pipes with the 02 bungs from a late model deuce (others may fit).  I suspect your dealer has whole sets of takeoffs laying around you could get cheap or, as in my case, for nothing.  Might even find some in the htt swap section.